Another Question for LDS

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Caprica said:
As I said, the Catechism states that the Son of God assumed “our” nature. What is our nature? Sinful (according to you). Therefore the Catechism is teaching (according to your logic) that Jesus had a sinful nature when He was on earth. Please be consistent. “As man is” says nothing about the Father once being sinful, nor does Jesus assuming “our” nature mean that He had original sin (within the Catholic worldview).
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Since Mormonism has redefined the nature of mankind, the role of Jesus has therefore also changed. I’m not 100% on board with the original sin, but the Bible clearly states that we’re all sinners and fall short of the grace of god.

The Mormon concept of perfection is silliness as it leads to the notion that we can be gods like God.

No one believes everything they read (or they shouldn’t). The fact is that we use books in universities to learn. History majors read books and more books. Their education is not devalued because they couldn’t go to the geographical location that they are studying.

This is an odd point, Mormons talking about believing in something that the works they attribute to their god, when nothing unique to Mormonism exists outside of it. No Mormon can go to Zarahemla, Bountiful, or Lehi-Nephi because not only has the site of the BOM events changed continents, those places never existed in the first place. In fact, you probably can’t even tell me where the Hill Cumorah is, can you?
 
why_me said:
Of course, Joseph Smith could have made a stand in Nauvoo. But much bloodshed would follow and many saints would have been killed. So, he agreed to go to prison. His brother volunteered to go with him to jail because he loved his brother. And so, there was brother supporting brother along with two other mormons who volunteered too. Such love for someone is quite wonderful.

A hundred man mob painted with black faces stormed the prison killing Hyrum, his brother and Joseph Smith. He died for his faith and that is a martyr. Likewise the jews who died in the warsaw ghetto were martyrs too. They defended themselves and died because of their faith. To not defend oneself is the same as commiting suicide.
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You’re implying, then, that Jesus committed suicide since he didn’t defend himself? That’s the clear implication here. That’s the most absurd claim I’ve heard any Mormon make since he was labelled a polygamist.

Smith died because he was defending himself as he wanted to live, whereas a real martyr is willing to die if need be.
 
SirThomasMore said:
The context of the LDS temple film and the knowedge that the Catholic Church was labeled as the Great and Abominable Church made it seem pretty clear to me.

You know, you win. I am not wanting to debate with you anymore. I pray mightily that if you are ever in a low point in your life, people do not mock you.

Maybe later I feel different.

I wish you the best. I hope God blesses you and your family.

Be blessed
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Sometimes the ignore feature can be your friend! 😉
 
SirThomasMore said:
I agree, I was just appalled and saddended that someone who claims to follow Christ would stoop to such a low level.

I prayed for that person last night.
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You’re a good man STM. Praying for those who have treated you poorly is often very hard. It’s obvious that you follow Jesus Christ. 👍
 
Kdesiel said:
What happened?
I’m lost.
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SirThomasMore falsely accused me of having a problem with poor people. He then falsely accused me of being entertained by his “spiritual struggle” and that he thought about taking his life, with some odd expectation that we were aware of that at the Mormon Apologetics and Discussion Board where he used to post. The posts speak for themselves, and these were of course more red herrings to deflect from the actual discussion.
 
Kdesiel said:
What happened?
I’m lost.
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Thank you for your question. I had posted when I changed my name about a very dark struggle I had last year. A member here mocked my struggle and mocked me having a struggle calling it entertaining. Now it is being called a red herring. It was this kind of attitude that chased me, and others, from the LDS Church.
 
SirThomasMore said:
Thank you for your question. I had posted when I changed my name about a very dark struggle I had last year. A member here mocked my struggle and mocked me having a struggle calling it entertaining. Now it is being called a red herring. It was this kind of attitude that chased me, and others, from the LDS Church.
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And since I said nothing about your struggle (since you did not state that you were struggling at MADB), and said nothing about your struggle being entertaining, this is very disingenuous. Here is what I did say:

"It certainly is. I’m glad that we can laugh at each others comments (though your AtticusFinch incarnation here and at Mormon Apologetics and Discussion Board was more…entertaining)."
 
Caprica said:
And I am praying for you as well.
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I respectfully ask you not to.

The God I pray to is not the same as the one you pray to. The God I pray to is of the Bible. He is the Alpha and the Omega. He knows of NO other Gods. (Isaiah 44:8) He says HE is the only one. (Isaiah 44:6) No God was formed before or after (Isaiah 43:10) He did not, as Brigham Young taught, have relations wit h Mary (Please see thread on BY quotes). He was never sinful, never man. There is no plurality of gods, therefore, as you believe (Mormon Doctrine, B. R. McKonkie).

Thank you for your consideration
 
SirThomasMore said:
I respectfully ask you not to.

