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RebeccaJ
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Limbo hasn’t changed, anyway. It is the same, with an addition that says Christ’s mercy makes it possible for the unbaptized to know heaven. This applies to a person of any age.
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TexanKnight
Guest
First, Janderich disappeared after having to admit his prophet taught false doctrine.
Now he has disappeared after being confronted with teachings he adamantly claimed was not a teaching.
I feel bad for him. I know how he feels. It was hard for me to be confronted with teachings I had never heard about when I was LDS. I wish him the best.
Now he has disappeared after being confronted with teachings he adamantly claimed was not a teaching.
I feel bad for him. I know how he feels. It was hard for me to be confronted with teachings I had never heard about when I was LDS. I wish him the best.
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Janderich
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Marie5890
Guest
At least we are now all on the same page that the doctrine does exist. The LDS Church apparently is shifting it’s focus away from it, like they did when they shifted away from both polygamy and the barring of those of African decent from the priesthood, but the doctrine still is part of the doctrinal beliefs of the LDS Church.
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RebeccaJ
Guest
That quote has no meaning in relationship to truth. I don’t recommend taking it as direction for life. Jesus calls us to lose ourselves, not seek after glory, including if not most of all, the glory of believing ourselves to be punky gods in training.
You should let it go.
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Janderich
Guest
SapeSalvi,
To clarify, I do not deny that we believe a worthy person may in some distant future become like God. After all, he is a child of God. Does a chick grow up to be a pig, or a puppy grow up to be a cow. Please read my previous posts on this same thread. My point is that we do not regularly dwell on the matter. Such continued insistence otherwise is a distortion of what we focus on. We do not go around praising ourselves or thinking how grand we are. This is simply not the case.
It is funny that Catholic’s on this site think that the reason I state such matters is to sound less outlandish. Why do you think this? Doesn’t our doctrine on Adam, pre-mortal spirits, physical bodies, etc. sound strange enough? I am simply trying to clarify what is normally taught.
Regarding the 12 year old lesson manual. I will pull the table of contents from the current Aaronic Priesthood Manual just to provide a feel for what is taught.
Lesson 1 The Priesthood
Lesson 2 The Calling of a Deacon
Lesson 3 Administering the Sacrament
Lesson 4 Gathering Fast Offerings
Lesson 5 Faith in Jesus Christ
Lesson 6 The Holy Ghost
Lesson 7 “A Mighty Change of Heart”
Lesson 8 “Honour Thy Father”
Lesson 9 Respect for Mothers and Their Divine Role
Lesson 10 Family Unity
Lesson 11 “As I Have Loved You, Love One Another”
Lesson 12 Following the Living Prophet
Lesson 13 Every Member Is a Missionary
Lesson 14 Serving Others
Lesson 15 Unity and Brotherhood in the Priesthood
Lesson 16 Charity
Lesson 17 Personal Journals
Lesson 18 The Word of Wisdom
Lesson 19 Overcoming Temptation
Lesson 20 Proper Use of Agency
Lesson 21 Pure Thoughts: Clean Language
Lesson 22 Covenants Guide Our Actions
Lesson 23 Pray for Guidance
Lesson 24 Christ-Centered Repentance
Lesson 25 Forgiveness
Lesson 26 Do Good on the Sabbath
Lesson 27 Reverence
Lesson 28 Respect for Womanhood
Lesson 29 The Eternal Family
Lesson 30 The Plan of Salvation
Lesson 31 Continue in Prayer and Fasting
Lesson 32 Tithing
Lesson 33 Scripture Study
Lesson 34 Obedience
Lesson 35 The Sacrament
Lesson 36 Testimony
Lesson 37 The Priesthood of Aaron
Lesson 38 Magnifying the Calling of an Aaronic Priesthood Holder
Lesson 39 Missionary Work through Example
Lesson 40 The House of the Lord
Lesson 41 Sexual Purity
Lesson 42 Honesty
Lesson 43 Tools for Searching the Scriptures
Lesson 44 Becoming a Better Home Teacher
Lesson 45 The Sacred Power of Procreation
Lesson 46 Decision Making
Lesson 47 Consecration and Sacrifice
Lesson 48 The Power to Baptize
Lesson 49 Using Time Wisely
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Janderich
Guest
Why do you always accuse me of disappearing? I was at work all day. Now, I am going to be with my kids to celebrate Easter with the family. I may have some time to comment more later.
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TexanKnight
Guest
because you seem to post back and forth until something like today pops up…then you stop posting. I suppose it is always just coincidence.
Anyway, you have already admitted your prophets teach false doctrine. How do you respond to finding out your church taught a doctrine that you claimed was not taught?
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TexanKnight
Guest
ah…you have gone from “it is not taught” to “we do not dwell”.
Nice change. You have all the makings of a prophet
Have a Happy Easter with your family
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mwok
Guest
“As man is now, God once was,
As God is now, man may become”?
