Any parents *not* bring toddlers to Mass?

[jess7396]

As a huge proponent of the whole family going to Mass together, there have been times, with both my kids somewhere between ages 1 and 2, where I was simply unable to concentrate at all in Mass with them there, so, we went in shifts, it worked for us, the period lasted a couple of months with each child so far. We’ll see what happens when the new babe gets to that age .

 

[lilder]

Fergal:

Let me share a story that happened only today. I have called it

“THE SHORT DISTURBING VISIT THE LORD RECEIVED TODAY”

Thank you for sharing, Fergal!!! And such a perfect example.

Lilder

 

[KCT]

sparkle:

I deeply feel parents with toddlers who fuss, scream, fidgit should NOT be in Mass. MOST DO NOT WANT TO HEAR your screaming, fussing little ones in MASS.

I agree that I don’t want to hear screaming, but fidgeting? Nah, it doesn’t bother me a bit. Kids fidget; they can’t help it. When a child gets loud, I would expect a parent to take them out. Most parents in our parish are good about that. Some are not; they let the kid continue screaming. That does bother me. KCT

 

[Naphali]

My oldest daughter always came to mass with us – when she was small our church had a set up with an older, too small sanctuary, they left all the doors to it open and set up rows of chairs in the foyer – so we got there early every mass and vyed for a position in the foyer where we could see easily but Emma could play on the floor quietly.

Now we have a grand new sanctuary, stadium seating even (not kidding) and no place to take noisy kids. The doors to the foyer remain shut and they discourage parents from hiding behind the pews. We actually do that some days when the girls are sick or we go to one of the two masses that do not have child care – but for the masses in a weekend that they DO have childcare (we’re usually 11am mass people) I send my two littliest ones to nursery unless they’re sick – in which case we go back into hiding …

There’s simply no room between the pews to play, there’s no chance two 2 year olds are going to be quiet for an hour and a half, and I can’t concentrate at all on what’s being said when I’m busy worrying about what they’re doing …

They also have an AMAZING track record for bashing their heads into pews when they try to sit with us, AMAZING – it’s this little tiny space between the rows of seats and they invariably climb down there to get something and then bash their heads into the pew in front … scream, cry, one parent runs out of the church … distressed twin gets upset for crying sister, scream, cry, other parent trys desperately to gather belongings begs 4 year old to help blah blah blah …

so we send them to nursery … they’ll be 3 this coming March – they will be graduating to “big church” at 3 (God willing!!!) and they do go sometimes for special occasions still but it’s not pleasant for any of us.

:tiphat: Hats off to everyone with quieter kids than mine! I am very impressed and glad you can go as a group!

 

[chimakuni]

Mrs. R - if I knew then what I know now! I had two toddlers, fourteen months apart. Going to Mass with them and our six year old at times was hell. My husband was often at work, out of necessity and would go to Mass in another town, which was not feasible for us.

One day, when the priest said, “The Mass has ended, let us go in peace to love and serve the Lord”…and we responded “Thanks be to God” I realized that that phrase must have been “coined” by a mother who had all of her little ones at Mass with her and was at her wits end! THANKS BE TO GOD! THE MASS IS ENDED!!! I can hear her shout…no, wait! That was me shouting.

If I had to do it over again, I believe I would have found a way to be able to go to Mass with our older son and leave the two little ones at home. They go to Mass with us all the time now and are wonderful participants, but those first four years were not fun!

I now look at moms of little ones and recall the days…I smile - I remember how hard it was and I admire those moms for sticking it out. It does get better! God Bless

 

[Lorarose]

My husband and I go to mass in shifts and I make no apologies for it whatsoever.

 

[kristalyn]

We bring all of our kids–5 of them, ages 12 months to 15 years. I would never dream of going to church in shifts.

The International Pilgrim Virgin statue from Fatima was in our parish this week, and so far this week, we have been to church: 1. for Sunday mass; 2. Sunday afternoon to adoration; 3. Tuesday night for the arrival of the statue; 4. Wednesday morning mass (me alone, with 3 kids), 4. Wednesday night for the rosary and adoration and a reception. Our baby who turned 1 on Saturday has been to all of that, as has my 5 year old almost-kindergartner.

