Anyone considering conversion to Catholicism

  • Thread starter Thread starter dch1983
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
D

dch1983

Guest
For those who are considering conversion, or any Catholics who would like to comment, I have a question: What keeps you from converting? Is there a specific doctrine, teaching, theological understanding, practice, moral position, etc. that you have a particularly difficult time with? I’m interested to know what goes on in the minds, hearts, and souls of others in my shoes.
 
Well, I’m in the process of conversion myself, but I don’t think anyone who takes their spirituality seriously can convert to Catholicism without an inordinate amount of time researching, learning, praying, and meditating on all the many traditions and teachings of the RCC. I think it’s most difficult for protestants like myself who have an entire lifetime of reinforced anti-Catholic conditioning to overcome. Even after several months of researching most of the apologetic nuances of the faith, I still battle the psychological conditioning from my previous life as a protestant. For example, I love praying the rosary and pray it every day, but sometimes I still feel guilty for praying it, as if the veneration of Mary is unwarranted and detracts from time spent with God. I fundamentally agree with most of the doctrines and teachings at this point but it’s been a long road. Marian theology was extremely difficult for me, but I’ve come to somewhat of a peace with it. I read a book between an evangelical and a Catholic priest where they debated the various disagreements on Mary and her influence in the Catholic Church. It was a very fair debate and helped me a great deal. I sometimes feel uncomfortable with other things but I have to make a conscious effort to distinguish between the pains of conscience brought about through the Holy Spirit, and the pains of conscience brought about through psychological conditioning. You have to understand that I was raised being taught (at home and in Church) that Catholics were idolaters, blasphemers, worshiped men over God, thought salvation was only through works, and that they were never going to Heaven. Even now, my family is aghast that I’m in the process of converting. They keep hoping that it’s some phase in life that I’m going through and that I’ll come to my senses, but I’ve felt the Lord ministering to me for a long time now and I’m convinced that the Catholic Church is the one true Church. As it stands, I’m very excited about the prospect of joining the RCC next spring. -Brown
 
For me, the biggest stumbling block is easily the Marian doctrines, especially the concept that Mary was without sin. Also, Papal authority and infallibility, as well as the role of the Magisterium and Holy Tradition in contrast to a primary reliance on Scripture. Faith/works to a lesser degree. These are the main ones, although there are others. I also get worked up about the Church’s rule on a celibate priesthood (yeah, I know that it is a practice and not doctrine, but I still think that this shows a…well, we won’t go there just now).
 
Y’know, RR, the Marian doctrines were the toughest for me, too. Coming from an Anglican background, I never really held to sola scriptura and didn’t care much for most of Reformed theology, so accepting the authority of the Church and Holy Tradition was a bit easier for me. Infallibility and the role of the Papacy sort of followed suit after I could accept the authority thing. I think the whole thing hinges on what constitutes the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church and what authority the Church has to determine what beliefs are binding on Christians.

Reading lots of history helped. So did keeping an open mind about learning WHY the Church teaches what it does about things I wasn’t too keen on.

I’ve never been so scared the day I realized it all made SENSE. :eek:
 
dch1983 said:
For those who are considering conversion, or any Catholics who would like to comment, I have a question: What keeps you from converting? Is there a specific doctrine, teaching, theological understanding, practice, moral position, etc. that you have a particularly difficult time with? I’m interested to know what goes on in the minds, hearts, and souls of others in my shoes.
Click to expand...
Well, I’m beginning RCIA in December, but there are still issues that (pardon my channeling the spirit of Joe Lieberman) make me uncomfortable. Contraception is a biggie. So are many of the Marian doctrines–not so much her assumption (if it’s good enough for Enoch & Elijah…) , but notions like her putatively immaculate conception and perpetual virginity, and her precise status in heaven.

Unlike my fellow posters above, those issues haven’t made more sense the closer I’ve looked at them: I’ve heard the Church’s arguments, thought hard about them, and have simply failed to find them remotely persuasive. Nevertheless, I’ve heard and seen enough to have begun believing that the Church is precisely what she says she is. And accepting that, a fellow concedes that she has a right to speak truly and authoritatively on the issues above. So, if I haven’t answered my objections by Eastertime, I’ll have to pray that obedience and assent can serve as a stand-in for understanding and approval, and that the former can eventually lead to the latter.
 
I’m anotherone in RCIA right now, so you’re not really getting the ‘maybe converts’ that you wanted but still.

Yeah, the Marian Dogmas were the toughest. Immaculate Conception specifically. In the end I heard the argument, thought that it made at least a little sense, but it’s the Church’s authority that did it for me. I figured, I do believe that the Church is inable to teach untruth in regards to this, and it has been infallibally stated, so it must be true.

It was a great argument with my JW friend; “She can’t be without sin!” “But the church says she is!” “What does the Bible say?” “that the church can say she is!” LoL.
 