God has always had a body in the Person of Jesus Christ. He doesn’t exist in time because he created time. The only reason He had to suffer was to take on sin and death and take it to its rightful place, in the grave. Death could never hold Him, which is why He could deliberately take on sin without fault, die by His own authority, so that we could once again be in unity with God.
As God is now, man may become”?
God has always had a body in the Person of Jesus Christ. He doesn’t exist in time because he created time. The only reason He had to suffer was to take on sin and death and take it to its rightful place, in the grave. Death could never hold Him, which is why He could deliberately take on sin without fault, die by His own authority, so that we could once again be in unity with God.
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garyo49
Guest
No, the Mormon God came from father God, who came from grandfather God, who came from great-grandfather God…
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garyo49
Guest
“I wish to declare I have always an in all congregations when I have preached on the subject of Deity, it has been the plurality of Gods.”
- Prophet Joseph Smith, Jr., History of the Church, v. 6, p. 306
- Prophet Joseph Smith, Jr., History of the Church, v. 6, pp. 307, 308
- Apostle Orson Pratt, Journal of Discourses, v. 2, p. 345, February 18, 1855
- Apostle Orson Pratt, The Seer, v. 1, p. 37
- Prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, v. 8, p. 160, September 2, 1860
- W.W. Phelps, Latter-day Saint Messenger and Advocate, v. 1, no. 9, p. 130, June 1835
"Our text says, “And hath made us kings and priests unto God and His Father.” * * * My object was to preach the scriptures, and preach the doctrine they contain, there being a God above, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. * * *
"Eloheim is from the word Eloi, God, in the singular number; and by adding the word heim, it renders it Gods. It read first, “In the beginning the head of the Gods brought forth the Gods,” or, as others have translated it, “The head of the Gods called the Gods together.” * * *
"The head God organized the heavens and the earth. In the beginning the heads of the Gods organized the heavens and the earth. * * * The head one of the Gods said, Let us make a man in our own image. I once asked a learned Jew, “If the Hebrew language compels us to render all words ending in heim in the plural, why not render the first Eloheim plural?” He replied, “That is the rule with few exceptions; but in this case it would ruin the Bible.” He acknowledged I was right. * * *
“In the very beginning the Bible shows there is a plurality of Gods beyond the power of refutation. It is a great subject I am dwelling on. The word Eloheim ought to be in the plural all the way through—Gods. The heads of the Gods appointed one God for us; and when you take that view of the subject, it sets one free to see all the beauty, holiness and perfections of the Gods.”
- Prophet Joseph Smith, Jr., Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pp. 370-372, June 16, 1844
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LDSfaqs
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That is a false statement and false doctrine.
- As we all know, Satan is generally the deciever and perverter of truth. He uses a little truth to tell great lies.
- Satan told Eve two things.
a. That she would not die when eating of the fruit.
b. That she would be “as the Gods”.
The second statement, Lucifer is actually telling the TRUTH.
We know this to be the case because several verses later God Himself verify’s the truth of the statement.
Genesis 3:22
And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil.
See, what you have just stated is a complete falsehood, and a false doctrine taught in your religions. God verify’s Lucifer’s statement, thus the fall from grace was not because they wanted to be as the Gods, it was because they were deceived, by being told a lie with a truth. Being as the Gods is not a bad thing, in fact it is the entire purpose of this life. To learn to be as our Father in Heaven through the example of the Christ.
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LDSfaqs
Guest
What you have stated is not accurate.
Christ is the Only Begotten of the Father. Which means and has always meant, that he’s the Only Son of God who was “Begotten” by the Father. Meaning, the Fathers DNA was bonded with Mary’s to create the Son. The rest of us are adopted sons because our bodies are matter of the earth/man, not the Father. Of course, the Father is the Father of our spirits, but not our bodies.
Anyway, this fact as well as other scriptures make clear that the Father also is made of “matter”, not simply spirit. There would be no reason for Christ to have a body and be Resurrected with a body and being on the Fathers Thrown, if the Father didn’t also have a body. There would also be no reason for US to have a body by being Resurrected, and also on the thrown inheriting all the Father hath.
Further, Christ said, be ye therefore perfect even as the Father. He didn’t say as “he”, he said as the Father. Further, Christ said he was the Son of God, and they stoned him for it, ironically how other Christians stone Mormons for saying the same thing about ourselves. Christ then said, why stone me, they say for blasphemy, then Christ says your own Law says it (Psalms), that ye are gods. So, why stone me for something even your own law states?
Also, before you try to use the “God is spirit” verse to try and claim God is “only” Spirit, you can’t do that, because you are ADDING to the Word. It doesn’t say God is only spirit. Further, you can’t assume it, because there is another verse or two which says “man is spirit”. But as we all know, man isn’t only spirit. Thus, while the Bible doesn’t directly say what God’s full nature is, there is plenty of scriptures that imply it, that it’s no different than the Christ’s. In fact, Christ even said that he did nothing he hadn’t seen the Father do. This is quite direct, and can mean nothing else other than the Father was once a mortal similar to Christ.