Know what? I survived. My kids survived. Here and there, the 1 year old got noisy so I took her to the back so she could walk around a little bit, but even that didnt’ happen every time.

Kids learn to be good in church by going to church.

I tried to take her out of the chapel where we went for Adoration on SUnday afternoon; we were at a picnic at a local convent. I was walking in the hall with her, because she was fussing and one of the dear sisters came out and instructed me: TAKE HER back in there!! I said no, it’s ok, she’s not too happy. Sister said–you take her to Jesus, then!! Don’t deny her Jesus because she is sad–you take her to Jesus!!! So, in we went. I"m sure the Lord loves to see my kids.

They are well-behaved, and it’s because they know that’s what we do: we go to church. I sincerely hope that my kids would be the kind of kids who would voluntarily go to the chapel for adoration, because they know that God is there. They know how to get there, how to act there, they know they are welcome there.

No one in our parish has ever complained about our kids. Our kids are quiet, so I don’t know what the complaint would be, but if anyone has one, they’ve kept it to themselves!! It’s our parish as much as anyone else’s, and I am taking my kids to church!!

 

[lizziebeth730]

I think what Sparkle is trying to say is something like this:

Us folk who do not have children, or have older children, don’t mind that there are kids at mass. We understand that babies cry. We understand that toddlers fidget.It’s when babies are wailing and toddlers are behaving like Church is the playground that we get annoyed and irritated. Parents who allow their infants to wail through mass are a disruption to others. Pick up the baby, walk to the back of the church, bob it around, change it, what have you and when they’ve settled down return to your pew. When your toddler is behaving like a jerk, bend down, talk to him with clenched teeth and tell him to knock it off and if they continue… take them to the back and explain in no uncertain terms that this is not the place to behave like your about to go on the monkey bars.

I’m the baby of 5. At Easter this year, there were a bunch of C&E catholics, who’s children haven’t been to mass more than a handfull of times, and have no idea how to behave, rather than discipling these kids, they let them run around and yell like little tyrants. My brothers and sister and I were discussing how we were NEVER allowed to behave that way when we were little.

We were allowed one small non noisy toy ( a barbie, a stuffed animal, once we could read a childrens bible story book) and a bag of cheerios. If we became disruptive we were taken to the back and warned if this continues we wouldn’t be sitting down for a while from the spanking we would be recieving. We were always complimented on our good behavior, and our cute clothes ( although we now look at those pictures and wonder how we’re not in therapy now, or how our parents could love us so little …70’s 80’s clothes were tragic). Our parents purposely chose the Childrens mass on Christmas, mostly cause little kids are unruly before Santa comes, and the kids of the parish were allowed to participate. We still go to that so everyone but my brother and I can oooohhh and ahhhh over how cute the kids are.

 

[Brad]

lizziebeth730:

I think what Sparkle is trying to say is something like this:

Us folk who do not have children, or have older children, don’t mind that there are kids at mass. We understand that babies cry. We understand that toddlers fidget.It’s when babies are wailing and toddlers are behaving like Church is the playground that we get annoyed and irritated. Parents who allow their infants to wail through mass are a disruption to others. Pick up the baby, walk to the back of the church, bob it around, change it, what have you and when they’ve settled down return to your pew. When your toddler is behaving like a jerk, bend down, talk to him with clenched teeth and tell him to knock it off and if they continue… take them to the back and explain in no uncertain terms that this is not the place to behave like your about to go on the monkey bars.

I’m the baby of 5. At Easter this year, there were a bunch of C&E catholics, who’s children haven’t been to mass more than a handfull of times, and have no idea how to behave, rather than discipling these kids, they let them run around and yell like little tyrants. My brothers and sister and I were discussing how we were NEVER allowed to behave that way when we were little.