I am in RCIA now and the hardest thing for me to accept is the churches teaching on contraception. In many cases brith control pills are perscribed for other medical conditions such as Dysmenorrhea which while not life threatening can prevent a person from functioning normally for several days a month. Most over the counter medications do not relieve the pain it causes and many GYNs perscribe birth control pills rather then perscription pain meds such as percoset or vicodin. In that case I cannot see a moral problem with taking them but the church still teachings that it is wrong.
 
sasafr said:
I am in RCIA now and the hardest thing for me to accept is the churches teaching on contraception. In many cases brith control pills are perscribed for other medical conditions such as Dysmenorrhea which while not life threatening can prevent a person from functioning normally for several days a month. Most over the counter medications do not relieve the pain it causes and many GYNs perscribe birth control pills rather then perscription pain meds such as percoset or vicodin. In that case I cannot see a moral problem with taking them but the church still teachings that it is wrong.
Click to expand...
As I understand it, taking birth control pills for other reasons not related to contraception is not wrong or a sin. I had a debate on here with someone about this a few months ago, but I think we lost that thread in the last server crash. Regardless, there’s nothing sinful about a birth control pill, after all it’s only progesterone and estrogen (most of the time), two hormones that your body makes for itself anyway. The sin is in the explicit use of the drug for contraceptive means. That is, if I understand it correctly. Regardless, I sympathize with your viewpoint. I’m not sure if I believe contraception is a sin or not. I can think of many situations where even a contraceptive use would seem warranted. I might could accept RCC’s teaching on it, but I don’t know if I could ever agree with it in all circumstances. We’ll see.
 
I am in RCIA now and the hardest thing for me to accept is the churches teaching on contraception. In many cases brith control pills are perscribed for other medical conditions such as Dysmenorrhea which while not life threatening can prevent a person from functioning normally for several days a month. Most over the counter medications do not relieve the pain it causes and many GYNs perscribe birth control pills rather then perscription pain meds such as percoset or vicodin. In that case I cannot see a moral problem with taking them but the church still teachings that it is wrong.
Click to expand...
This is not quite true. If contraception is not taken to prevent pregnancy but for another reason then the contraceptive effects are a side effect and it is allowed. Your intent comes into play here. Some women on these boards I think actually may use the pill for that…you might start a thread on it and ask them.

Sorry about the temporary hijack!
 
Considered? Well, it depends on the definition… 😉

Anyways…what is stopping me from converting? Many things…

As I have studied, and read and talked with many people…what I once took for granted has been changed.

I always, since childhood, took it for granted that all I learned in religion class was true…God existed, Jesus was his son etc…

Reading in depth about the way that Catholics believe has made me think different about religion. I don’t believe what I once did. I’m not sure how I feel about that yet.

But, here are the biggies that keep me away from Catholicism:

-Infallibility.

I find it incredulous that ANY type of organization that has Humans involved can claim to be infallible.

-Eucharist.

It is a nice and moving ceremonial gesture, sometimes beautiful…but a supernatural experience? I can’t believe it.

-Supernatural events

I don’t believe in ghosts.

-Marriage

I don’t believe that religion or government has any right to stick it’s nose into my home…or my bedroom.

-Original sin

I’m a grandfather 3 times…and a fourth coming soon. There is no way that I can see ANY “sin” in any of my grandkids as I hold them. Sin is a learned environmental behaviour.

I’m sure to get flamed over this, but I think most people know that I’m not a basher…I am trying to understand Catholicism for my wife’s sake. I’m not trying to irritate anyone.

But…you asked…so there are my big reasons right now that keep me away.

Elg
 
rr1213 said:
For me, the biggest stumbling block is easily the Marian doctrines, especially the concept that Mary was without sin.
Click to expand...
I’m curious, do you believe that every uncorrupted human must sin? That is, suppose that instead of just creating Adam and Eve without sin, God had created a million humans. Would all one million of them have sinned? Is it impossible in your view for even unfallen humans to avoid sin?
 
Well, I am a convert ('98 vintage) … but I spent some time on the brink before converting. For me, it was contraception that was the big stumbling block. I’d grown up non-denominational, then spent several years as an Episcopalian. As long as I dissented from the Church on that subject, I did not think it appropriate to convert.

Then, during my prayers I heard the Voice of God (and yes, I do mean an auditory experience). I’d been praying for understanding (“if I can just understand, then I would obey” … and the Voice said “Obey” … :eek: I didn’t realize yet, and said, “But I want to understand …” Voice came back with “I want obedience”). Yeah, some of us are just that stubborn …

So after that, I made my way into the Church asap. Everything else started falling into place when hinged on the obedience/disobedience axis.
 
I’m a “revert” (reconcilled 4 years ago, 26 years away), and on the way back I read an old joke regarding the three biggest Protestant objections to Catholicism.
  1. Mary
  2. Mary
  3. Mary
 
elg26 said:
-Infallibility.