Thus, LDS theology when it comes to the Father is completely compatible to the Bible.
Not only that, but Christ and the Father being the “same substance” is actually in fact true. They are after all of the same species, and are in fact related as Father and Son literally. Of course, sadly Christianity has lost the original intent and meaning of that statement and changed it to mean something else, this “mystery” called the Trinity, One being in three persons. But, the original Nicene Creed was actually pretty much still teaching true doctrine.
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LDSfaqs
Guest
Your first statement is correct, but your second statement is false.
All we know about God being “human” is what Christ Himself said, when he said directly that he did nothing he hadn’t seen the Father do. In other words, while it is NOT “doctrine” of Mormonism, but a belief within it, the Father was once a mortal AS Christ was once a mortal.
But, the is not actually doctrine, because God hasn’t directly revealed it to the Church itself by Revelation. Joseph Smith in his own personal inspiration and revelation through the KFD taught this same idea, that the Father was once a man as Christ was once a man.
Is not Christ God? Yes he is and always has been. Therefore, the Father was NEVER not God, even IF he was once a mortal as Christ was.
Not “bizarre” at all when you actually know and understand what the teachings actually are.
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LDSfaqs
Guest
Anyone living the best they can be in Faith will ultimately be Exalted and will be Gods with the Father, inheriting all the Father has, joint heirs with Christ, etc. just as the Bible states.
There is not actual “doctrine” that Mormons will get their own Planets, etc.
There has been “speculation” and it is a natural assumption from the actual doctrine, and it is a teaching and idea within mormonism, but we have no actual doctrine on the idea.
Our enemy’s falsely portray anything ever taught within mormonism as if it’s actually doctrine of Mormonism. Every religion, including ours teaches all kinds of things from doctrines and from good things of the world that are not actually doctrines of the religion. Our enemy’s forget this principle.
Ex-mormons sadly are generally anti-mormons, thus they are not a good source of information. Reason being is because like other anti-mormons they are ignorant of and pervert the truth and facts of things.
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LDSfaqs
Guest
Why? Christ was once a man, and according to the Bible and extra-biblical texts he was clearly imperfect before accountability, until he became perfect as he grew.
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LDSfaqs
Guest
Actually, what you state is totally not true. There is a difference between a common belief within a religion and it’s people, compared to what is actually taught by the religion. Mormonism itself doesn’t generally teach that we will be Gods of our own worlds.
Yes, it CAN be found in some places and teachings. But, it’s absolutely NOT emphasized at all in the Church. Every Sunday I go to Church, I’m NEVER taught that I will be a God of my own world. One must generally go to special classes etc. to even hear such an idea, such as the Temple Prep class. Again, it’s not doctrine however. It’s an assumption from the doctrine.
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LDSfaqs
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I would ask that you stop calling people “liars” please…!
We have nothing to “hide”. It is not our fault that you never actually understood the religion in full and accurately. It is after all likely the reason you’re an ex-mormon.
Anyway, I’ve clarify what the actual and whole truth is above.
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garyo49
Guest
Joseph Smith (“King Follett Discourse,” Journal of Discourses 6:3-4, also in Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, 342-345):
“God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted Man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens. That is the great secret… It is the first principle of the Gospel to know for a certainty the character of God and to know…that he was once a man like us… Here, then, is eternal life - to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves,… the same as all Gods have done before you…”
Brigham Young (Journal of Discourses 7:333):Brigham Young (Journal of Discourses 7:333):
“He [God] is our Father - the Father of our spirits, and was once a man in mortal flesh as we are, and is now an exalted being.”
Brigham Young (Journal of Discourses 3:93):
“The Lord created you and me for the purpose of becoming Gods like himself.”
Milton R. Hunter (The Gospel Through the Ages, p 104):
“Mormon prophets have continuously taught the sublime truth that God the Eternal Father was once a mortal man who passed through a school of earth life similar that through which we are now passing. He became God - an exalted being - through obedience to the same eternal Gospel truths that we are given opportunity today to obey.”
Bruce R. McConkie (Mormon Doctrine, 1966 ed p 250):
“…God…is a personal Being, a holy and exalted man…”
Joseph Fielding Smith (Doctrines of Salvation 1:10, 1954, cited from 21st printing 1975):
“God is an exalted man. Some people are trouble over the statements of the Prophet Joseph Smith … that our Father in heaven at one time passed through a life and death and is an exalted man…”
LeGrand Richards (private letter to Morris L. Reynolds, July 14, 1966):
“There is a statement often repeated in the Church, and while it is not in one of the Standard Church Works, it is accepted as church doctrine, and this is: ‘As man is, God once was; as God is, man may become.’” (cited by Tanner, Mormonism: Shadow or Reality, p 164
Teachings of Presidents of the Church: Brigham Young (published by the church as an official lesson manual 1997 [text “approved 10/95”], p. 29):
“President Brigham Young taught … that God the Father was once a man on another planet who ‘passed the ordeals we are now passing through…’”
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