Anti-Catholicism

[vern_humphrey]

I’m sure it was metaphorically speaking …

Nope. It was a right cross. Decked him.

They expelled Nicolas, but the Virgin Mary appeared to all the other bishops in their dreams that night and told them they had to take Nicolas back.

I have had to deal with a lot of difficult people in my life, so my two favorite saints are Saint Fiacre and Saint Nicolas. Saint Fiacre, of course, is the patron saint of hemmrhoids, and if he can’t help me deal with a pain in the rear, then I can always call upon Saint Nicolas.

 

[San_Patricio]

Rigggght.

So glad you agree!

God bless you!!!

 

[San_Patricio]

Nope. It was a right cross. Decked him.

 

[vern_humphrey]

The purpose of the reformation was to undo the damage done by the Roman Church, yes or no?

No.

The purpose of the reformation was to re-align the politics of Europe. That’s why Martin Luther, for example, condemned the starving peasants who revolted against their feudal overlords – the overlords were his allies. That’s why the English accepted land confiscated from the Church in return for backing Henry VIII.

Internal reform was accomplished from within the Church, not from without. Those who broke away lost the Kharisma of infallibility, developed all sorts of strange new doctrines, quarreled and split amongst themselves, and are quarreling and splitting to this day.

 

[VociMike]

My opinion is that it has to do with insecurity. Their faith cannot be true unless the Catholic faith is shown to be false. They have rebelled against the “father” Church and their rebellion can only be seen as legitimate if the Church is shown to be deserving of rebellion. Even better if the Church can be destroyed, since while the Church still exists her very existence stands in silent judgement against their rebellion.

John Henry Cardinal Newman, who was one of the best and brightest in the Anglican church before becoming Catholic, wrote that

“If you would have some direct downright proof that Catholicism is what Protestants make it to be, something which will come up to the mark, you must lie; else you will not get beyond feeble suspicions, which may be right, but may be wrong. Hence Protestants are obliged to cut their ninth commandment out of their Decalogue. “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour” must go, must disappear; their position requires the sacrifice. The substance, the force, the edge of their Tradition is slander. As soon as ever they disabuse their minds of what is false, and grasp only what is true,—I do not say they at once become Catholics; I do not say they lose their dislike to our religion, or their misgivings about its working;—but I say this, either they become tolerant towards us, and cease to hate us personally,—or, at least, supposing they cannot shake off old associations, and are prejudiced and hostile as before, still they find they have not the means of communicating their own feelings to others. To Protestantism False Witness is the principle of propagation. There are indeed able men who can make a striking case out of anything or nothing, as great painters give a meaning and a unity to the commonest bush, and pond, and paling and stile: genius can do without facts, as well as create them; but few possess the gift. Taking things as they are, and judging of them by the long run, one may securely say, that the anti-Catholic Tradition could not be kept alive, would die of exhaustion, without a continual supply of fable.”

newmanreader.org/works/england/index.html

 

[NotWorthy]

  			Originally Posted by **levi86** 					[forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif](http://forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=1764576#post1764576) 				
  		* Its validity as a religion is dependant upon slandering The RCC. .*

Rigggght.

I’m afraid martin has a point. You can’t lump all Protestants into a single category no more than you can lump all Catholics into a single category.

Some Christians, through insecurity (as Vocimike put it, and very well I might add!!!), may feel by “proving” the Catholic Church is wrong, are able to justify their religion. This seems to be common in ex-catholics as well as well-educated Bible Christians who have trouble overcoming their prejudices that they may have grown up with, and see some of the seeds of the early Church in the RCC today.

But there are other Christians who simply love the Lord with all their heart, and do not see the same love and zeal in the Catholic Church. In my opinion, it’s OUR fault that they haven’t approached the Catholic Church with an open mind. Our parishes would benefit from these people joining the Church.

 

[mikeledes]

The purpose of the reformation was to undo the damage done by the Roman Church, yes or no?

The more the reformers were able to “prove” that the RCC had manipulated the word of God the more people would see a necessity for the reformation. Their success as a religious movement was dependant upon their ability to discredit the Catholic Church.

Amen to that! Catholicism preceded Protestantism. If Catholicism is right, then Protestantism is wrong. Therefore, Catholicism has to be discredited and proven false. It’s like the woman who takes away another woman’s husband. You know she won’t have anything nice to say about his wife.

God Bless,
Michael

 

[NotWorthy]

Amen to that! Catholicism preceded Protestantism. If Catholicism is right, then Protestantism is wrong. Therefore, Catholicism has to be discredited and proven false. It’s like the woman who takes away another woman’s husband. You know she won’t have anything nice to say about his wife.

God Bless,
Michael

I must reitterate, this is **not **the feelings of all Christians who are not Catholic. I want to stress this point I made previously:

But there are other Christians who simply love the Lord with all their heart, and do not see the same love and zeal in the Catholic Church. In my opinion, it’s OUR fault that they haven’t approached the Catholic Church with an open mind. Our parishes would benefit from these people joining the Church.

 

[myfavoritmartin]

NotWorthy:
I’m afraid martin has a point. You can’t lump all Protestants into a single category no more than you can lump all Catholics into a single category.

