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Zakuska
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Revelation ends up being a rehasah and mixture of of all the appocolyptic writtings of the OT.
Love the book.
Love the book.
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majick275
Guest
I love it too and while it does draw upon the OT writings it has specific messages targeted at specific groups of Christians to help them get through some specific situations that they were dealing with back then. Like the parables there are also multiple levels of teaching in it though. Principles that we should apply in our own lives and also due to human nature many of thes situations repeat themselves in a cyclical fashion thus making the guidance applicable to the past, present AND future.
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amgid
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Catholic Guy said:
It actually refers to plural marriage. It implies that plural marriage was legitimately practiced in the Christian church at that time; but he is recommending that if someone wants to be a bishop, it would be desirable if he had only one wife; but also that it would not make it impossible if he had more than one.
amgid
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amgid
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edmondhall said:
This teaching only recommends marriage, it does not deny plural marriage. He is recommending that in order to avoid temptation, it is desirable to get married. He does not make a statement about the number of wives.
There are! This scripture makes it clear that the Eucharist is symbolic, not literal:
John 6:
53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
We don’t know all the reasons why blacks were denied the priesthood in the early days of the Church. We must assume there had been a justifiable reason for at the time.
There is no scripture against it either. Jesus states in the NT:
Matthew 11:
27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.If no man knew the Father except Jesus had revealed it to him, then obviously the fact that God had a tangible body is something that had not been revealed to them at that time, but now it has been.
Yes, there is a scripture to that effect:
Job 1:
6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.
7 And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
Job 2:
1 Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the Lord.If two people are one person’s sons, then that would make them brothers, wouldn’t it?
I have. I look forward to your discussion.
amgid
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edmondhall
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Zakuska
I may have taken us off track–to get back on, my question to you is what Catholic doctrine contradicts the NT?
- We’re talking about the NT here (you said the Church departed from the gospel preached by the Apostles). SHow me where polygamy is commanded in the NT.
- You don’t provide Bibilical support for denying the priesthood to blacks (the basis for this denial to Blacks comes from LDS Scriptures), you don’t provide Biblical support for the view that the Eucharist is only symbolic, and from what I can tell the verses you cite in Luke and Corinthians do not say God the Father has flesh and bones.
I may have taken us off track–to get back on, my question to you is what Catholic doctrine contradicts the NT?
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amgid
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I have just answered these questions for you!
amgid
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wademann
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There is alot of speculation about #2, but I recently saw Thurl Bailey(he played for the Utah Jazz) speak on the BYU channel, and he talked about all the times he had asked about the blacks being denied the Priesthood, before he joined the church, and that he received many good answers, but none that satisfied him, until one day in Italy, he met with, I believe it was a mission president and he simply told Thurl that the time was not right, and that the black people were not ready and that white people were not ready, until now. He immediately called his Mormon wife and told he was ready to be baptised. There is a lot more to the story and to get the full effect you would have to hear him yourself. I think sometimes we try to have a great answer for everything, and sometimes the answer is simple.
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majick275
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What an awful thing to say. Because of your black ancestry you weren’t “ready” for the priesthood and the white folks wern’t ready for you to have it. So that’s the justification? and it’s okay because now everyone is “ready”? I don’t see that as very Christian at all.
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Chris-WA
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Man, you really missed the boat on John 6, Amgid. John 6 so emaphasizes the literal presence of Christ body, blood, soul and divinity in the Eucharist that even many Protestant scholars now are being convinced. Why did many of Jesus disciples walk away when He made these incredible statements? Because Jesus was being quite literal. If Jesus were speaking figuratively, it would have been incumbent on him as a teacher to say, “Hey, wait a minute. I was being figurative. I didn’t really mean that you have to eat my flesh and drink my blood. It was a symbolic statement.” No, those people walked away because they couldn’t bear to hear what Christ was saying. “How can this man give us his flesh to eat? Who can hear it?” Jesus was being very literal, and those disciples couldn’t handle it, so they left.
