Any recommended reading for potential participant in a mixed marriage?

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CredoUnumDeum

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Hi,

I’m blessed to be in a relationship with a wonderful Catholic man, but I have a close friend who is on the point of engagement to a Protestant guy. He is 5+ years older than her, and an apparently hardcore Protestant. I have a long list of reasons why I object to him as a suitable partner in marriage for anyone, especially not a friend, but the one I want to get some advice about is the religious aspect.

From the beginning, he made it clear that he has no interest in converting whatsoever. He has conceded the point on the education of any children as Catholics, but the onus of that will be entirely on her.

The more I have discussed this with her, the more troubled I become. The last thing she told me was that ‘he will be the spiritual head of our house’ so they will not be having a Nuptial Mass. This seems intrinsically dangerous to me, to enter a mixed marriage with the attitude that you will submit to your husband even on this one issue upon which you as a Catholic cannot compromise. She said the idea of him as spiritual head was something she has conceded to, but the idea was his, and he ‘felt strongly’ about it. Again, this to me is a red flag, because it belies his real feelings about this topic, and about how firmly entrenched their disparity on this subject will be.

Now, I’m hardly meddling. She is a grown woman and can make her own decisions. But as a friend, I’m worried about her from a salvation-standpoint–I don’t want to see her lose her Faith and end up in a broken marriage–and I think she’s making a huge mistake in having let a relationship with this man get so far. What I’m looking for is suggested readings (books, articles, quotes) that might be useful in provoking some thought and soul-searching in her heart. I’m not looking to beat her over the head, just to give her pause. Please also keep her in your prayers.
 
I am not sure what the “head of household” thing means in the context of a Protestant-Catholic marriage- I am sure other posters can address that. But I just wanted to point out a few things:
  1. He does not have to convert, and if they get a dispensation their marriage will be both valid and sacramental.
  2. They also do not need to have a Nuptial Mass, and this actually might be discouraged by the priest since both parties are not Catholic. This is not, as you say, something a Catholic “cannot compromise”- so you might be a bit misguided here.
It is nice that you are concerned, and certainly marrying a Protestant should not be something a Catholic takes lightly, since there will be additional issues to work out. However, provided that your friend takes the appropriate course of action with her engagement (obtaining a dispensation, etc.) their difference in religion is something for them to work out amongst themselves and with the guidance of her priest.

Have you tried talking to her about your concerns? I think treading lightly here is a good idea- it’s okay to ask her out of curiosity what it will look like to have him as the spiritual leader, and to talk about it- but remember that the Church does allow this and he has agreed to raising their children as Catholics.
 
Lorelei12 said:
  1. They also do not need to have a Nuptial Mass, and this actually might be discouraged by the priest since both parties are not Catholic. This is not, as you say, something a Catholic “cannot compromise”- so you might be a bit misguided here.
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Correct. A mass would likely be discouraged by the priest since the groom could not receive communion. Wouldn’t this seem a little awkward to you?

My husband is Coptic Orthodox and we got married in the RCC. Our priest recommended against having a mass since the groom and his entire family would not be taking communion. It seemed to be an unnecessary way to divide the group on such a unitive day.
 
Lorelei12 said:
I am not sure what the “head of household” thing means in the context of a Protestant-Catholic marriage- I am sure other posters can address that. But I just wanted to point out a few things:
  1. He does not have to convert, and if they get a dispensation their marriage will be both valid and sacramental.
  2. They also do not need to have a Nuptial Mass, and this actually might be discouraged by the priest since both parties are not Catholic. This is not, as you say, something a Catholic “cannot compromise”- so you might be a bit misguided here.
It is nice that you are concerned, and certainly marrying a Protestant should not be something a Catholic takes lightly, since there will be additional issues to work out. However, provided that your friend takes the appropriate course of action with her engagement (obtaining a dispensation, etc.) their difference in religion is something for them to work out amongst themselves and with the guidance of her priest.

Have you tried talking to her about your concerns? I think treading lightly here is a good idea- it’s okay to ask her out of curiosity what it will look like to have him as the spiritual leader, and to talk about it- but remember that the Church does allow this and he has agreed to raising their children as Catholics.
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I do understand all the ‘rules’ about mixed marriages, and that it is allowed by the Church, etc. I’m not condemning her, I just think it’s a dangerous choice, and I feel like the least I can do as a friend is to innocuously present some food for thought.

(We have and do talk about this–she is open to conversation about it)
 
Honestly, it sounds like you have many reasons that you don’t like this person and you’re going to try to use faith as the common ground with your friend to get her to not marry him.

