Hello,My case was referred to the Rota in Rome two years ago. I originally applied in 2010 I put in for an appeal in 2013 and in 2014 was told the appeal was successful. The father of my children ( I cannot call him even an ex husband) has now died. I know we can now have our marriage convalidated but i would still like to receive a decision. will this still happen?
So, the case is still active/ongoing. Does the Rota even know that the Respondent has died? If not, it would be good for you to inform your advocate and, at the same time, inform him/her that you want the case to continue nevertheless.…I have not heard from the rota since 2015 when they told me they had assigned someone to my case. I emailed him twice to find out how things were progressing the first time he assured me he was working on my behalf the second time which was in March he told me they were waiting for the psychologists report.
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Sorry if I did not make that clear, the affirmative decision was from the local court it then was sent to the Rota.
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Thats good to know what would constitute a legitimate interest other than giving me closure on a very difficult time in my life and upholding the decisions I had to make?
I thought you might be interested to know that the judge has agreed to let the case go to judgement. that was in November so i am still waiting to hear. I am grateful that I will eventually have an answer. We have had our marriage convalidated in the meantime which we are very pleased about. It is great to be considered valid after 2 years of not being so and nearly 7 years since the case first started. Although 18 months of that was my delay in making the appeal as I did not think i would be seeking marriage. I do offer prayers for other cases waiting and thankful for the changes Pope Frances has made to ease the way where possible. Rose xSo, the case is still active/ongoing. Does the Rota even know that the Respondent has died? If not, it would be good for you to inform your advocate and, at the same time, inform him/her that you want the case to continue nevertheless.
What constitutes a “legitimate interest”? I can’t say that I know how that phrase is interpreted/applied. In my opinion, you have a legitimate interest in the outcome of the case…but my opinion is pretty much useless.
Dan
Willful exclusion of children is grounds for an annulment. Canon 1102 section 2Might I ask you whether there might be grounds for an annulment in my situation?
My girlfriend (a protestant) got divorced after nine years. She and her ex-husband contracepted. At some point in their marriage he told her he did not want any children with her. I understand that the issue had never been made explicit before that.
I want to marry her. In the church. Would we have a case?
First of all, you need to see this from the Catholic point of view. Cohabitating outside the bonds of marriage is a grave sin, it prevents a Catholic from receiving Holy Communion. If she marries you and you do not have the annulment, the marriage is, in the eyes of the Church not valid and she will not be allowed to receive Holy Communion.I need you folks.
I grew up protestant United Methodist, was pretty serious about faith (acolyte, usher, youth board member at my church). Got married in the (protestant) church at 21, my spouse’s father was the officiant. Things changed throughout my 20’s, and I progressively grew further and further away from the church, was seriously considering whether I was a Christian or not, and then at 30 my wife left me. It was completely devastating to me…I spent awhile at rock bottom, went though a great deal of introspection and growth and learning, and sort of came out an athiest Buddhist a few years later.
A few years after that, I am engaged to a Catholic (we actually have a child together), and she wants to get married in the church. I go to mass with her and I try to be supportive of her faith.
…but I’m really really struggling with the annulment thing. I didn’t have any children in my first marriage, so everyone just tells me (almost matter of factly) to apply for an annulment with willful exclusion of children. I take this stuff kind of seriously, maybe too seriously, and I don’t feel like I honestly fit any grounds for annulment. It would be easier to do this if I felt that I honestly fit one of these criteria, but I don’t. And it’s really hurtful to sort of declare that my first marriage was not valid, because I think my spouse and I entered into it with knowing and right intent.
I’ve mentioned to my fiance that maybe we could get married outside of the Catholic church, but I think to her that is sort of like saying lets not get married at all.
It feels a bit like a catch 22. The annulment process feels (from my point of view) dishonest, unloving, and hurtful. People say it will show that I really love her. Well, I do love her very much. I’m willing to go through the motions and claim “willful exclusion of children”, but just thinking about it leaves me feeling like I have a pit in my stomach.
I’m not sure what I’m looking for…advice, a pat on the back? Maybe I just needed to put this out there. I feel pretty isolated.
We’re already experiencing that, because I’m supporting her and our child. We’re really attempting to do our best with the situation I think. It’s difficult to wrap my mind around coming from the inclusive world of the United Methodists. I guess I didn’t realize that marriage outside of the Catholic Church is essentially the same thing as not getting married at all (in the Catholic point of view). So, it seems like we have one way forward if we’re going to remain together with our child (I’m certain she is going to remain Catholic above all else).First of all, you need to see this from the Catholic point of view. Cohabitating outside the bonds of marriage is a grave sin, it prevents a Catholic from receiving Holy Communion. If she marries you and you do not have the annulment, the marriage is, in the eyes of the Church not valid and she will not be allowed to receive Holy Communion.