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Zakuska
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Was Pauls approval of Slavery “Christian” at all?
Heck A southern Baptist Minister lead the Mob that Lynched Joseph Smith. It was pure politics. Mormons where traditionally anti-slavery and the southerners wouldnt have it with their block voting and all. So they went and insited mob violence against the Mormons so they could turn the tide of each new state becoming a free state or a slave state. Come on people our ancestors did not live in a vaccum.
This isnt the first time that Priesthood was banned in Gods church. Under Moses only Levites could hold the priesthood and just look what happend to these poor chaps.
Ezra 2: 62
62 These sought their register among those that were reckoned by genealogy, but they were not found: therefore were they, as polluted, put from the priesthood.
They where defrocked, becuase they could not prove who their grand father was.
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Zakuska
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TEXT DELETED
If God has no DNA to pass on to his literal son then just where did the Zygot come from? Ms Weaver?
Rev 4-5
Ezekiel 1:26
Why does God have human form?
I though Amgid did a pretty Good Job explaning the symbolic nature… of the Euchrist.
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
…
68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
Peter didn’t say hey pass the fingers. It was what Christ was saying that lead to eternal life.
Matt. 4: 4
4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the emouth of God.
The litteral item means little. But the words that come out of Gods mouth that lead to eternal life.
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Rachel_Malloy
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Let’s get back on track.
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Zakuska
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Sure…
Another Gospel
Faith Repentance Baptism Gift of the Holy Ghost.
I beleive both Mormons and Catholics agree in this general outline. Protestants I beleive would object.
Another Gospel
Faith Repentance Baptism Gift of the Holy Ghost.
I beleive both Mormons and Catholics agree in this general outline. Protestants I beleive would object.
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wademann
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There is alot of speculation about #2, but I recently saw Thurl Bailey(he played for the Utah Jazz) speak on the BYU channel, and he talked about all the times he had asked about the blacks being denied the Priesthood, before he joined the church, and that he received many good answers, but none that satisfied him, until one day in Italy, he met with, I believe it was a mission president and he simply told Thurl that the time was not right, and that the black people were not ready and that white people were not ready, until now. He immediately called his Mormon wife and told he was ready to be baptised. There is a lot more to the story and to get the full effect you would have to hear him yourself. I think sometimes we try to have a great answer for everything, and sometimes the answer is simple.
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Zakuska
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wademann
Isnt that what I just said?
I also pointed to the fact that the Children of Israel where Given the law because they where not ready to live Gods commands.
Gal 3
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
And thei crcases fell 40 years in the desert until a reigtheous seed could be raised up.
Isnt that what I just said?
I also pointed to the fact that the Children of Israel where Given the law because they where not ready to live Gods commands.
Gal 3
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
And thei crcases fell 40 years in the desert until a reigtheous seed could be raised up.
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wademann
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Not because of their black ancestry, but because society, in large part, was not ready. Makes sense to me ,and most important made sense to Thurl, who in case you didn’t know is black.
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wademann
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Yes, you did a great job, but sometimes things have to be repeated in different ways. Just look at the scriptures.
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Chris-WA
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That doesn’t make sense because the Catholic Church has had black priests for centuries. And it has nothing to do with society. They were not worthy due to the curse of Cain, right? That’s what the Mormon church always taught.
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majick275
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I also don’t believe that NBA players are a good source of Christian doctrine regardless of their race. It may not be aproblem fopr Thurl Bailey but it is a huge problem for me. The bar was specific to race, The BoM still promotes this concept of racial “cursing” being identified by skin color. I find this a VERY different “Gospel” than what Christ taught.
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edmondhall
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This racial cursing is evidence of an apostate church, in my view.
What Catholic doctrine explicitly contradicts the NT and therefore necessitated the restoration? Which doctrine is an abomination because it contradicts a truth of the NT?
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