You said you’re not meddling, but you are treading very close to the edge of the meddling pool. Giving her reading material at this point will be jumping right in.
 
I have many reasons I don’t think he is marriage material–but he is a kind and wonderful person, so that is not accurate.

I’m a little confused as to why everyone’s response seems to be a dismissive ‘well it’s allowed’. So are altar girls :-p
 
Everyone’s response is that it’s allowed is because- it is allowed. There is no Catholic doctrine that does not allow your friend to marry this person and it sounds like she is planning to have a very valid marriage (in church, agreeing to raise her children Catholic).

You haven’t provided anything that the Church would find objectionable. Therefore, your concerns seem more personal than faith-based. Yes, your friend will have challenges in a mixed marriage, but that doesn’t automatically doom her to losing her faith.

Not sure what the altar girl comment is supposed to be about.
 
CredoUnumDeum said:
I have many reasons I don’t think he is marriage material–but he is a kind and wonderful person, so that is not accurate.

I’m a little confused as to why everyone’s response seems to be a dismissive ‘well it’s allowed’. So are altar girls :-p
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What do altar girls have to do with anything? :confused:

There is no reason for you to impose rules on others that the Church herself does not impose. While certainly a mixed marriage has unique challenges, this is not something for you to decide. This isn’t “dismissive”, but sometimes there is a problem on this forum where people have misguided ideas about what the church actually teaches.

It does not sound like any of your friend’s plans are out of line with church teaching, so if you’d like to keep your friendship, I would recommend letting her priest and/or whoever is responsible for their marriage preparation address interfaith issues.
 
They can start right here on this forum, reading some of the threads where people are at odds with their non-Catholic spouse!
 
Have they thoroughly discussed issues such as no birth control and the hassles of NFP abstaining, charting, etc? Does he truly understand marriage as a Sacrament that leaves a mark on the soul and therefore it cannot be dissolved by a divorce? No divorce and later remarriage is something Protestants really don’t understand, I certainly didn’t. Have they thoroughly discussed the children born during the marriage being raised Catholic and all that entails such as religious ed classes and weekly Masses and teaching them the faith at home as well as being out for Holy Days of Obligation and have they discussed the liturgical calendar and how celebrations and customs can upset the routine? There are an awful lot of details that can be a pain to a non-Catholic.
 
CredoUnumDeum said:

"From the beginning, he made it clear that he has no interest in converting whatsoever. He has conceded the point on the education of any children as Catholics, but the onus of that will be entirely on her.

“The more I have discussed this with her, the more troubled I become. The last thing she told me was that ‘he will be the spiritual head of our house’ so they will not be having a Nuptial Mass.”

My concern is about the interaction between those two paragraphs. On the one hand, he is to be the spiritual head of their house. On the other hand, she will have to do all of the education of their children as Catholics. I think there is an obvious contradiction between those two things. You can’t really say at the same time, “I’m the spiritual head of our household” and “You’re on your own, babe.” I think that either 1) he isn’t going to be spiritual head of the household or 2) he’s going to interfere with their hypothetical kids’ religious education. The only question is whether it’s going to be the one or the other. I don’t really see any alternatives.
 
MJJean said:

“Have they thoroughly discussed the children born during the marriage being raised Catholic and all that entails such as religious ed classes and weekly Masses and teaching them the faith at home as well as being out for Holy Days of Obligation and have they discussed the liturgical calendar and how celebrations and customs can upset the routine? There are an awful lot of details that can be a pain to a non-Catholic.”

Yes, that’s quite right.
 
Country_Gal said:
They can start right here on this forum, reading some of the threads where people are at odds with their non-Catholic spouse!
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They can also read the threads about those of us who are very happily married to non-Catholics.
 
Country_Gal said:
True enough. They need to go into this with open eyes.
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I completely agree. However, it isn’t the OP who is considering marrying a protestant man, but her friend. If the friend is going through Catholic marriage prep, than I think the OP needs to butt out. She has expressed her concerns. She can continue to be a friend and be available to discuss issues, but she can’t tell the friend what to do and she definately shouldn’t create obstacles the Church doesn’t create.

I do not recommend that Catholics seriously date non-Catholics, but it seems the friend and protestant boyfriend are past that point.
 
