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oldcatholicguy
Guest
Probably the same way bleeding somehow restored the balance of humors in the body and fought off disease.
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manualman
Guest
It’s a better analogy than it’s creators realize. If we had a public wellness debacle of people foolishly heading out to sea (and great lakes) in small boats without the basic knowledge of seamanship necessary to survive and being killed and maimed in large numbers as a result, this would actually be a good analogy.
Send out poorly educated people in small boats into unpredictable waters and telling them not to worry, for they have donned life jackets. It’s “safe boating.” If that’s the full message, if people are being told that merely having a life jacket on and they’re good to go whenever and wherever… it would be an analogous public health disaster.
And the strange thing with this example is that I’m not aware of ANYBODY advocating a ban on condoms. Last time I checked, they were for sale for practically nothing at every gas station and drug store in America. What the Church objects to is the disinformation campaigns that pretend that a flimsy little thing will protect you from the consequences of irresponsible behavior. Thats true of both condoms and lifejackets.
But a better overall analogy is gang violence and bullet proof vests. Any idiot can see how education and handout campaigns to promote the wearing of bullet-proof vests is a poor response to gang shootings. It’s the underlying behavior that needs addressing!
Send out poorly educated people in small boats into unpredictable waters and telling them not to worry, for they have donned life jackets. It’s “safe boating.” If that’s the full message, if people are being told that merely having a life jacket on and they’re good to go whenever and wherever… it would be an analogous public health disaster.
And the strange thing with this example is that I’m not aware of ANYBODY advocating a ban on condoms. Last time I checked, they were for sale for practically nothing at every gas station and drug store in America. What the Church objects to is the disinformation campaigns that pretend that a flimsy little thing will protect you from the consequences of irresponsible behavior. Thats true of both condoms and lifejackets.
But a better overall analogy is gang violence and bullet proof vests. Any idiot can see how education and handout campaigns to promote the wearing of bullet-proof vests is a poor response to gang shootings. It’s the underlying behavior that needs addressing!
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oldcatholicguy
Guest
- How did you come up with this poorly thought out argument?
- Just because someone engages in an act does not mean they think the act is ok.
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vera_dicere
Guest
Interesting thing, back in 1960 there were what, only two STDs, gonorrhea and syphilis both could be treated with penicillin.
Now there’s over 25.
All in the period of about 50 years. So from 1AD to 1960 only 2 could be ID’d, now, thanks to that “sex out of wedlock is okay” and “have safe sex” botch up, there’s over 25.
Some of those can’t be treated with a little discreet trip to the chemist. Some impact on a woman’s fertility. Some will be with the person for the rest of their life. Some kill.
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Agatha813
Guest
What an exaggeration… A life-jacket is not the same as a condom. A condom prohibits a life from happening, whereas a life-jacket saves you from drowning. All this poster wants to do is spread their agenda on condoms. Seeing it as a “safe” way of having sex.
Psh, and even using a condom doesn’t guarantee that you won’t have a child, so why not jump into sex for the reason of procreating? It’s going to happen if you play with fire.
Psh, and even using a condom doesn’t guarantee that you won’t have a child, so why not jump into sex for the reason of procreating? It’s going to happen if you play with fire.
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Regular_Atheist
Guest
I don’t know. If you don’t want to use condoms, fine, but why the hell would you want to ban it for everyone? That sounds kind of dodgy. Perhaps a step towards a theocracy?
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Bill_Martin
Guest
I don’t know of anybody who wants to ban them. That would be ridiculous.
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Regular_Atheist
Guest
Quite right. That does, however, mean that the whole life-jacket thing is a strawman fallacy as it seems to imply that those who oppose contraception are trying to outlaw it completely.
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SamH
Guest
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JRKH
Guest
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BobCatholic
Guest
I’d ask why they are using a picture of a kid when the pro-condom people hate kids.
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CrimsonThorn
Guest
LOL This rigt here.
They MURDER kids, yet they want to save them with life jackets?
Who are truly the illogical ones eh?
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Corki
Guest
That may be why they seem to be ready to send a kid that young into a boat by himself with an oar twice his size.
Come to think of it, isn’t that the same message they send when they distribute condoms to 10 year olds in school? Just give them “protection” and it doesn’t matter if they are mature enough to go into dangerous waters.
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superamazingman
Guest
Oh, the irony is soooo rich.That may be why they seem to be ready to send a kid that young into a boat by himself with an oar twice his size.
Come to think of it, isn’t that the same message they send when they distribute condoms to 10 year olds in school? Just give them “protection” and it doesn’t matter if they are mature enough to go into dangerous waters.
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superamazingman
Guest
Who’s trying to ban them? All most of us want is to not pass them out in schools, and make people pay for it themselves. That’s not banning. That’s just the lack of “state condom sponsorship.”
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manualman
Guest
Easy there Cujo! Condoms are morally wrong, but using one is not remotely murderous. We’ll do best in public discussions if we don’t blur the issues and make leaps of logic that others might not follow. Maybe you’re asserting that contraception use of any sort leads to a mindset that increases abortion. I’d agree, but it’s another topic from the one at hand. Maybe these guys are abortion boosters too, but the primary message on the poster is about condoms. We’ll be more credible if we limit our responses to addresses the fallicies present ON the poster, not the deeper, more implicit, more easily argued ones.
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Regular_Atheist
Guest
It was all I could do to stop myself cursing here. What are you on about? You believe wearing condoms is murder? I think this is one of those times when Christians make assumptions or claims about others, normally due to prejudice against those people (like when Christians claim atheists believe nothing created the Earth). Fact is, people who use condoms don’t hate children because they don’t believe condom use is killing children. Because sperm isn’t children.
I don’t think they can really be compared. People don’t have natural urges to engage in gang shootings, and there isn’t really any pleasure or benefits gained by an individual when it comes to that kind of behaviour.
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manualman
Guest
Seriously? You think gangs are made up of comic book villains you can dismiss as “not like me?” I don’t agree. In fact, I think that one of the major problems we have in our society is to dismiss whole groups of people as “inscrutable” and therefore not wonder how they got that way. I think gang bangers are just regular people who went through a bad combination of poor environment, lack of opportunity, and short-sighted selfish decisions. I’ve made my fair share of short-sighted selfish decisions and I have to wonder sometimes how I would have turned out had I started life in that sort of inner city environment. They’re humans like you and me, which is why the analogy is a valid one. Sure there’s a difference in degree, but no analogy is perfect.
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Regular_Atheist
Guest
But, I have natural sexual urges. I’m sure you do too. People normally have these, and it does in fact seem that Christians, who as children are often forced to repress their sexuality/sexual urges as their parents have a strong hold over it, are more likely to be addicted to porn:
covenanteyes.com/2009/11/24/why-are-so-many-christians-addicted-to-porn/
However, I don’t have urges to join a gang or hurt people or deal drugs or whatever it is these gangs do. Everyone, however, has natural urges to have sex.
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manualman
Guest
You don’t have a temper? You never struggle with greed? You never are jealous when you perceive that people have it better than you? You’re a better man than me then!
Human frailties are more universal than most people like to think.
Human frailties are more universal than most people like to think.
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