Anyone up for some "Whore of Babylon" rebuttals?

[montanaman]

It’s not my strongest area, and right now it’s only one guy. Here’s the link: PM Montanaman for the link if interested
I spend way too much time there. I’ve got some allies and there are friendly opponents. As far as anti-Catholic places go, it’s not bad at all. Come on over and have some fun!

 

[montanaman]

Come on, folks, this isn’t my area of expertise. Anyone?

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

montanaman:

It’s not my strongest area, and right now it’s only one guy. Here’s the link: PM Montanaman for the link if interested

I spend way too much time there. I’ve got some allies and there are friendly opponents. As far as anti-Catholic places go, it’s not bad at all. Come on over and have some fun!

I’ve seen some use of “The Two Babylons” (of which you may just possibly have heard ),not by its name, but by content, in the - mistaken - assertion that the taking of Babylon by Cyrus meant that Babylonian priests set up shop elsewhere. And you can have references, if you like, to stuff by people who know the subject like the backs of their hands:it does exist, if one knows where to look. You seem to be holding your own though. ​

It’s very good news that that opposition is friendly. What is your definition of “anti-Catholic” BTW ? I always assume it means aggressive anti-Catholicism; not friendly, and reasoned, disagreement. ##

 

[montanaman]

## I’ve seen some use of “The Two Babylons” (of which you may just possibty have heard ),not by its name, but by content, in the - mistaken - assertion that the taking of Babylon by Cyrus meant that Babylonian priests set up shop elsewhere. You seem to be holding your own though.

It’s very good news that that opposition is friendly. What is your definition of “anti-Catholic” BTW ? I always assume it means aggressive anti-Catholicism; not friendly, and reasoned, disagreement. ##

This guy’s nice, but still ignorant as a box of rocks. He’s the one that said the Assumption means Catholics “assume” Mary’s in Heaven.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

montanaman:

This guy’s nice, but still ignorant as a box of rocks. He’s the one that said the Assumption means Catholics “assume” Mary’s in Heaven.

That’s one intepretation of it I’ve never heard. Easy if one has no way to know otherwise, of course​

 

[montanaman]

Never mind. I gave it up. I go through cycles–some days apologetics feels like a noble pursuit. Other times, I’m reduced to loathing not only Protestantism, but its proponents–like right now.

I’m taking another break from this garbage. I can’t stand it anymore.

 

[Sherlock]

montanaman:

Never mind. I gave it up. I go through cycles–some days apologetics feels like a noble pursuit. Other times, I’m reduced to loathing not only Protestantism, but its proponents–like right now.

I’m taking another break from this garbage. I can’t stand it anymore.

Montanaman,

I hear ya…anyway, go to catholic.com. They have an article there (it might be under “anti-Catholicism”) that goes into this in some detail. You can always just copy the article and send it to him. Sorry I can’t give you the link, but my computer’s being fussy today.

 

[pnewton]

Good luck with the windmill tiliting. I have found that no one buys into Hislop’s ideas unless they are already looking to demonize Catholics. Such prejudice and ignorance can not be combatted with logic. Like those who twist the scripture to prove white supremacy, they tend to attract the uneducated and gullible.

 

[mercygate]

montanaman:

Come on, folks, this isn’t my area of expertise. Anyone?

Well, montana, my brother, maybe the Lord is inviting you to develop this area of expertise? Ya think?

 

[montanaman]

mercygate:

Well, montana, my brother, maybe the Lord is inviting you to develop this area of expertise? Ya think?

I chatted with my girlfriend about that. I concluded the answer is “no.” The only one ambition I’ve ever had in my life is to be a writer–fiction, mostly. I’m currently over halfway through a screenplay for a contest, and I have never felt such a simple, true “groove” on a writing project in my life. Apologetics has been a helpful tool for the subject matter, but ultimately, apologetics will simply make me maaaaaad. (As in crazy.)

