Annulment or paulene privilege

[Lypher]

inaccurate and probably not relevant to OP’s case.
he should see his priest and watch out for less than helpful general information in a forum like this

Annie is right…

I am not even confirmed and I can tell you a lot of BAD and IGNORANT advice has been provided. According to the below you need to see a Local Ordinary who will follow Cannon law to make the determination. The fact that you were both un-baptized is a BIG deal…

vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P44.HTM

 

[Seatuck]

My SIL was married in the Lutheran church and, when she researched this, the diocese said that her annulment would have to be done in the Lutheran church since that church had officiated over the marriage. She is Catholic and the Church did not recognize her marriage at the time.

If something has changed, I’m sorry for the misinformation. This was current about 8 years ago. As I have stated over and over - GO SEE THE PRIEST. Everyone here is making judgments from the limited information posted and their limited knowledge.

Since when does the Lutheran church have a marriage tribunal?

 

[cameron_lansing]

My SIL was married in the Lutheran church and, when she researched this, the diocese said that her annulment would have to be done in the Lutheran church since that church had officiated over the marriage. She is Catholic and the Church did not recognize her marriage at the time.

If something has changed, I’m sorry for the misinformation. This was current about 8 years ago. As I have stated over and over - GO SEE THE PRIEST. Everyone here is making judgments from the limited information posted and their limited knowledge.

Unfortunately, someone was misinformed and communicated this error to you. The marriage laws of the Catholic Church have not changed in the past eight years (and I say that as a canon lawyer). The Catholic Church would never have recognized some “annulment . . .done in the Lutheran church.” The closest practice that even resembles the Catholic nullity process is found in a “loosening of bond” in the Orthodox Churches, and we do not accept that. We retry those cases.

Indeed as noted, the poster is best advised to take the details to the parish priest.

It is also advisable to keep in mind that non Catholics, unless impeded by divine law (the existence of a prior valid bond of marriage and certain forms of consanguinity) or they fail to marry according to the required form of their religious community (and only the Orthodox require sacred form for the validity of marriage), are capable of valid marriages between themselves.

 

[Just_Lurking]

Actually I was approved to receive the Pauline privilege before I was engaged, however it is not invoked until after you are baptized and then at the time of your new Christian marriage, your previous natural marriage is dissolved.

Thanks for the correction! Did you obtain a “generic” approval good for marrying any Catholic, or did you have to supply the name of the specific Catholic that you were considering marrying?

For example, the form for the archdiocese of Los Angeles (see here) asks for the name of the Catholic you wish to marry.

 

[hamjeepr]

Unfortunately, someone was misinformed and communicated this error to you. The marriage laws of the Catholic Church have not changed in the past eight years (and I say that as a canon lawyer). The Catholic Church would never have recognized some “annulment . . .done in the Lutheran church.” The closest practice that even resembles the Catholic nullity process is found in a “loosening of bond” in the Orthodox Churches, and we do not accept that. We retry those cases.

Indeed as noted, the poster is best advised to take the details to the parish priest.

It is also advisable to keep in mind that non Catholics, unless impeded by divine law (the existence of a prior valid bond of marriage and certain forms of consanguinity) or they fail to marry according to the required form of their religious community (and only the Orthodox require sacred form for the validity of marriage), are capable of valid marriages between themselves.

Thank you Deacon. Newbie10, I apologize for any misleading information I have presented. It made sense to me what she had been told and I passed it on.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

He would still need an annulment (deceleration of nullity) in this case since the church recognizes the marriages of non-catholics so long as they are legally married. In the case of 2 unbaptized persons as a valid natural marriage and would still need to be investigated to have it declared invalid.

Not exactly. If the Pauline Privelege is used then the natural valid marriage is dissolved.
An annulment says that a valid marriage never existed whereas the Pauline or Petrine Privelege says that the valid marriage did exist but that the Church dissolves it.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

My SIL was married in the Lutheran church and, when she researched this, the diocese said that her annulment would have to be done in the Lutheran church since that church had officiated over the marriage. She is Catholic and the Church did not recognize her marriage at the time.

Your SIL misunderstood what the diocese told her. If she’s a Catholic who attempted marriage in the Lutheran Church without permission then her marriage is considered invalid by the Catholic Church. There is no need for an annulment since the Church doesn’t recognize that the marriage was valid in the first place.

An annulment is a process that declares a marriage that was previous believed to be valid never was. In your SIL’s case the Church never considered it valid to begin with.

 

[mswood]

Not exactly. If the Pauline Privelege is used then the natural valid marriage is dissolved.
An annulment says that a valid marriage never existed whereas the Pauline or Petrine Privelege says that the valid marriage did exist but that the Church dissolves it.

I realized that if the OP receives a Pualine Privelege that it dissolves a valid natural marriage since I received one myself. However, I was responding to a poster that stated only people in sacramental marriages need annulments, which is not true. Everyone that has a previous marriag can receive an annulment (assuming the evidence shows that marriage was invalid), and all must have their previous marriage resolved (through one of the Privelges or through a decleration of nullity) before they can marry in the church.

 

[mswood]

Thanks for the correction! Did you obtain a “generic” approval good for marrying any Catholic, or did you have to supply the name of the specific Catholic that you were considering marrying?

For example, the form for the archdiocese of Los Angeles (see here) asks for the name of the Catholic you wish to marry.

I believe that my priest did list my fiancee on the papers even though we where not engaged, however the approval letter I received simply said I am cnosidered free to marry in the church and at the time of my new Christian marriage my previous marriage would be dissolved, it did not state who I had to marry.

 

[puzzleannie]

My SIL was married in the Lutheran church and, when she researched this, the diocese said that her annulment would have to be done in the Lutheran church since that church had officiated over the marriage. She is Catholic and the Church did not recognize her marriage at the time.

If .

either she misunderstood what she was told, or got that advice from someone who is ignorant of the procedure, or there is a lot more to the story. Anectodal stories, are almost never helpful for an individual wondering about their own personal situation. Nobody is making judgements, we cannot do that here, that is the whole point.