I find it incredulous that ANY type of organization that has Humans involved can claim to be infallible.

-Eucharist.

It is a nice and moving ceremonial gesture, sometimes beautiful…but a supernatural experience? I can’t believe it.

-Supernatural events

I don’t believe in ghosts.

-Marriage

I don’t believe that religion or government has any right to stick it’s nose into my home…or my bedroom.

Elg
Click to expand...
Don’t confuse infallibility with impeccability, think of this although the office of the Pope is infallible only 2 Popes in 400 years have been canonized Saints. That right there should show you Catholics do not believe their Pope is impeccable or perfect or every one of them would be a Saint. Plus if you believe the scriptures to be infallible somewhere along the way humans wrote them and translated them, so you do believe in infallibility from human hands if guided by the Holy Spirit.

As for the Marian apparitions you are not required to believe one of them, they are private revelations.

As for the Eucharist, thousands of Jesus disciples walked away saying they could not believe the teaching too (read John 6:66). For 1500 years all Christians believe in the Eucharist, not just believed in it, but it was a center of faith for all Chrsitians.

Marriage is tricky I’ve had a hard time with teachings on contraception and certain acts in the marital bed too. But I will say that since praying and asking for the Grace needed to overcome problems, I have not masturbated and my lustful desires for say women on the street has diminished greatly, that’s something I thought nearly impossible so maybe there’s something to it.
 
VociMike said:
I’m curious, do you believe that every uncorrupted human must sin? That is, suppose that instead of just creating Adam and Eve without sin, God had created a million humans. Would all one million of them have sinned? Is it impossible in your view for even unfallen humans to avoid sin?
Click to expand...
From the Protestant viewpoint, we have a grand total of three human beings who have been, for some period of time, uncorrupted by sin. Two of these, Adam and Eve, sinned. The other did not and, although he is fully human he is also fully God. So, I suppose that the vast majority (probably all) of the uncorrupted human beings in your hypothetical would sin. All human beings, uncorrupted by sin or not, are subject to temptation. Only God himself has not fallen to that temptation.
 
rr1213 said:
From the Protestant viewpoint, we have a grand total of three human beings who have been, for some period of time, uncorrupted by sin. Two of these, Adam and Eve, sinned. The other did not and, although he is fully human he is also fully God. So, I suppose that the vast majority (probably all) of the uncorrupted human beings in your hypothetical would sin. All human beings, uncorrupted by sin or not, are subject to temptation. Only God himself has not fallen to that temptation.
Click to expand...
And there’s one woman who birthed our Lord Jesus Christ, the New Eve. Why would it be impossible for an omnipotent God above space and time to Sanctify Mary and have her conceived without sin since she is going to be the vessel that carries mans redemption?

All the Marian Dogma’s are there to glorify Christ. I can’t imagine Mary the new Eve who God chose before time began to bear His only begotten Son being born to sin. Mary did nothing without God’s power. Perpetual virginity is also another one to glorify Christ, as well as the assumption. Queen of Heaven is from the Davidic Kings as well as Revelation.
 
I’m a convert, if you can call it that, from being a sort of liberal, semi-agnostic, semi-neopagan type- so obviously, for me the hardest things to swallow were (still are, to some extent):
  1. Scriptures relating to women submitting to their husbands.
  2. No salvation outside the church.
  3. The idea that thoughts can be sinful.
  4. Corruption and especially violence in Catholic history.
One might expect that I would have struggled with the abortion/contraception issues, but actually, I had been prolife for years and used NFP before ever considering becoming Catholic. I saw abortion as yet another example of dehumanizing a group - as a violation of human rights - and ABC as an unhealthy attempt to work against our bodies & nature.
 
Saint_Michael said:
And there’s one woman who birthed our Lord Jesus Christ, the New Eve. Why would it be impossible for an omnipotent God above space and time to Sanctify Mary and have her conceived without sin since she is going to be the vessel that carries mans redemption?

All the Marian Dogma’s are there to glorify Christ. I can’t imagine Mary the new Eve who God chose before time began to bear His only begotten Son being born to sin. Mary did nothing without God’s power. Perpetual virginity is also another one to glorify Christ, as well as the assumption. Queen of Heaven is from the Davidic Kings as well as Revelation.
Click to expand...
It wouldn’t be impossible for God. The question is not whether God is capable of keeping Mary from sin. He most certainly is capable of doing so, although doing so might encroach upon Mary’s free will. The real question is whether, in fact, he did so keep Mary from sin. The answer to that question is one big area where Catholics and Protestants differ. Truthfully, I don’t have much of a problem with the idea that Mary was conceived without original sin…I don’t believe it, but it does not challenge my understanding of man and God as does the Catholic teaching that Mary did not actually sin.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top