We were allowed one small non noisy toy ( a barbie, a stuffed animal, once we could read a childrens bible story book) and a bag of cheerios. If we became disruptive we were taken to the back and warned if this continues we wouldn’t be sitting down for a while from the spanking we would be recieving. We were always complimented on our good behavior, and our cute clothes ( although we now look at those pictures and wonder how we’re not in therapy now, or how our parents could love us so little …70’s 80’s clothes were tragic). Our parents purposely chose the Childrens mass on Christmas, mostly cause little kids are unruly before Santa comes, and the kids of the parish were allowed to participate. We still go to that so everyone but my brother and I can oooohhh and ahhhh over how cute the kids are.

With all due respect- and I have young kids that are very well behaved and I follow many of the proceudre you mention when necessary - I think what Sparkle is saying, and some of your comments to an extent, are rude and uncaring to young families.
It’s not as easy as you think. We’ve lost enough young families - we don’t need to lose more that are trying.

The Church should be a welcome place for children no matter what. If a family is having a hard time, be part of the solution rather than thinking of the kids as tyrants.

 

[theAuthor]

This is sooooo relevant. I was once under the impression that it was the parents’ fault if their chldren weren’t perfect little angels. It’s one of those things I look back on now and “how naiive that was!” Kids are kids. We try the whole “shh it’s church, quiet”, the soft toys, etc. No dice with the toddler, but he’s a good kid overall.

Today we left after the homily, because of the stares we were getting about or toddler and the very** mild **fussing of our baby.

We are new Catholics. All the priests we have spoken to say “just bring them to Mass, it doesn’t matter if they make noise.” ** I fully agree that it is distracting to the other parishoners and I am very sorry for that,** but there is no creche/crying room. Our toddler is considered even at 3 to be too young for childrens’ liturgy.

So we are torn between the Church’s teachings that we must attend Mass every Sunday, that all contraception is inherently evil, being embarrassed at annoying other people celebrating. It just doesn’t line up.

If you belong to a Church that teaches that all contraception is inherently evil, and Sunday Mass attendence is manditory, you are always going to have families with little children at Mass. My wife said if people are annoyed (like Sparkle), contact the Vatican and see how far you get. The Catholic Church has always been I am told a family church.

I find it keenly embarrasing that my kid annoys others, but I have confessed that what the RCC teaches is true. It teaches that we cannot prevent having more children (we have no social support like grandparents, etc) and must go to Mass on Sunday at the Lord’s command. So as an earlier poster said, this “season” will last a long time.

Why don’t Sparkle and her ilk write to Pope Benedict and ask him for a special dispensation for us to not attend Mass during the season while we are having a family?

As for splitting up, that is rediculous. In our former protestant faith where contraception is smiled upon, there are creches and no-one would dream of separating the family. Seems just so topsy turvey to me.

 

[Biblioassistant]

I’m the baby of 5. At Easter this year, there were a bunch of C&E catholics, who’s children haven’t been to mass more than a handfull of times, and have no idea how to behave, rather than discipling these kids, they let them run around and yell like little tyrants. My brothers and sister and I were discussing how we were NEVER allowed to behave that way when we were little.

I’m the oldest of 9. My parents simply would not let us misbehave at Mass. They let us know that this was God’s house and He was there and we were not to be loud and misbehave. If we did, they took us outside and reminded us. It’s not that we were robots or scared, but we knew better. I know that babies cry and toddlers get restless - but when parents won’t bother to take them out or correct them, then I feel very uncharitable.

 

[Tweety]

I have a 3yr old son, soon to be 4 in September. My husband is not Catholic and can work extremely long hours - 6 days a week. I take my son to Mass during the week if i go and he goes with me most Saturday nights 6pm, if i go then. Mostly i attend 8am Sunday Mass and Sunday mornings he wants to stay with daddy, as daddy is gone when he wakes up most mornings and comes home late some days. They have a very special and close bond, and they need the time together. My priest said that this is fine…

When he was younger i got embarassed as he threw a biscuit in front of our pew and as we were in the front row, it landed near our Priest. I did not bring him back for a month i think, i felt horrible, even though it was no big deal! A little biscuit! One elderly lady who teaches RE to children attending non Catholic schools has told me many times that the children are the future of the Church, and they should be there.

