Annulments

[Blessed2010]

Hi there, was hoping someone can help me out here… I was married for 3.5 years before filing for divorce. He was never around… Would lie about where he was and very often people i know would see him out with the opposite sex but would lie to me about it… Anyways he filed for the annulment stating I didn’t want to have kids with him . Well even though it’s true and I didn’t because I would have been a single parent with a cheater… I’m afraid if I respond telling them that , they might not grant the annulment because of his actions. They will understand why I wouldn’t have kids under those circumstance … Even though I know he was unfaithful… I have no proof to provide to the “annulment courts” so do I still respond? Or don’t and have them just base it on what he’s saying ? PLEASE HELP! I guess what I’m asking is can they not grant the annulment if I tell them what he did?

 

[5Loaves]

Blessed2010-
Welcome to the CAF. You have mistakenly posted this in the Eastern Catholicism section.

I’m not sure the best place to post your concerns. There are many posts asking about “annulments” in the “Liturgy and Sacraments” section. You might start there.

 

[smad0142]

Willfully ignoring the annulment tribunal would be a lie of omission, and considering the subject matter it would definately be a mortally sinful lie. I would re-post in a more appropriate forum though and maybe they could give you more help and advice. Fasting and prayer can change your husband’s heart dramatically, and both of you shall be in my prayers as well.

 

[Vico]

Hi there, was hoping someone can help me out here… I was married for 3.5 years before filing for divorce. He was never around… Would lie about where he was and very often people i know would see him out with the opposite sex but would lie to me about it… Anyways he filed for the annulment stating I didn’t want to have kids with him . Well even though it’s true and I didn’t because I would have been a single parent with a cheater… I’m afraid if I respond telling them that , they might not grant the annulment because of his actions. They will understand why I wouldn’t have kids under those circumstance … Even though I know he was unfaithful… I have no proof to provide to the “annulment courts” so do I still respond? Or don’t and have them just base it on what he’s saying ? PLEASE HELP! I guess what I’m asking is can they not grant the annulment if I tell them what he did?

It is true that adultery is grounds for separation (civil divorce) in canon law, if the adulterer is innocent and refuses the conjugal act from the time of first knowledge of the adultery. But one is still married so cannot marry again while the spouse lives, even after civil divorce. So, you are afraid that the marriage is valid.

Actualy you do not have to want to have children, rather you must grant the normal conjugal rights apt to generate children, and be willing to accept children that result. If you can proove that your spouse stated no intention to be faithful or married for life, then it could be anulled. But you said you had no proof. There are other grounds for anullment. See:

consentmakesmarriage.com/groundsforannulment.html

 

[CarrieH]

I’m sorry you are in this situation. I have been through the annulment thing myself, so I speak from some experience. What matters to the tribunal was your state of mind on the day you were married. If you went into the marriage with the intention of never being open to having children, your were never validly married in the eyes of the Church, because that is one of the requirements for a sacramental marriage. However, there are other grounds here – I don’t know the exact terminology but there is one category, something about “lack of discretion toward the good of the spouses” which would include his failure to be faithful to you. Just because he applies for the annulment doesn’t mean that they will pin all of the blame on you. There are probably multiple reasons why this marriage could be found null, and if I were you, I would want for the tribunal to hear my side of the story, even though that questionnaire is pretty involved. The person applying has to provide witnesses as well, and I believe they give the other spouse the opportunity to do so, too (but I’m not sure, because my ex wasn’t Catholic and wanted nothing to do with the whole thing).

Talk to your priest; he can advise you better than we can. And welcome to CAF. God bless.

 

[Camille_Alden]

Trust the tribunal. It is not an adversarial court. It is for discovery and application of canon law to your circumstances. I personally know two canon lawyers, one is my sister, and you can talk with them really well.

Don’t listen to untrained advice. An don’t accept that it is a “mortal sin” not to respond, that’s just wrong. The annulment process is not coercive. Trust the Church.

 

[joandarc2008]

All the posters have said good things - adultery would be ONE of the grounds for the anullment I have filed - but it is not adultery per se - it falls under not understanding the definition of marriage - meaning the person seemed not to have the understanding that it was wrong to do this. In my situation he was cheating prior to the marriage while we were in pre-Cana counseling and his ex-wife is supplying the e-mails to prove it with a statement since she did not even know we were engaged or married. this would be an example. God bless and good luck - if you contact the mods - they will move this thread for you.

 

[smad0142]

Not wanting to tell the tribunal something because it might lead the tribunal to upholding the validity of the marriage would be a sin of omission, and considering the matter I fail to see how it would not be grave.

