Annulments

[TryingToConvert]

Hello All!

I was wondering if anyone had any advice on my situation. I was married to a Brazilian immigrant over 13 years ago. I was Southern Baptist at the time. He was Catholic (not practicing). We are trying to work together to get my documentation for annulment but he has been deployed. There have been numerous requests to the Archdiocese in Brazil (Natal) where he was baptized but there has been no response. The Deacon at my church has sent the requests along with the Archdiocese. I do not speak Brazilian Portuguese to try to communicate with the Archdiocese in Brazil or the church he was baptized in. Does anyone have any ideas that may work in obtaining his baptismal certificate? I am stuck and the case has not moved in over half a year. Any advice is appreciated.
I have went through the RCIA process and have put my wedding on hold. I am frustrated and saddened that I can not communicate with the church in Brazil to get any results. I know something must be done to get the process moving again.

God Bless!

 

[atassina]

I am going through an annulment now. I was married in the Church in Mexico. The woman I was civilly married to is now living in Mexico. My annulment was moved to the Diocese of Los Angeles because the majority of witnesses are there. See what you can do.

 

[PhilotheaZ]

I’m no expert, but will one of the following work?

• Contact the church where he was baptized, rather than the Archdiocese. If he or one of his relatives knows the name of the church, you may be able to find contact information here: masstimes.org/dotnet/showchurches.aspx?type=CITYRADIUS&q=&country=Brazil&city=natal&countrycode=BR&statecode=
• Find someone who knows Portuguese to make contact for you; perhaps those on the receiving end did not understand the request.
• I think that, in lieu of a baptism certificate, the written testimony of witnesses who were present at his baptism may suffice. Can his parents, godparents, or other relatives provide this? (Ask your pastor what form this should take.)

 

[RexMaximvs]

i would respectfully suggest that you inquire about the need for an annulment. you as a non-catholic married a catholic, albeit a non-practicing one, in - i assume a civil ceremony. on the face of it, if those facts are correct, you are not and never were married in the eyes of the church. if that is true, an annulment is unnecessary. a baptized catholic married outside of the sacrament of marriage is not married in the eyes of the church. same is true for baptized catholics married outside of the church. best to communicate directly with your pastor (assuming that he is up to speed on cannon law) or a priest who is a cannon lawyer. you may have been getting inaccurate information.

 

[Seatuck]

i would respectfully suggest that you inquire about the need for an annulment. you as a non-catholic married a catholic, albeit a non-practicing one, in - i assume a civil ceremony. on the face of it, if those facts are correct, you are not and never were married in the eyes of the church. if that is true, an annulment is unnecessary. a baptized catholic married outside of the sacrament of marriage is not married in the eyes of the church. same is true for baptized catholics married outside of the church. best to communicate directly with your pastor (assuming that he is up to speed on cannon law) or a priest who is a cannon lawyer. you may have been getting inaccurate information.

She needs his baptismal certificate to prove that the marriage was invalid since she as a non catholic could have married validly in a civil marriage but he as a Catholic could not. Understand?

 

[RexMaximvs]

i certainly do understand. do you? if these facts are correct an annulment is not necessary. it seems clear that the questioner is seeking an annulment.

 

[kage_ar]

Have you talked directly to YOUR Diocese, the Tribunal Office?

The reason I ask, we have a small Diocese, our Diocese has contacts at the University to have translators when needed. This kind of thing does come up, this is not the first international paperwork your Diocese has needed.

Talk to your Diocese directly.

 

[JulianN]

i certainly do understand. do you? if these facts are correct an annulment is not necessary. it seems clear that the questioner is seeking an annulment.

It sounds as if her fiance is seeking a declaration of nullity for lack of form. In order to do that, a current baptismal certificate is needed to show that the petitioner was a baptized Catholic who did not follow the prescribed form for marriage.

I agree with the suggestion to contact the parish church where the petitioner was baptized – records of baptism are often not kept at the diocesan level.

Good luck!

 

[TryingToConvert]

i would respectfully suggest that you inquire about the need for an annulment. you as a non-catholic married a catholic, albeit a non-practicing one, in - i assume a civil ceremony. on the face of it, if those facts are correct, you are not and never were married in the eyes of the church. if that is true, an annulment is unnecessary. a baptized catholic married outside of the sacrament of marriage is not married in the eyes of the church. same is true for baptized catholics married outside of the church. best to communicate directly with your pastor (assuming that he is up to speed on cannon law) or a priest who is a cannon lawyer. you may have been getting inaccurate information.

First, thank you for your response! The Deacon said they require my ex-husband’s baptismal certificate in order to prove my ex-husband WAS Catholic in order to get my annulment granted due to lack of form.There is a bit of question as to my ex-husband being baptized Catholic. His mother told him she got him baptized informally by a priest living next to the Catholic church where they had been living.The information is vague without any idea of when his baptism may have occurred and if there is even a record of it. We are “assuming” that since the Priest lived right next to the church, that he must have been attached to it thus the baptism being a Catholic baptism…I know it is a leap but makes sense.Brazil is primarily Catholic, more when my ex was born than today.Now, I am unable to reach my ex to get more details which are being asked for.

 

[TryingToConvert]

Have you talked directly to YOUR Diocese, the Tribunal Office?

The reason I ask, we have a small Diocese, our Diocese has contacts at the University to have translators when needed. This kind of thing does come up, this is not the first international paperwork your Diocese has needed.

Talk to your Diocese directly.

I am worried of interfering with the case too much honestly. I have only done research to try to find a way to get the case moving. My next step was going to be to contact the person in charge of my case at my church to consult with him about what to do next. I have recently emailed him asking if it would be ok to hire someone local to be a translator.Thanks for the information because it really makes sense that the Archdiocese would have translaters available by some means.

 

[TryingToConvert]

I’m no expert, but will one of the following work?

• Contact the church where he was baptized, rather than the Archdiocese. If he or one of his relatives knows the name of the church, you may be able to find contact information here: masstimes.org/dotnet/showchurches.aspx?type=CITYRADIUS&q=&country=Brazil&city=natal&countrycode=BR&statecode=
• Find someone who knows Portuguese to make contact for you; perhaps those on the receiving end did not understand the request.
• I think that, in lieu of a baptism certificate, the written testimony of witnesses who were present at his baptism may suffice. Can his parents, godparents, or other relatives provide this? (Ask your pastor what form this should take.)

Thanks for your response! I can not find witnesses to the baptism as his mother is not recalling the event in good detail. She told him it was rather informal. I thought he would still have to have godparents and fmaily would be there.I am going to ask someone who speaks Portuguese to contact the church and her for further details.I will check the link out you provided. I do have the contact information for the church and the Archdiocese there but do not speak their language. It is a bothersome barrier but we will find a way to make it through this! Thanks again for your advice!

 

[Seatuck]

i certainly do understand. do you? if these facts are correct an annulment is not necessary. it seems clear that the questioner is seeking an annulment.

Yes, I understand that she still needs proof. Otherwise anyone could walk into any Parish office and get married without proof they are free to marry.This is not a full blown investigation type nullity case it is a documentary case. She needs the documents.