Some Christians, through insecurity (as Vocimike put it, and very well I might add!!!), may feel by “proving” the Catholic Church is wrong, are able to justify their religion. This seems to be common in ex-catholics as well as well-educated Bible Christians who have trouble overcoming their prejudices that they may have grown up with, and see some of the seeds of the early Church in the RCC today.

But there are other Christians who simply love the Lord with all their heart, and do not see the same love and zeal in the Catholic Church. In my opinion, it’s OUR fault that they haven’t approached the Catholic Church with an open mind. Our parishes would benefit from these people joining the Church.

Nw,
Level headed and spot on as usual.
Peace my friend.

 

[NotWorthy]

Nw,
Level headed and spot on as usual.
Peace my friend.

As to you, my brother!

 

[mikeledes]

I must reitterate, this is **not **the feelings of all Christians who are not Catholic. I want to stress this point I made previously:

Not all Protestants engage in the lies and fabrications that are the subject of this thread. But the need to prove the Catholic Church wrong comes from the fact, whether consciously or subconsciously done , that Catholicism must be proven wrong in order for Protestantism to be proven right.

God Bless,
Michael

 

[IsMiseSteise]

Let’s face it, most of the Protestants today have no idea what the origination of protestantism was all about.

Not to mention that so many of us learned that protestant reformation was about “nice” Martin Luther saving people from the “horrid” Catholics and their “horrid” religion. They have no idea that Martin Luther had more in mind than “saving” folks from the Catholic religion.

And, as someone touched upon earlier, to many people are interested in being able to do what they want at all costs. Taking responsibility for ones actions and dealing with the word “no” are just unacceptable to them. The protestant faiths allow them to behave the way they want and so, that’s how they believe.

 

[mikeledes]

How about the lies and fabrications some Protestants create in order to give themselves a link to the apostolic age? Ever heard of the “Trail of Blood”? A couple of days ago, I heard an Assembly of God preacher claim that they have nothing to do with Martin Luther and that Martin Luther was still attached to Catholic paganism. They claimed that there was a group of true Christians that stretched back to the apostolic age and coexisted with the false Roman Church. And yet, all of the Protestant reformers were former Catholics and none of the founders of the various Protestant churches (Methodist, Pentecostal, Baptist, etc.) can directly link themselves to heretical groups like the Waldensians and all probably had a Catholic ancestor.

God bless,
Michael

 

[mozart-250]

…of course I just learned in another thread that our churches were Satanic counterfeits.

If that is not the Catholic equivalent of Jack Chick and John MacArthur, I don’t know what is.

Pot meet kettle.

 

[mikeledes]

…of course I just learned in another thread that our churches were Satanic counterfeits.

If that is not the Catholic equivalent of Jack Chick and John MacArthur, I don’t know what is.

Pot meet kettle.

Okay… and how is that a lie or fabrication. Seriously, the Catholic Church preceded Protestantism and possesses the fullness of Christian truth. The confusion that is found in Protestantism from its very beginning (Martin Luther vs. Zwingli, Zwingli v. Anabaptists, Anabaptists vs. Lutherans, Lutherans vs. Calvinists) testifies to the fact that the Protestant Reformation was not the work of God. God is not the author of confusion.

Chick and his counterparts rely on lies to discredit the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church has history to back up its claims.

God Bless,
Michael

 

[myfavoritmartin]

NotWorthy:
I’m afraid martin has a point. .

in cased this was missed…

 

[mikeledes]

in cased this was missed…

Of course you know I have to say something, right? You have a point! All Protestants do not engage in these nefarious tactics. But don’t rejoice that I admitted that you were right in this . It won’t happen again!

God Bless,
Michael

 

[Randy_Carson]

in cased this was missed…

I saw it.

So which category are you in, Marty? Notworthy gave two options:1. “Some Christians, through insecurity (as Vocimike put it, and very well I might add!!!), may feel by “proving” the Catholic Church is wrong, are able to justify their religion. This seems to be common in ex-catholics as well as well-educated Bible Christians who have trouble overcoming their prejudices that they may have grown up with, and see some of the seeds of the early Church in the RCC today.”
2. “But there are other Christians who simply love the Lord with all their heart, and do not see the same love and zeal in the Catholic Church. In my opinion, it’s OUR fault that they haven’t approached the Catholic Church with an open mind. Our parishes would benefit from these people joining the Church.”
Are you in the “prejudiced” category or the “joining the Church” category?

Really, we’d love to have you!

 

[rr1213]

No.

The purpose of the reformation was to re-align the politics of Europe. That’s why Martin Luther, for example, condemned the starving peasants who revolted against their feudal overlords – the overlords were his allies. That’s why the English accepted land confiscated from the Church in return for backing Henry VIII.

…and why Catholic France fought on the side of the Protestants in the 30 years war. Both Protestant and Catholic Churches and Rulers played politics with the souls of their subjects, spiritual and temporal.

 

[mikeledes]

You’re right Randy. Myfavoritemartin would make a wonderful Catholic Christian. He’s devoted to Christ and smart. He would definitely be an asset to the Church. Of course, he would have to change his screen name. No references to the one that shall remain nameless. I think myfavoritesaintmartin would be good.

God Bless,
Michael