This has been my problem I think. I’ve really not found the right person to talk to. I’ve talked to the advocate at her parish, and the answers I’ve been given are pretty short and matter of fact. “Here’s the brochure and some forms, good luck!” I’m kind of struggling with this…looking over these criteria, trying to understand the criteria (and I’m not really one to shy away from theology or Canon law)…but it’s difficult when it’s something so personally and deeply meaningful. It’s more than facts and evidence, there is a huge component of intention, and I do want to be thoroughly honest about my intentions as I can be.To be a valid marriage, your first marriage must meet certain criteria. If there was not a willful exclusion of children, please don’t say that there was just to get an annulment. The Church does not encourage dishonesty. But, please make sure you understand what the willful exclusion of children means in the annulment process. There are other grounds for annulment in addition to different types of petitions. Talk to her parish priest, he can put you in touch with an advocate who can discuss your options with you as well as explain what an annulment is and is not, what it means and what it does not mean.
I understand your feelings and I respect you for them, but please speak with an advocate. It doesn’t cost anything but time and it may clear up some misconceptions you didn’t realize you had.
I wish you the best
I wonder if it would help you to understand the process this way:We’re already experiencing that, because I’m supporting her and our child. We’re really attempting to do our best with the situation I think. It’s difficult to wrap my mind around coming from the inclusive world of the United Methodists. I guess I didn’t realize that marriage outside of the Catholic Church is essentially the same thing as not getting married at all (in the Catholic point of view). So, it seems like we have one way forward if we’re going to remain together with our child (I’m certain she is going to remain Catholic above all else).
This has been my problem I think. I’ve really not found the right person to talk to. I’ve talked to the advocate at her parish, and the answers I’ve been given are pretty short and matter of fact. “Here’s the brochure and some forms, good luck!” I’m kind of struggling with this…looking over these criteria, trying to understand the criteria (and I’m not really one to shy away from theology or Canon law)…but it’s difficult when it’s something so personally and deeply meaningful. It’s more than facts and evidence, there is a huge component of intention, and I do want to be thoroughly honest about my intentions as I can be.
I’ve reached out to a couple people in the past, including her priest, and the communication has sort of died. I suspect that it wasn’t intentional and these people are very busy, but it’s intimidating as a non-Catholic to sort of be assertive in asking for help. I guess I just have to push myself to do that, because I have fairly complex questions that are probably best presented face to face with someone who is familiar with the process.
I appreciate your response. It does help me to think through this and help me find the right path forward. Thank you!
From a purely academic standpoint, I would be interested to hear the Judges’ reasoning for allowing the case to continue…not that I disagree with it. Not at all. But, as I said earlier, I am not sure how that decision is made in practice.I thought you might be interested to know that the judge has agreed to let the case go to judgement. that was in November so i am still waiting to hear. I am grateful that I will eventually have an answer. We have had our marriage convalidated in the meantime which we are very pleased about. It is great to be considered valid after 2 years of not being so and nearly 7 years since the case first started. Although 18 months of that was my delay in making the appeal as I did not think i would be seeking marriage. I do offer prayers for other cases waiting and thankful for the changes Pope Frances has made to ease the way where possible. Rose x
Hello,Might I ask you whether there might be grounds for an annulment in my situation?
My girlfriend (a protestant) got divorced after nine years. She and her ex-husband contracepted. At some point in their marriage he told her he did not want any children with her. I understand that the issue had never been made explicit before that.
I want to marry her. In the church. Would we have a case?
Hello,…
I’m not sure what I’m looking for…advice, a pat on the back? Maybe I just needed to put this out there. I feel pretty isolated.
I get very little information from my Advocate so it is hard to know what the judges reason is. I asked for a decision on the grounds of It being important for me to have closure and also to know after all this time that the decisions I made for my salvation have been ratified by the Church. Without a decision I feel I and my family are left not knowing how we can view the past in order to understand fully all that we have been through and to be able to lay this all to rest.From a purely academic standpoint, I would be interested to hear the Judges’ reasoning for allowing the case to continue…not that I disagree with it. Not at all. But, as I said earlier, I am not sure how that decision is made in practice.
Dan
Ha. “I wrote it in latin…” I’m sure that scored some points.I get very little information from my Advocate so it is hard to know what the judges reason is. I asked for a decision on the grounds of It being important for me to have closure and also to know after all this time that the decisions I made for my salvation have been ratified by the Church. Without a decision I feel I and my family are left not knowing how we can view the past in order to understand fully all that we have been through and to be able to lay this all to rest.
I also pointed out that if it had not been for the delays that took place before my advocate was appointed I believe the rota might already have given us their decision.
I also said I believe it would be helpful for my sons to understand the nature of a true marriage and to know that the behaviour they will have seen in their father is not compatible with a valid marriage.
The reply I got was:
I have good news for you.
I spoke to the Judge about your willingness to obtain a decision for your marriage so he gave permission the write the “decision”, that’s the final Act in your favour.
I wrote it in latin and now we’re just waiting for the sentence on the validity of your marriage.
So there we are
Rose2