Annulments/support group

[dans0622]

I understand that I am not the only one to go through this and it is worse for many people. I was simply asking what it means that the information was sent to the judge for a review. I was also commenting on the fact I am a bit frustrated that when I jump through all their hoops to try to get information on where my case is, I get a form letter that tells me nothing. Would it kill them to say what it means to have been sent to a judge for review? Would it kill them to say there are 10 cases ahead of mine, or 100 or 1000? The only way I can get information is to send them a certified letter and when I do that, I get nothing in return but a form letter. I don’t think it is too much to ask to be treated like a real person and told real information.

Hello,

You’re right, that’s not too much to ask.

As for what “sent to the judge for a review” means, my guess (and it is only a guess, since this is not a procedural step you’ll see in the law itself) is that it means the case was waiting for the judge to decide if all the available and needed information is present in the file or not.

If it is, then the case would proceed to “publication” (the evidence could be viewed by the Petitioner and Respondent). If it is not, then the judge would have to try to obtain the evidence that he thinks is still needed and available.

Dan

 

[cdb64]

Mine took 18 months, only to have a negative finding, meaning the Church still considers me married to my ex. It is very impersonal and emotionally invasive. Its also a very sterile process.

I’m refilling under different grounds. I have a priest, 2 decons, and a sponsor assisting this time. Its still frustrating and very impersonal. I don’t feel that I’m getting the help I need. As far as healing goes, this has not helped. Reliving 23 years of a bad marriage, and sharing more detail than you would with a priest, to some anonymous panel that you may or may not know. Its terrible!!!

If the second attempt is rejected, I’m told there is some type of Pastoral Intersession (nuclear option). I have no idea how that works.

Good luck, and hang in there!!

The tribunal does not seek the truth. It is up to you to put forward the truth. You have to coach your witnesses to address specifically what they can about your case. The tribunal will not seek or ask specific questions. Everything is generic.

Find a sponsor that will be PROACTIVE with the tribunal. If you don’t, they will only treat you as generically as the from letters they communicate with.

I don’t know if I can hang with the Church much longer after this experience. Even if its a positive result 18 to 24 months from now, I don’t know if I will still be with the Church. I’m engaged and plan remarry regardless.

 

[Peebo]

Mine took 18 months, only to have a negative finding, meaning the Church still considers me married to my ex. It is very impersonal and emotionally invasive. Its also a very sterile process.

I’m refilling under different grounds. I have a priest, 2 decons, and a sponsor assisting this time. Its still frustrating and very impersonal. I don’t feel that I’m getting the help I need. As far as healing goes, this has not helped. Reliving 23 years of a bad marriage, and sharing more detail than you would with a priest, to some anonymous panel that you may or may not know. Its terrible!!!

If the second attempt is rejected, I’m told there is some type of Pastoral Intersession (nuclear option). I have no idea how that works.

Good luck, and hang in there!!

The tribunal does not seek the truth. It is up to you to put forward the truth. You have to coach your witnesses to address specifically what they can about your case. The tribunal will not seek or ask specific questions. Everything is generic.

Find a sponsor that will be PROACTIVE with the tribunal. If you don’t, they will only treat you as generically as the from letters they communicate with.

I don’t know if I can hang with the Church much longer after this experience. Even if its a positive result 18 to 24 months from now, I don’t know if I will still be with the Church. I’m engaged and plan remarry regardless.

I’m sorry for you…I know from my wifes annulment how traumatic the whole process can be…fortunately she received a positive outcome…we have just finished our rosary and asked our Blessed Mother to intercede for you that she would bring your anguish before our Blessed Lord and Savior…God Bless

 

[rose2]

I would always say to anyone do not let other people come between you and the Lord.
I am still waiting for the rota to hopefully confirm the decision of the appeal tribunal, having first asked for an appeal nearly 3 years ago now. However having married in the meantime in a civil marriage with a blessing in a private Anglican chapel we look forward to the day when our marriage can be convalidated. In the meantime our Bishop agreed for my husband to receive the sacraments of initiation which has been a great joy to us.
In my particular situation I have never been refused communion or reconciliation. It must be very difficult for those who have.
Rose x

 

[His_helpmeet]

I would always say to anyone do not let other people come between you and the Lord.
I am still waiting for the rota to hopefully confirm the decision of the appeal tribunal, having first asked for an appeal nearly 3 years ago now. However having married in the meantime in a civil marriage with a blessing in a private Anglican chapel we look forward to the day when our marriage can be convalidated. In the meantime our Bishop agreed for my husband to receive the sacraments of initiation which has been a great joy to us.
In my particular situation I have never been refused communion or reconciliation. It must be very difficult for those who have.
Rose x

If you are living in a normal marital relationship with your husband you cannot receive Holy Communion. You are considered to be living in a state of adultery, because you are not validly married to your husband.

