Anybody up for a discussion on the Sacrament of Penance?

[contemplative]

Quaere Verum:

Let’s start with mortal sin. I know in order for a sin to be considered mortal one of the conditions is that it must be a grave matter. The CCC states that a “grave matter is specified by the Ten Commandments, corresponding to the answer of Jesus to the rich young man: 'Do not kill, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor your father and your mother.”

This is confusing to me. Are all sins against the 10 Commandments considered grave? Don’t the 10 Commandments encompass all sin both venial & mortal? The term “grave” seems so subjective. I have found no source that makes the matter of gravity clear to me.

What a surprise. I just went to confession about 3 hours ago and asked the priest the very same question. Because of my lack of knowledge on such matters and his much greater understanding of things we agreed that I should simply confess all my sins…even if it is one that I think is just venial. The priest will let me know if it is actually a mortal sin. So I’d say… confess all of your sins as clearly and succinctly as possible…remember the clock is ticking and there are other people waiting to confess. Go to confession frequently simply to avoid lengthy confessions …if not for any other reason.

This a really good topic to discuss…I’m currently reading a book called How to make a good confession by John Kane.

What other area about confession do you want to discuss? I’m anxious to make a better confession. It will be good to hear what others have to say.

 

[Quaere_Verum]

contemplative:

What a surprise. I just went to confession about 3 hours ago and asked the priest the very same question. Because of my lack of knowledge on such matters and his much greater understanding of things we agreed that I should simply confess all my sins…even if it is one that I think is just venial. The priest will let me know if it is actually a mortal sin. So I’d say… confess all of your sins as clearly and succinctly as possible…remember the clock is ticking and there are other people waiting to confess. Go to confession frequently simply to avoid lengthy confessions …if not for any other reason.

This a really good topic to discuss…I’m currently reading a book called How to make a good confession by John Kane.

What other area about confession do you want to discuss? I’m anxious to make a better confession. It will be good to hear what others have to say.

Thanks for the info contemplative and the book reference.

I wanted also to talk about contrition. I know what differentiates between perfect & imperfect contrition. However, I don’t know where going to confession simply because you know you have to fits in. Does this follow under imperfect contrition? Is confession valid in these cases when someone goes to confession out of obligation or habit?

 

[LilyM]

Quaere Verum:

The second aspect of confession & forgiveness which I would like to discuss is contrition. Now I realize there is perfect & imperfect contrition. To have perfect contrition we are to have true sorrow & hatred for our sins because of a deep love for God & sorrow that we have offended Him. Imperfect contrition is when we are contrite because we fear the punishment we deserve.

What about confessing our sins because we know that’s what needs to be done? What if we neither feel contrite because of a love for God or fear of punishment, but, however, confess out of obligation? That is to say, we were catechized well and know how to follow protocol.

Someone who has no sorrow for their sins is highly unlikely to take themselves to confession in the first place - many people stay away for years precisely for that reason. This is why there’s the obligation to go once a year in the first place - lots of people avoid it like the plague.

 

[Quaere_Verum]

LilyM:

Someone who has no sorrow for their sins is highly unlikely to take themselves to confession in the first place - many people stay away for years precisely for that reason. This is why there’s the obligation to go once a year in the first place - lots of people avoid it like the plague.

I understand what you’re saying. However, I’m looking at myself and know that this pertains to me occaionally. At times I go to confession because I know I should yet neither feel the love or fear mentioned for either perfect or imperfect contrition. I know I’ve sinned because I’ve been taught well the difference between right & wrong, but I don’t necessarilly have deep feelings of remorse. At these times I remind myself of a slumped shouldered child walking up to Communion or into the Confessional all the time thinking, “Mom told me I had to go.”

 

[itsjustdave1988]

Quaere Verum:

The second aspect of confession & forgiveness which I would like to discuss is contrition. Now I realize there is perfect & imperfect contrition. To have perfect contrition we are to have true sorrow & hatred for our sins because of a deep love for God & sorrow that we have offended Him. Imperfect contrition is when we are contrite because we fear the punishment we deserve.

What about confessing our sins because we know that’s what needs to be done? What if we neither feel contrite because of a love for God or fear of punishment, but, however, confess out of obligation? That is to say, we were catechized well and know how to follow protocol.

I believe that without sorrow for sin, sacramental absolution has no effect.