2 weeks ago my son and i went to Mass, and the lovely couple behind us have a little girl my son’s age and a baby boy who is crawling… She started smiling at Braden etc and my son started to wander up the pew on his knees, then onto the floor…underneath the pew (hit his head coming back up) and then into the main aisle. He ignored me which is very rare and the more i asked him to come to me and sit down with his book, dog, biscuits, drink etc… the more he went towards the little girl. He is such a good little boy at Mass, he knows that we are in Amen’s house (easier for him to say Amen than Church when he was younger) and we have to be quiet and respectful. I have had lots of comments about how well behaved he is, but that week - Aaaagh! (Normally, the most fidgety he gets is when he imitates the Priest, and it really is quite funny. I checked with a Priest, as even though i found it funny, i thought others may not, and he thought as i did. Phew! i was worried for a while. He said he did it as a child too, so maybe it is a sign! ) The other parents didn’t care that their child was distracting mine and because of trying to get my son to listen to me, i was distracted and never got to hear the homily properly. Next time, as lovely as they are, we will not be sitting so close to them. I *also * want to respect the other parishioners who come there to hear the word of God.

We have no ‘crying room’ in our parish, and where i live, i have only ever seen one Church that has one. I believe that there is always room for children in Gods house, Jesus said to let the little children come to him… .

I have no problem with other children playing up - just not mine!

 

[theAuthor]

I’m the oldest of 9. My parents simply would not let us misbehave at Mass. They let us know that this was God’s house and He was there and we were not to be loud and misbehave. If we did, they took us outside and reminded us. It’s not that we were robots or scared, but we knew better. I know that babies cry and toddlers get restless - but when parents won’t bother to take them out or correct them, then I feel very uncharitable.

That is very interesting. If you are the oldest of 9, how old are you now? What period was it when you were 3 yo, like 1970’s for example? Can you even remember being 3, or even 5?

Also was it a time when giving your kid a smack was frowned on and could get you into trouble? HOW were you disciplined? How were you taught that you had to behave? Especially*** what ***was said/happened outside the church? I was taught through shame that I was to be like the dog on the mantlepiece “seen and not heard.” It has scarred me to this day and I am still painfully shy in groups and get embarrassed easily. I perspire heavily with nerves in social conversation.

We certainly do take our kids outside. I do tell my toddler that we whisper in church. The other trick I have been told is to flick him really hard on the ear (worked for our sponsor with 6 kids-no result for us). I take the toddler outside *and *correct him, but really, when my wife and I were dating at 20 yo, she didn’t understand the liturgy, refused to genuflect. I think maybe you are wearing glasses, friend and they may be coloured rose. Kids will play up even if you correct them and take them outside.

To Tweety:

Good on you. We relate. Will (our nearly 3yo always wants to wave and say hi to the people in the pew in front of us). Last week during our Confirmation he went up and sat in the priest’s chair, and the priest joked that one day he would be ordained, so that was nice.

 

[Tweety]

To Tweety:

Good on you. We relate. Will (our nearly 3yo always wants to wave and say hi to the people in the pew in front of us). Last week during our Confirmation he went up and sat in the priest’s chair, and the priest joked that one day he would be ordained, so that was nice.

I have no problem with a bit of friendship happening inbetween the pews… I love what your son Will did. Braden copies the Priest when he is preparing for Holy Communion… It’s soooo cute.

God Bless the little terrors, they are the future of our Church, and as I said in another post: 'all attempts to change this will be futile! '

 

[HouseArrest]

Wow I’m in awe of some of you here – taking all your kids to Mass every week and being successful!

My husband and I split and leave the little ones home but I think this practice originated from all our schedules. One of our kid’s is an altar server (with another being trained this summer) and two of them sing in the school’s choir. My husband and I both sell the scrip after Mass certain weeks, we have soccer games (yes, on Sundays, can you believe it?) and so we just make sure we get the four older kids in Kindergarten and above to Mass and leave the three little ones at home. I will sometimes take the little ones to Mass during the week.