 

[rose2]

That is the letter of the law and it is good to recognise that a valid marriage is important.

 

[Corhaesito]

I’m truly torn. I’ve been separated for 18 months, married for 28 years, 5 kids, only one under 18. Without going into minute detail, there was fault on both our parts, I admit mine, and have been taking steps to fix the “broken” parts in myself. She thinks all our problems are with me and will not admit to any faults in the marriage, in fact insisting that always and everywhere she only worked for the good of the marriage.

A counselor has advised me that resuming a common life with someone who lacks the capacity for critical self-examination, as my wife seems to would be harmful. There was also some violence perpetrated by my wife against me and one of our children. We sent her out of state for counselling, with the result that the Catholic therapist said she couldn’t help my wife because she would not reveal any of her own issues, and just complained about me. This therapist mentioned the possibility of grounds for a declaration of nullity possibly existing.

Our pastor, who knows us both well, believes we both brought serious issues into our marriage, which prevented us from really bonding and being able to resolve conflict. My Christian, non-Catholic counselor (who has done reports for the tribunal) agrees, and says in his experience my issues alone were enough to negate the marriage.

Our pastor, while agreeing about all these problems, disagrees that divorce and annulment are solutions, has advised me that I will harbor guilt forever at emotionally abandoning my wife, and since nullity declarations are not infallible, he fears for my soul.He says my sole duty in life is to work at repairing the marriage and honoring the vow we took.

Now I struggle with knowing that I probably could get an annulment, but I also wonder if I’d be doing it for the right reasons, and if reliance on the process excuses my fault if the annulment really is incorrect.

Has anyone else struggled with conscience over this? The idea that since the diocese could be wrong about nullity (and maybe even careless about granting them in some instances), I would still bear the moral burden of adultery if I remarried, since I had doubts about the genuiness of the nullity? My wife will never concede we did not have a sacramental marriage, no matter what a tribunal says, and will argue that to our children also. What if she’s right and the tribunal is wrong?

Thoughts? Or helpful resources? Thanks in advance.

 

[kristis524]

I’m truly torn. I’ve been separated for 18 months, married for 28 years, 5 kids, only one under 18. Without going into minute detail, there was fault on both our parts, I admit mine, and have been taking steps to fix the “broken” parts in myself. She thinks all our problems are with me and will not admit to any faults in the marriage, in fact insisting that always and everywhere she only worked for the good of the marriage.

A counselor has advised me that resuming a common life with someone who lacks the capacity for critical self-examination, as my wife seems to would be harmful. There was also some violence perpetrated by my wife against me and one of our children. We sent her out of state for counselling, with the result that the Catholic therapist said she couldn’t help my wife because she would not reveal any of her own issues, and just complained about me. This therapist mentioned the possibility of grounds for a declaration of nullity possibly existing.

Our pastor, who knows us both well, believes we both brought serious issues into our marriage, which prevented us from really bonding and being able to resolve conflict. My Christian, non-Catholic counselor (who has done reports for the tribunal) agrees, and says in his experience my issues alone were enough to negate the marriage.

Our pastor, while agreeing about all these problems, disagrees that divorce and annulment are solutions, has advised me that I will harbor guilt forever at emotionally abandoning my wife, and since nullity declarations are not infallible, he fears for my soul.He says my sole duty in life is to work at repairing the marriage and honoring the vow we took.

Now I struggle with knowing that I probably could get an annulment, but I also wonder if I’d be doing it for the right reasons, and if reliance on the process excuses my fault if the annulment really is incorrect.

Has anyone else struggled with conscience over this? The idea that since the diocese could be wrong about nullity (and maybe even careless about granting them in some instances), I would still bear the moral burden of adultery if I remarried, since I had doubts about the genuiness of the nullity? My wife will never concede we did not have a sacramental marriage, no matter what a tribunal says, and will argue that to our children also. What if she’s right and the tribunal is wrong?

Thoughts? Or helpful resources? Thanks in advance.