 

[Church_Militant]

montanaman:

It’s not my strongest area, and right now it’s only one guy. Here’s the link: PM Montanaman for the link if interested

I spend way too much time there. I’ve got some allies and there are friendly opponents. As far as anti-Catholic places go, it’s not bad at all. Come on over and have some fun!
Hi MM!
Did you look at this CA tract called The Whore of Babylon or this one here called Hunting the Whore of Babylon. I’m kinda surprised that no one else has offered this for ya.

C’mon people! That’s why they call this place “Catholic Answers”
And that search engine on the library page works real well too.

 

[montanaman]

Church Militant:

Hi MM!
Did you look at this CA tract called The Whore of Babylon or this one here called Hunting the Whore of Babylon. I’m kinda surprised that no one else has offered this for ya.

C’mon people! That’s why they call this place “Catholic Answers”
And that search engine on the library page works real well too.

The Whore of Babylon issue is one of my girlfriend’s greatest fears. She’s in RCIA inquiry right now, but she worries that the Church might be a clever deception by Satan. Everything SEEMS to be right on, but the case made from Revelation is compelling, she thinks.

I posted those tracts in the debate, and the opponent didn’t address them one way or the ther. My girlfriend, however, said they were weak at best. Particularly the part about Rome not even being part of the “City of Seven Hills.” Especially when the Church of St. John Lateran is still the official seat of the Church right there in the heart of Rome. There were a couple of other disappointments as well.

This was the first time I’ve ever used those tracts in a debate, and I’m really disappointed that they seem so ineffective.

 

[Church_Militant]

montanaman:

The Whore of Babylon issue is one of my girlfriend’s greatest fears. She’s in RCIA inquiry right now, but she worries that the Church might be a clever deception by Satan. Everything SEEMS to be right on, but the case made from Revelation is compelling, she thinks.

I posted those tracts in the debate, and the opponent didn’t address them one way or the ther. My girlfriend, however, said they were weak at best. Particularly the part about Rome not even being part of the “City of Seven Hills.” Especially when the Church of St. John Lateran is still the official seat of the Church right there in the heart of Rome. There were a couple of other disappointments as well.

This was the first time I’ve ever used those tracts in a debate, and I’m really disappointed that they seem so ineffective.

Okay… so your beloved has a conspiracy theory streak huh?

Look MM…Have you bothered to look over that
Biblelight" site? I have…

So there is a Euro coin that has a picture of the pope on it. So what…that has nothing whatever to do with the teachings of the Catholic Church and I suspect that every country that is in the EU has a coin with some leader of theirs on it. Who did they expect them to put on the Vatican Euro…Mickey Mouse?

The Vatican City is the seat of the Roman Catholic Church, and since the Lateran Concordat of 1929 it is also an independent country, the epitome of Church and State combined. Their full title in Italian is STATO DELLA CITTÁ DEL VATICANO, as shown on the coin below from the pontificate of Pope Pius the 12th,** which means The City-State of Prophecy.**

This is bunk! The actual translation of the phrase is “STATE OF THE CITTÁ OF THE VATICAN” (Babelfish )

Revelation 17. There’s the link to the 17th chapter of Revelation. Show me if you will just what parts of this passage are so explicitly condemning of the Catholic Church?

You do realize that “BibleLight” is nothing more than a front for 7th Day Adventist rhetoric. This is the same denom that has repeatedly predicted the day of Christ’s return in direct contravention of the New Testament & been dead wrong every time? Their Sabbath teachings are twistings of scripture and their attacks on the Catholic Church are some of the most vitriolic of all anti-Catholic rhetoric.

Look at what The SDA say about prophecy on their own site:

1. The Gift of Prophecy:
   One of the gifts of the Holy Spirit is prophecy. This gift is an identifying mark of the remnant church and was manifested in the ministry of Ellen. G. White . As the Lord’s messenger, her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction

. They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested. (Joel 2:28, 29; Acts 2:14-21; Heb. 1:1-3; Rev. 12:17; 19:10.) (Adventist.org ).