I may have missed it on this thread but do any of you have the same problem – I am scheduled to do sell at one Mass, my daughter and son are singing at another, etc. It makes it difficult to attend Mass together (unless we go twice).

A friend of mine has it worse. One week she herself went to Mass 4 times.

 

[Biblioassistant]

That is very interesting. If you are the oldest of 9, how old are you now? What period was it when you were 3 yo, like 1970’s for example? Can you even remember being 3, or even 5?

I am 56. I was born in 1951. Yes I remember very well what it was like when I was 3 and 5. I had a little missal with lots of pictures, and other books to look at while I was at church. My parents took us to the low Mass (they were all in Latin) which was short until we were older and then we got to go to the High Mass.

 

[LilyM]

That is very interesting. If you are the oldest of 9, how old are you now? What period was it when you were 3 yo, like 1970’s for example? Can you even remember being 3, or even 5?

Also was it a time when giving your kid a smack was frowned on and could get you into trouble? HOW were you disciplined? How were you taught that you had to behave? Especially*** what ***was said/happened outside the church? I was taught through shame that I was to be like the dog on the mantlepiece “seen and not heard.” It has scarred me to this day and I am still painfully shy in groups and get embarrassed easily. I perspire heavily with nerves in social conversation.

We certainly do take our kids outside. I do tell my toddler that we whisper in church. The other trick I have been told is to flick him really hard on the ear (worked for our sponsor with 6 kids-no result for us). I take the toddler outside *and *correct him, but really, when my wife and I were dating at 20 yo, she didn’t understand the liturgy, refused to genuflect. I think maybe you are wearing glasses, friend and they may be coloured rose. Kids will play up even if you correct them and take them outside.

Unpopular or not, I was certainly given a smack (always outside or at home of course) if I acted up in church when I was a child back in the 70s - only as a last resort rather than a first one, of course.

Although my Mum had a trick of giving us a pinch instead, so others wouldn’t see her but would certainly see us if we reacted to it!

 

[RWMorris]

I disagree with most of these posts. I think Mass is a place that is also for children. Anybody remember, “Let the little children come to Me”?
We took all our four children to Mass from day one and yes, it was occasionally a struggle but we got nothing but encouragement from the other parishioners.
It is worth it in the long run.

 

[BeeSweet]

My son turned one year old a few weeks ago. He’s a real wriggler. I always make the effort to take him with me every week. My husband is not Catholic, and doesn’t attend any kind of Sunday services, so If I don’t take my son to church, no one will. The few times I’ve not taken him, he seems to be out of practice the next week. Really, both of us are out of practice, he’s out of practice being reasonably quiet and still, and I’m out of practice helping him stay that way! I think it’s important that he doesn’t remember a time when he didn’t go with me to church. If I just left him at home with his dad, I think it would be much harder for me to get him to start coming with me later on, because he’ll probably rather be home playing with Daddy.

One trick I was told is to have a special set of church toys that he only sees when he’s at church. That way, he’s not already bored with the toys that I bring. He has lots of board books in his bag. He loves story time at home, so when I pull out the books at church he’s usually very happy and contented even though we’re not actually reading, but just flipping through the pages. Thankfully, I’m nearly always complimented by those around me on how good of a baby he is during mass. It’s not easy, I don’t get to fully participate and focus on the mass myself, but I know that the hard work will really pay off some day. I fantasize that some day my son will convert my husband!:heaven:

 

[Teakafrog]

How can they learn how to be good if they’re never expected to???
Children will either live up to, or down to, your expectations.

We take our 2yr old and baby (4mo) as well as 10yr old every week. They are expected to sit quietly and not be a distraction. We take them to the back to settle if needed, then sit back down. The toddler knows that church time is quiet time, and she will look at a book or something, usually just cuddle with us, and people watch. It can be done. They just need to know that you won’t tolerate wildness.
We also have an awesome priest, and if a baby or toddler does get loud, he tells the whole congregation, “Now don’t you get upset about that little one, she’s just praising God the only way she knows how!” Gotta love that!