I am not an expert or anything, I’m just a nobody who does the best I can to please God, so I apologize if you wanted an answer from someone who has greater knowledge or authority.
I would spend some time in Adoration and earnestly pray about it. Nobody can tell you what you should or should not do and be infallible, all you can do is pray earnestly seeking wisdom and do what you honestly believe to be God’s will. I think if you do that, God’s grace will be with you.

I wish you the best in this struggle and I will keep you in my prayers. My heart goes out to you

 

[Peebo]

I’m truly torn. I’ve been separated for 18 months, married for 28 years, 5 kids, only one under 18. Without going into minute detail, there was fault on both our parts, I admit mine, and have been taking steps to fix the “broken” parts in myself. She thinks all our problems are with me and will not admit to any faults in the marriage, in fact insisting that always and everywhere she only worked for the good of the marriage.

A counselor has advised me that resuming a common life with someone who lacks the capacity for critical self-examination, as my wife seems to would be harmful. There was also some violence perpetrated by my wife against me and one of our children. We sent her out of state for counselling, with the result that the Catholic therapist said she couldn’t help my wife because she would not reveal any of her own issues, and just complained about me. This therapist mentioned the possibility of grounds for a declaration of nullity possibly existing.

Our pastor, who knows us both well, believes we both brought serious issues into our marriage, which prevented us from really bonding and being able to resolve conflict. My Christian, non-Catholic counselor (who has done reports for the tribunal) agrees, and says in his experience my issues alone were enough to negate the marriage.

Our pastor, while agreeing about all these problems, disagrees that divorce and annulment are solutions, has advised me that I will harbor guilt forever at emotionally abandoning my wife, and since nullity declarations are not infallible, he fears for my soul.He says my sole duty in life is to work at repairing the marriage and honoring the vow we took.

Now I struggle with knowing that I probably could get an annulment, but I also wonder if I’d be doing it for the right reasons, and if reliance on the process excuses my fault if the annulment really is incorrect.

Has anyone else struggled with conscience over this? The idea that since the diocese could be wrong about nullity (and maybe even careless about granting them in some instances), I would still bear the moral burden of adultery if I remarried, since I had doubts about the genuiness of the nullity? My wife will never concede we did not have a sacramental marriage, no matter what a tribunal says, and will argue that to our children also. What if she’s right and the tribunal is wrong?

Thoughts? Or helpful resources? Thanks in advance.

An annulment is concerning what were the circumstances at the time of your marriage…if it was a valid marriage or not…I don’t think you can claim grounds for annulment for events that happen later on in your marriage…also not sure what your pastor meant by saying an annulment is not infallable??..does that mean the church may be condemning a persons immortal soul by granting an annulment to an innocent person…I don’t believe that…there is someone who comes here who will be able to set you straight…his name is Dan…good luck

 

[rose2]

Although a tribunal can look at the evidence and come to a reasonable judgement and others like your priest can give you good advice, in the end only you , your wife and God know the reality of your situation. Did you ever have a marriage, if so can it be reclaimed? Listen to your conscience and to God, think about the possible outcomes for you and your family. What example are you giving to your children by staying together or by parting? When you have thought of these things lay them before the Lord, and ask for his assistance. May the Holy Spirit guide you and bless you. Rose

 

[dans0622]

I’m truly torn. …Now I struggle with knowing that I probably could get an annulment, but I also wonder if I’d be doing it for the right reasons, and if reliance on the process excuses my fault if the annulment really is incorrect.

Has anyone else struggled with conscience over this? The idea that since the diocese could be wrong about nullity (and maybe even careless about granting them in some instances), I would still bear the moral burden of adultery if I remarried, since I had doubts about the genuiness of the nullity? My wife will never concede we did not have a sacramental marriage, no matter what a tribunal says, and will argue that to our children also. What if she’s right and the tribunal is wrong?

Thoughts? Or helpful resources? Thanks in advance.

Hello,

I can’t offer practical advice as to what you should do but will offer the following points:

1. The fallibility of the Judge is no reason to pursue (or not) a nullity case. No Judge, other than God, is infallible in his judgments. Nevertheless, we would not hesitate to approach a civil court if circumstances warrant it, even though that Judge could make the wrong decision.
2. If you are honest with the Judge, and the decision is based on true evidence, then you would not bear any fault for an incorrect decision.
3. Wondering “what if” they are wrong and I’m right or I’m wrong and they are right doesn’t really get anywhere. Again, if you decide to present a case (which is your right), all you can do is simply present accurate evidence and let everyone else (witnesses and the other Party) do the same.
4. You have the right to present a case. Whether you do that or not is entirely up to you.