Catechism of St. Pius X: “Of all the parts of the sacrament of Penance the most necessary is contrition, because without it no pardon for sins is obtainable”

 

[LilyM]

Quaere Verum:

I understand what you’re saying. However, I’m looking at myself and know that this pertains to me occaionally. At times I go to confession because I know I should yet neither feel the love or fear mentioned for either perfect or imperfect contrition. I know I’ve sinned because I’ve been taught well the difference between right & wrong, but I don’t necessarilly have deep feelings of remorse. At these times I remind myself of a slumped shouldered child walking up to Communion or into the Confessional all the time thinking, “Mom told me I had to go.”

‘I know I’ve sinned’ ‘I’ve been taught well the difference between right and wrong’ - what is your understanding of sin and wrong if not that that they either a) offend God or b) merit hell? Contrition is like love - doesn’t have to be a huge overwhelming ‘feeling’, especially if you’ve not committed any mortal sins.

If you don’t intellectually or emotionally have any sense of the wrongness of what you’ve done, or any desire to change, then it perhaps comes down to understanding WHY your specific sins, and sin in general, are wrong in the first place, and doing some reflection on those themes before going to Confession.

 

[SAINThoodSEEKER]

One would also have to take into consideration the “conditioning” that the world has given us. Sometimes we don’t feel the remorse that we should because…well…in contrast to what else happens on our planet, our sin seems rather light (sometimes even if mortal). This is obviously wrong according to our faith. Circumstances like this one may be just another attack by the Evil One in attempt to weaken us. Prayer is needed here.
On a further note, it is interesting that the Church teaches that imperfect contrition suffices outside the sacrament, but not inside. I am guessing that this holds true for those who have no means to the sacrament or are in some rare spiritual crisis (like on the path to conversion). Just thought that tidbit was interesting. God bless you all.

St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle…

 

[LilyM]

SAINThoodSEEKER:

On a further note, it is interesting that the Church teaches that imperfect contrition suffices outside the sacrament, but not inside. I am guessing that this holds true for those who have no means to the sacrament or are in some rare spiritual crisis (like on the path to conversion). Just thought that tidbit was interesting. God bless you all.

St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle…

I thought it was the other way around - imperfect contrition is sufficient if accompanied by sacramental confession, otherwise it must be perfect.

 

[SAINThoodSEEKER]

LilyM:

I thought it was the other way around - imperfect contrition is sufficient if accompanied by sacramental confession, otherwise it must be perfect.

Oh my…you are correct. I need to proof read my posts. Thanks!

He everybody…What She said!

 

[LilyM]

Quaere Verum:

Thanks for the info contemplative and the book reference.

I wanted also to talk about contrition. I know what differentiates between perfect & imperfect contrition. However, I don’t know where going to confession simply because you know you have to fits in. Does this follow under imperfect contrition? Is confession valid in these cases when someone goes to confession out of obligation or habit?

NB - a new thread has been started about the Contrition question, come and join us!

 

[LilyM]

He everybody…What She said!

I’ve been guilty of the same thing myself far too often - funny to be on the other side of the fence for once

 

[contemplative]

Quaere Verum:

What about confessing our sins because we know that’s what needs to be done? What if we neither feel contrite because of a love for God or fear of punishment, but, however, confess out of obligation? That is to say, we were catechized well and know how to follow protocol.

From How to Make a Good Confession by John Kane
Chapt. 4 Combating your pride through Sacramental Confession

Humiliating as it is, the sinner should remember that the best antidote for counteracting the pride necessarily associated with the commission of any sin is the abasement entailed by Confession.

And the sinner is not alone in experiencing this humiliation; he shares it with Christ. The Redeemer bore not only the punishment of sin, but also its debasing shame. Nothing can be more touching than this revelation of Christ’s love for His fallen creatures; the mystery of His humiliation is not merely the veiling under human form of the ineffable, eternal splendor of the Godhead, but His assumption of the weakness of frail, dependent mortals. Christ became a penitent for man, bearing the weight of man’s sins as if they were His own.

And so I think by the very act of getting to a priest and confessing is of great help. I can’t imagine someone truly confessing sins this day and age …just to blend in with the crowd. I think anyone confessing today is probably making an honest effort to make ammends with God. The whole key to a good confession is to be very honest with oneself…make a good examination of conscience and be honest in the confessional.

