Any young earth creationists out there?

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Literalist interpretation isn’t the same as literal interpretation.

And scientific reason is a valid reason. Also the chapters of genesis were not seeking to be a scientific account. More of a poetic explanation of TRUTH. Like after a certain point in job the reader isn’t bound to take it literally since it’s in verse
 
Here it is:

“15. But he must not on that account consider that it is forbidden, when just cause exists, to push inquiry and exposition beyond what the Fathers have done; provided he carefully observes the rule so wisely laid down by St. Augustine-not to depart from the literal and obvious sense, except only where reason makes it untenable or necessity requires;(40) a rule to which it is the more necessary to adhere strictly in these times, when the thirst for novelty and unrestrained freedom of thought make the danger of error most real and proximate. Neither should those passages be neglected which the Fathers have understood in an allegorical or figurative sense, more especially when such interpretation is justified by the literal, and when it rests on the authority of many.”
 
I asked you to prove it and you haven’t.

Second time I’ll ask. Prove it
 
Are there any young earth creationists out there? Does anyone want to discuss it? Does anyone have any questions about it? Do you believe it is ridiculous? Do you think it is 100% without a doubt the truth? Please give me your thoughts. I would like to get a discussion going.
Hi. I suppose I believe the young earth society is as you say ridiculous. BUT in your defense, I don’t know much about it so I should be more open minded. Growing up, I always felt a weakening of my faith if it does not go along with the general idea of science. As a result, I felt a great strength in reading The Confessions where Augustine famiusly says that he believed it quite possible the world was not made in 7 days. As Augustine played a role in the binding of the bible, this gives me confidence. I do recommend The confessions to those who want to see how taking Genesis literally is not an old fashioned idea, but possibly a more modern idea.
 
What? That the Early Church Fathers were creationists (young earth)?
 
Here it is:

“15. But he must not on that account consider that it is forbidden, when just cause exists, to push inquiry and exposition beyond what the Fathers have done; provided he carefully observes the rule so wisely laid down by St. Augustine-not to depart from the literal and obvious sense, except only where reason makes it untenable or necessity requires;(40) a rule to which it is the more necessary to adhere strictly in these times, when the thirst for novelty and unrestrained freedom of thought make the danger of error most real and proximate. Neither should those passages be neglected which the Fathers have understood in an allegorical or figurative sense, more especially when such interpretation is justified by the literal, and when it rests on the authority of many.”
Umm… you realize that your quote (which I’d already quoted to you, upthread) actually says the opposite of what you’re claiming… right?

Leo is saying that it’s not forbidden to go beyond what the ECFs have said. He wants us to be careful and not just throw them out with the bathwater, but he’s definitely saying that there’s room for subsequent interpretation and understanding, even if it might be at odds with the ECFs… 😉
 
Semper Catholicus is right about Leo XIII.
“15. But he must not on that account consider that it is forbidden, when just cause exists, to push inquiry and exposition beyond what the Fathers have done; provided he carefully observes the rule so wisely laid down by St. Augustine-not to depart from the literal and obvious sense, except only where reason makes it untenable or necessity requires; a rule to which it is the more necessary to adhere strictly in these times, when the thirst for novelty and unrestrained freedom of thought make the danger of error most real and proximate.”

And JanSobieskiIII is right about St Augustine of Hippo.
“It not infrequently happens that something about the earth, about the sky, about other elements of this world, about the motion and rotation or even the magnitude and distances of the stars, about definite eclipses of the sun and moon, about the passage of years and seasons, about the nature of animals, of fruits, of stones, and of other such things, may be known with the greatest certainty by reasoning or by experience, even by one who is not a Christian.
It is too disgraceful and ruinous, though, and greatly to be avoided, that he [the non-Christian] should hear a Christian speaking so idiotically on these matters, and as if in accord with Christian writings, that he might say that he could scarcely keep from laughing when he saw how totally in error they are.” (From The Literal Interpretation of Genesis 1:19–20, Chapt. 19)

Neither Leo XIII not Augustine had any idea of the extent to which reason would ever be able to explain the world, but both were remarkably prescient in warning Christians against sticking too dogmatically to a literal interpretation of the bible when “reason makes it untenable”.

The same sentiment was expressed by Pope Benedict XVI, in his Regensburg address, and Pope Francis, in his address to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences.

I personally agree with Gorgias. Christianity, and specifically Catholic Christianity, is to me, a supremely rational religion. But I am aware that this is neither true, nor necessary, among some of our correspondents here, and rather than condemn them out of hand, I think we should extend a hand of tolerance. At a simple level there is a danger of people not understanding the ‘rationality of God’, and fearing that in championing rationality one champions scientism, and rejects God altogether. Clearly this is not what either the Church, nor the Popes quoted, actually believe, but insecurity can make people cling to simplicity rather than sophistication.
 
You’re right. Augustine didn’t believe in 6 24 hour periods creation, but he did believe that everything was create instantaneously by God. Not over 13.7 billion years.
 
I was quoting to show my point about the literal interpretation, not the Early Church Fathers.
 
I personally believe the universe is 14 billion ish years old. Could God have created it in less? Yes- he has that power. If he did that I would expect him to leave evidence of that among the stars. The fact he didn’t gives me three choices:
1- The universe is old
2- God is a liar
3- we’re misinterpreting the data
I dislike option 2, option 3 is unlikely due to the sheer volume of evidence, which leaves me with option 1.
Evolution is a separate topic for a separate thread.
 
Here’s a starting point:
Code:
  Answers in Genesis
Sorry, Semper Catholicus, but I’m not a fan of Answers in Genesis. I think they are less concerned with the message of Christ than they are in the fruitless attempt to misinterpret the evidence for evolution. That campaign is both frankly dishonest and also theologically irrelevant, and I would not advise sincere six-day literalists to get swallowed up by it. Stick to your simplicity and all will be well.
 
Sounds like an ad hominem almost.

You debunk the arguments they present, not THEM.
 
What? So you don’t believe that the environment changes over time?

I believe that God created the universe instantly. That doesn’t make me a young earth creationist. I acknowledge that the world changed over time.
 
Sounds like an ad hominem almost.

You debunk the arguments they present, not THEM.
I do. I have. That’s why I know that some of them are deliberately, I might say sinfully, dishonest. However, few of them are Catholic, I think.
 
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