Dan

 

[rose2]

Thank you Dan repeating that we have that right is so helpful. Like many on here I have been highly criticised by family and friends for using that right. I was married in the Church and so I have the right to turn to the Church for guidance and justice. Those who are now wanting to be fully a part of the Church have that right also. Rose

 

[Chewy66]

I am starting this new Annulments/support group for Catholics who are appyling for a Catholic annulment. I am using the word Annulments so people can easily find this topic.
There are several of us who have applied and gotten our nullity of marriage. Some are still waiting for an answer from their Catholic Tribunal Office.
We don’t know everything about the nullity of marriage but we do know how to answer some questions and be very supportive of your questions and situations.

I want to be helpful to others and this is why I have started this thread. LaLucia

Thanks for starting this group. I just turned in my paperwork to my local parish. I have the first initial appointment on Friday. I’m hoping to find some answers from anyone concerning how long they had to wait for their anullment? Also, has anyone ever encountered a spouse who refused to get the marriage blessed in the CC?

 

[kristis524]

Thanks for starting this group. I just turned in my paperwork to my local parish. I have the first initial appointment on Friday. I’m hoping to find some answers from anyone concerning how long they had to wait for their anullment? Also, has anyone ever encountered a spouse who refused to get the marriage blessed in the CC?

I am sure you will get answers from people who have completed the process that will be more helpful, but I started the process in August 2015 and have not completed it nor do I know where it is in the ‘process’. My diocese is NOT good with communication (even when you ask). I hope yours is, but be prepared to bring your patience

 

[dans0622]

Thanks for starting this group. I just turned in my paperwork to my local parish. I have the first initial appointment on Friday. I’m hoping to find some answers from anyone concerning how long they had to wait for their anullment? Also, has anyone ever encountered a spouse who refused to get the marriage blessed in the CC?

Hello,

Really, it depends on the case itself, the Parties and witnesses and the Tribunal. The process from acceptance of a petition to decision should not take more than one year. It can, and often does, take less time than that but it can also take more.

Regarding the second question–that happens. It’s something to discuss with a local priest but would not be a practical concern until if/when the declaration of nullity is obtained.

Dan

 

[His_helpmeet]

Thanks for starting this group. I just turned in my paperwork to my local parish. I have the first initial appointment on Friday. I’m hoping to find some answers from anyone concerning how long they had to wait for their anullment? Also, has anyone ever encountered a spouse who refused to get the marriage blessed in the CC?

Hubby’s case took about 16-18 months, as I recall. (Keep in mind that an appeal was still required at that time so that’s including the appeal time.)

As Dan says, there are options if your spouse does not want a formal ceremony. But the reality is you’re really putting the cart before the horse. Get your declaration of nullity first, and once your first marriage is found to be invalid, THEN you can start talking about options to have your current marriage validated.

 

[EvelynEVF]

Chewy66, I’m a terrible outlier, in that my case tool six years and four months in the first instance, and now has been appealed to Rome. The good news for you is that if your ex spouse does not contest the petition, your case will move much more quickly In my diocese, an uncontested case with really quick witness response can be done in 18 months.

 

[Chewy66]

Hello,

Really, it depends on the case itself, the Parties and witnesses and the Tribunal. The process from acceptance of a petition to decision should not take more than one year. It can, and often does, take less time than that but it can also take more.

Regarding the second question–that happens. It’s something to discuss with a local priest but would not be a practical concern until if/when the declaration of nullity is obtained.

Dan

I’m going to give it some time to see what happens when the annulment is obtained. I’ve spent the last 17 years away from the church so I’m sure it’s going to be a wait in order to get back into the church.

 

[Katheresa]

Hello there,

My husband and I are in the process of having his first marriage annulled. Our most recent communication from our diocese said that our case is on the Judge’s list for a final decision. Does anyone have any idea how long a case stays on the Judge’s list?

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for creating this group.

Best,
Kathryn

 

[kristis524]

Mine has been ‘on the judge’s list’ for 7 months and every time I check that is the answer I get. I have asked for clarification only to be told it is ‘on the judge’s list’.

I know the process is supposed to take a year or less now that it does not require an automatic appeal, but mine (which does not require that appeal) has been going on 14 months and counting.

I am not remarried nor am I planning to so it is possible (even though the diocese says it doesn’t matter) that my case is being pushed back because they don’t consider it ‘urgent’