 

[contemplative]

From How to Make a Good Confession by John Kane
Chapt. 4 Combating your pride through Sacramental Confession

As we are creatures of habit, we must exercise special care when we confess frequently. Change being the law of our existence, constant repetition dulls the appreciation of what we do. An act often repeated is apt to become commonplace.

So I think we should go through great pain not to allow repetition or some sense of protocol or obligation dull our appreciation for being able to confess our sins.

We must therefore be on our guard lest our confession itself need repentance.

 

[Quaere_Verum]

contemplative:

So I think we should go through great pain not to allow repetition or some sense of protocol or obligation dull our appreciation for being able to confess our sins.

True! True!

I believe something else happened to me as well. Up until about 10 years ago I had gone years without confessing; I think the burden of years of unconfessed sin was too much to bear. It was easier just to numb the senses. Now I go to confession regularly yet at times that numbness returns. This shows why it’s so important to never go long periods without the Sacrament of Penance.

I don’t want to pass this on to my children. I want them to feel remorse because of true love for God. Does it count if you’re sorry for your sins and confess because you know the consequence it has on your children and you don’t want them to fall into sin? Being afraid of that millstone around the neck for leading the little ones astray seems to be a form of imperfect contrition.

 

[Quaere_Verum]

Quaere Verum:

True! True!

I believe something else happened to me as well. Up until about 10 years ago I had gone years without confessing; I think the burden of years of unconfessed sin was too much to bear. It was easier just to numb the senses. Now I go to confession regularly yet at times that numbness returns. This shows why it’s so important to never go long periods without the Sacrament of Penance.

I don’t want to pass this on to my children. I want them to feel remorse because of true love for God. Does it count if you’re sorry for your sins and confess because you know the consequence it has on your children and you don’t want them to fall into sin? Being afraid of that millstone around the neck for leading the little ones astray seems to be a form of imperfect contrition.

Can somebody please comment on this. It’s really something that weighs on my mind.

 

[BlestOne]

Quaere Verum:

True! True!

I believe something else happened to me as well. Up until about 10 years ago I had gone years without confessing; I think the burden of years of unconfessed sin was too much to bear. It was easier just to numb the senses. Now I go to confession regularly yet at times that numbness returns. This shows why it’s so important to never go long periods without the Sacrament of Penance.

I don’t want to pass this on to my children. I want them to feel remorse because of true love for God. Does it count if you’re sorry for your sins and confess because you know the consequence it has on your children and you don’t want them to fall into sin? Being afraid of that millstone around the neck for leading the little ones astray seems to be a form of imperfect contrition.

My Dearest Quaere Verum,
This is one of the best reasons to go to confession. The love and responsibility we have for our children, the concern for their souls is indeed a reason why we don’t commit more sins at times. It shows the love and responsibility you have for your kids. I went into confession once and told my confessor I thought I was the worst parent on earth because I had not set the example and come to confession and brought them with me in almost a year. I knew better and I was failing my kids! Pastor looked at me, asked, what do you think you can do better? We discussed it, he gave alot and I mean alot of good suggestions and absolved me. Wow, not only did I feel the grace of the sacrament but I felt renewed and excited to implement some of the changes we had discussed. It was so totally awesome. The big joke now is go early if you are going to reconcilliation cause if my family shows up…you will be waiting a while…(there are 6 of us) we go as a family.

 

[Quaere_Verum]

BlestOne:

My Dearest Quaere Verum,
This is one of the best reasons to go to confession. The love and responsibility we have for our children, the concern for their souls is indeed a reason why we don’t commit more sins at times. It shows the love and responsibility you have for your kids. I went into confession once and told my confessor I thought I was the worst parent on earth because I had not set the example and come to confession and brought them with me in almost a year. I knew better and I was failing my kids! Pastor looked at me, asked, what do you think you can do better? We discussed it, he gave alot and I mean alot of good suggestions and absolved me. Wow, not only did I feel the grace of the sacrament but I felt renewed and excited to implement some of the changes we had discussed. It was so totally awesome. The big joke now is go early if you are going to reconcilliation cause if my family shows up…you will be waiting a while…(there are 6 of us) we go as a family.

Thanks so much. You surely are a BlestOne.

 

[BlestOne]

Quaere Verum:

Thanks so much. You surely are a BlestOne.

Yep, and thank God I appreciate how Blest I truly am! Kids are now 19, 16, 14, and 10. Hubby actually wants to go more than I do…now that is Blest!