The God I pray to is not the same as the one you pray to. The God I pray to is of the Bible. He is the Alpha and the Omega. He knows of NO other Gods. (Isaiah 44:8) He says HE is the only one. (Isaiah 44:6) No God was formed before or after (Isaiah 43:10) He did not, as Brigham Young taught, have relations wit h Mary (Please see thread on BY quotes). He was never sinful, never man. There is no plurality of gods, therefore, as you believe (Mormon Doctrine, B. R. McKonkie).

Thank you for your consideration
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For anyone to Mock another hardship or trial, or to take satisfaction in another sufferings shows their true character.

I can relate in terms of such attitudes displayed by some members of the LDS faith. The insensitivity towards certain spiritual struggles I’ve had in the past was one of a few motivating forces to seek Christ’s True Church.

May god Bless and Love you and yours.
Your Brother in Christ
K.
 
Kdesiel said:
For anyone to Mock another hardship or trial, or to take satisfaction in another sufferings shows their true character.

I can relate in terms of such attitudes displayed by some members of the LDS faith. The insensitivity towards certain spiritual struggles I’ve had in the past was one of a few motivating forces to seek Christ’s True Church.

May god Bless and Love you and yours.
Your Brother in Christ
K.
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You are a true bother in Christ. Thank you
 
Kdesiel said:
For anyone to Mock another hardship or trial, or to take satisfaction in another sufferings shows their true character.

I can relate in terms of such attitudes displayed by some members of the LDS faith. The insensitivity towards certain spiritual struggles I’ve had in the past was one of a few motivating forces to seek Christ’s True Church.

May god Bless and Love you and yours.
Your Brother in Christ
K.
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I completely agree. To behave that way is reprehensible.

The saddest thing is that when people like that act in such a blatant manner, they tend to have and “oh well, that’s your problem” type of attitude, and rarely take responsibility for their actions.

But when the shoe is on the other foot, they scream bloody murder.
 
twopekinguys said:
I completely agree. To behave that way is reprehensible.

The saddest thing is that when people like that act in such a blatant manner, they tend to have and “oh well, that’s your problem” type of attitude, and rarely take responsibility for their actions.

But when the shoe is on the other foot, they scream bloody murder.
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Thank you for your prayers. You are another true Borther in Christ.

I feel humbled and honored to have such brothers as we fight the good fight
 
I admire your perseverance in this debate. It has gone on for years, and the same topics get hashed and rehashed over and over again, but they keep on re-introducing the same topics over and over again, and we keep on defending ourselves. It is nice to see new names, people who can continue when others drop out.

Keep on going on. Someday, they will recognize that it is useless. Until then, response is necessary, if only to inform Catholics, and others, of the offenses of Mormonism.
 
I have read some of the latest post, just want to speak from the heart.

I have found that unless you have a relationship with Christ that places him above everything held dear what does He matter to one who is LDS? Even many Catholics for that matter who do not get it. There is a step that the Saints take, it moves towards our own nothingness, yet is is where everything that matters is found.

Would one sacrifice their own family to pick up the cross and follow Him and become a Catholic? Some do.

Why would anyone choose that? It’s clear where the Christian truth lies, that the Holy Trinity is God, that we are Gods Creation. That Jesus took on the form of man but is still God. Who can understand ones rightful place among Gods creation? Who is ready to give Him all credit for one single breath out of many? Nothing we posses that is good comes from any one of us yet we try to posses it all as if it does.

This sets us apart from the LDS. We know that we are nothing without Jesus in us. It’s all about Jesus in the Catholic faith. But how many Catholics can place Jesus so high? The fact is there are very few moments when we actually can do this and it does not come by way of works. No to the contrary it comes through God Himself prompting us to the Sacrament of Confession. In their we can become whole if only for a moment. In there are hope becomes reality, the encounter of love. In there we know who we are because we know who we are not. You can argue and you can argue but I know in my heart as a Catholic that this Church is true…sound familiar? And after living in Utah for 12 years and helping with the RCIA I know that many of the LDS, once they begin to have doubts will unfortunately never walk into a Catholic Church seeking Christian truth. . In this one can witness the damage that Satan can inflict on a very special breed of people. But some do walk through the doors. I take them and run as fast as I can to two places. First the Crucifix then the Confessional. Our faith is so huge because we have a God, not a man who is so huge.
And we are all loved by love itself LDS or Catholic. This never changes.
 
So many have been so deeply indoctrinated by the anti-Catholicism of the LDS faith that once they see how false their faith is, they will never consider Catholicism. Others, more deeply hurt by the LDS faith, will claim agnosticism or atheism, and never get beyond that.

The evidence of anti-Catholicism in the LDS faith can be seen in their persistent efforts to convert us here on our own turf.
 
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