 

[5Loaves]

Trust the tribunal. It is not an adversarial court. It is for discovery and application of canon law to your circumstances. I personally know two canon lawyers, one is my sister, and you can talk with them really well.

I agree.
The canonists in our local tribunal are very easy to talk with.

(Camille Alden: Glad to see another female EC here. I thought your Eparchy had a name change to Holy Protection of Mary Byzantine Catholic Eparchy of Phoenix)

 

[Aramis]

My dad, a Roman Catholic deacon, has in the past done tribunal prep (for several years). While mildly intrusive, and often asking some very blunt and embarrassing questions, it’s not adversarial. It is done privately, and the documentation is held confidential.

You probably will never even meet the tribunal itself; the process is usually done by written testimonies.

If you have others who were witnesses to his infidelities, take down their contact information.

Work with your pastor or deacon to prepare the packet, and they will then have the local canon lawyer take a look, and help you with any missing elements.

 

[GraftedIn]

Mildly intrusive??? Have you actually seen the questions??? Mildly is the last word I would use, INTRUSIVE is definitely a word I would use.

 

[joandarc2008]

Mildly intrusive??? Have you actually seen the questions??? Mildly is the last word I would use, INTRUSIVE is definitely a word I would use.

Considering I just filled one out - I consider not that intrusive at all compared to the abuse that caused me to get divorced. Maybe it is just a different definition of what a good reason to leave your marriage and what your definition is of marriage between faiths.

 

[GraftedIn]

Well I filled out the paperwork as well, and I found the questions quite intrusive. So did all my family members who were named (by me) as witnesses. And I had a miserable marriage as well. To deem the annulment process less miserable than a miserable marriage is an interesting comparison. I think what bothers me is the minimalization (if that is even a word) that has occurred around this process. Words like, “Oh this is a very healing process for all involved.” Really? This process has led to more broken relationships within the family. Not less. So while I applaud your attitude, I must say the process has made me more bitter, not less. More cynical, not less. More damaged, not less. Again, it’s all a very personal experience, and mine has so far been less than stellar. Just saying. I suppose if all the scars from my marriage are combined with all the scars from the annulment process, some voodoo math makes it all … healing? I’m still prayerfully waiting.

 

[joandarc2008]

Well I filled out the paperwork as well, and I found the questions quite intrusive. So did all my family members who were named (by me) as witnesses. And I had a miserable marriage as well. To deem the annulment process less miserable than a miserable marriage is an interesting comparison. I think what bothers me is the minimalization (if that is even a word) that has occurred around this process. Words like, “Oh this is a very healing process for all involved.” Really? This process has led to more broken relationships within the family. Not less. So while I applaud your attitude, I must say the process has made me more bitter, not less. More cynical, not less. More damaged, not less. Again, it’s all a very personal experience, and mine has so far been less than stellar. Just saying. I suppose if all the scars from my marriage are combined with all the scars from the annulment process, some voodoo math makes it all … healing? I’m still prayerfully waiting.

It is healing regarding the assumption that one is doing the right thing after the divorce and not entering into new relationships. I can see where if one is entering into new relationships it can be quite embarassing and rough. However, the only relationship left to be affected should be the one between you and God. Without the anullment one is not free to date. The point is that this should be done right after the divorce and allow for the air to be cleared while one is going through that time they should be spending not dating healing from that marriage that just broke up - the same not dating that any secular mental health professional would also recommend. At the end you will find to that if counseling is recommend most diocese also offer to help with the cost of it. It is when we leave the religious as the last of our priorities that these wounds get opened up after they have been healed and it becomes not a healing process but a hurtful one.

 

[Incomplete]

. I think what bothers me is the minimalization (if that is even a word) that has occurred around this process. Words like, “Oh this is a very healing process for all involved.”

I obviously can’t speak for what you went through, but don’t assume that those who say it was healing are minimizing the process. Don’t assume that it’s not healing for those who say it was healing.

My husband, who was Protestant at the time, filed for annulment. It was his first experience with the Catholic church. None of us, including his Protestant family and friends, had a problem with the questions.

But the real healing was when he met with the tribunal priest. They spent several hours together (though it was only scheduled for an hour) and he left absolutely jubilant. He felt the weight of the world was off his shoulders, not because he was hopeful it would be granted (we had no idea if it would or would not be) but because the process itself helped him start to heal.

It’s a shame yours was not like that. I know that not every experience is a good one. I wish yours had been more like my husband’s experience. Just know that people who express a different experience from yours are likely being as honest as you are.

 

[Aramis]

Mildly intrusive??? Have you actually seen the questions??? Mildly is the last word I would use, INTRUSIVE is definitely a word I would use.

Yes.

It’s not much worse than the background investigation questionnaire when I went to work for the federal government.