Mrs_Sally said:
I completely agree. However, it isn’t the OP who is considering marrying a protestant man, but her friend. If the friend is going through Catholic marriage prep, than I think the OP needs to butt out. She has expressed her concerns. She can continue to be a friend and be available to discuss issues, but she can’t tell the friend what to do and she definately shouldn’t create obstacles the Church doesn’t create.
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👍
 
Mrs_Sally said:
I completely agree. However, it isn’t the OP who is considering marrying a protestant man, but her friend. If the friend is going through Catholic marriage prep, than I think the OP needs to butt out. She has expressed her concerns. She can continue to be a friend and be available to discuss issues, but she can’t tell the friend what to do and she definately shouldn’t create obstacles the Church doesn’t create.

I do not recommend that Catholics seriously date non-Catholics, but it seems the friend and protestant boyfriend are past that point.
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The problem is that in a lot of places catholic marriage prep seems to really drop the ball. I know an awful lot of folks who were never told that they weren’t supposed to contracept, that they were supposed to go to Mass on Holy Days, that divorce is only an option in extreme situations and remarriage wasn’t an option without annulment, or given anything to think about regarding the day to day business of running a home and raising Catholic kids other than " You have to try your best to raise the kids Catholic." So, I think this friends concerns are perfectly valid.
 
Miss_Felicity said:
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To be clear…I am not trying to obstruct her potential marriage or break up her relationship. Nor am I looking to hand her a homework list. I simply (as I said from the beginning) want to find some clear, Catholic, charitable articles, quotes etc (esp from Saints or encyclicals) that pertain to why the Church may now allow it, but has always discouraged it. My thought was to post some general things on my facebook page or my blog, as public, non-specific posts, and if she chose to read them, or noticed them and the Holy Spirit acted to give her any direction from them, so be it. If not, then not. I’m trying to fulfill my duty as a Catholic to offer example and reiteration of the words and advice of the Church/holy men and women for the sake of a friend’s soul, do with it what God and she will do.

However, if this thread is just going to turn into people telling me why I should butt out, then those people are, unfortunately, missing my point entirely, and it’s rather silly to continue to hound you all for suggestions so begrudgingly given. 😉 No worries, I’ll pray about it some more and look elsewhere. Please do keep her in your prayers!
 
CredoUnumDeum said:
To be clear…I am not trying to obstruct her potential marriage or break up her relationship. Nor am I looking to hand her a homework list. I simply (as I said from the beginning) want to find some clear, Catholic, charitable articles, quotes etc (esp from Saints or encyclicals) that pertain to why the Church may now allow it, but has always discouraged it. My thought was to post some general things on my facebook page or my blog, as public, non-specific posts, and if she chose to read them, or noticed them and the Holy Spirit acted to give her any direction from them, so be it. If not, then not. I’m trying to fulfill my duty as a Catholic to offer example and reiteration of the words and advice of the Church/holy men and women for the sake of a friend’s soul, do with it what God and she will do.

However, if this thread is just going to turn into people telling me why I should butt out, then those people are, unfortunately, missing my point entirely, and it’s rather silly to continue to hound you all for suggestions so begrudgingly given. 😉 No worries, I’ll pray about it some more and look elsewhere. Please do keep her in your prayers!
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This is a bit different from what your first post sounded like. There are some excellent books about Catholic marriage that I would recommend to you that you could post about.

Three to Get Married by Bishop Sheen
Marriage is for Keeps by John Kipley
For Better Forever by Georgory Popcak
 
CredoUnumDeum said:
To be clear…I am not trying to obstruct her potential marriage or break up her relationship. Nor am I looking to hand her a homework list. I simply (as I said from the beginning) **want to find some clear, Catholic, charitable articles, quotes etc (esp from Saints or encyclicals) that pertain to why the Church may now allow it, but has always discouraged it. My thought was to post some general things on my facebook page or my blog, as public, non-specific posts, **and if she chose to read them, or noticed them and the Holy Spirit acted to give her any direction from them, so be it. If not, then not. I’m trying to fulfill my duty as a Catholic to offer example and reiteration of the words and advice of the Church/holy men and women for the sake of a friend’s soul, do with it what God and she will do.
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The books MrsSally posted are great books.

But unless you have half a dozen friends getting married to non-Catholics, don’t you think your friend will know what you are doing?

Doesn’t what you plan on doing sound a little passive/aggressive?
However, if this thread is just going to turn into people telling me why I should butt out, then those people are, unfortunately, missing my point entirely, and it’s rather silly to continue to hound you all for suggestions so begrudgingly given. 😉 No worries, I’ll pray about it some more and look elsewhere. Please do keep her in your prayers!
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We are telling you that you should think before you act.

And that if the Church allows something like interfaith marriages or altar girls, then you should take that into consideration before you tell someone that it is wrong.

We aren’t missing the point. We are telling you that you need to see other points.
 
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