Is your g/f an Adventist? They have some really big problems. Here’s one… They believe that Michael The archangel is Jesus. Read it right here From “The Bible Explained” site

Bible Explained
An interactive commentary on the whole Bible (Guide to specific chapters, below)
Updated Nov. 12, 2005, Free books for pastors or others studying the Bible; various titles. Info about our email list.
.
The conditions prevailing in society, and especially in the great cities of the nations, proclaim in thunder tones that the hour of God’s judgment is come and that the end of all things earthly is at hand. We are standing on the threshold of the crisis of the ages. In quick succession the judgments of God will follow one another–fire, and flood, and earthquake, with war and bloodshed. . . . The storm of God’s wrath is gathering; and those only will stand who respond to the invitations of mercy, . . . and become sanctified through obedience to the laws of the divine Ruler. The righteous alone will be hid with Christ in God till the desolation be overpast… (E.G. White, 1911)

.No Christians believe that…
Don’t let 'em rattle your cage My friend.

 

[Mike_Scheifler]

Actually, the SDA denomination has never predicted a date for the second coming. William Miller did, but he was not SDA, he was Baptist, and he died some 15 years before the SDA church established itself in 1863.

The relevant illustrations of Vatican coins on my biblelight.net site are not Euro coins, they are official Vatican coins minted over 30 years ago.

The word Vatican does mean “prophecy”, and this can be confirmed by looking up the root word vatic in any Latin dictionary, and even in Webster’s dictionary. See m-w.com/dictionary/vatic

 

[deb1]

montanaman:

Never mind. I gave it up. I go through cycles–some days apologetics feels like a noble pursuit. Other times, I’m reduced to loathing not only Protestantism, but its proponents–like right now.

I’m taking another break from this garbage. I can’t stand it anymore.

Please don’t judge all Protestants by the type of people that you meet on a debate board. Most Protestants are not antiCatholic.

 

[Church_Militant]

Mike Scheifler:

Actually, the SDA denomination has never

predicted a date for the second coming. William Miller did, but he was not SDA, he was Baptist, and he died some 15 years before the SDA church established itself in 1863.

The relevant illustrations of Vatican coins on my biblelight.net site are not Euro coins, they are official Vatican coins minted over 30 years ago.

The word Vatican does mean “prophecy”, and this can be confirmed by looking up the root word vatic in any Latin dictionary, and even in Webster’s dictionary. See m-w.com/dictionary/vaticBut that is not the usage that it means today is it? The hill of Vaticanus was name long ago by the Romans and had nothing to do with the Catholic Church.

I responded to the Euro coin image that was posted in the referenced site.

Furthermore, what was and is on the coinage of any nation is hardly a relevent issue as to the faithfulness of the Catholic Church.

So… Ellen G. White has never set a date for the return of Christ? Not even during WWII huh? Odd…but I had heard different from friends and family all my life.

No matter…I’ve read “The Great Controversy” and am well familiar with the misinformation that it contains from the pen of your “… Lord’s messenger, her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction” You may believe her if you choose but unbiased history disproves what she says and the factual teachings of the Catholic Church are not as she and the rest of the SDA represent them.

I’ve been on your site many times… and always come away glad I’m Catholic and NOT SDA.

I’m opening a new thread so you can discuss one of your most curious teachings Mike.forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=1093839#post1093839

 

[Mike_Scheifler]

Church Militant:

But that is not the usage that it means today is it? The hill of Vaticanus was name long ago by the Romans and had nothing to do with the Catholic Church.

“Vatican hill” was named that because it means “hill of prophecy”
Church Militant:

I responded to the Euro coin image that was posted in the referenced site.

Yes, my site (which has two different URLs.
See Removed offensive anti-Catholic site link for the facts.
Church Militant:

So… Ellen G. White has never set a date for the return of Christ? Not even during WWII huh? Odd…but I had heard different from friends and family all my life.

You were misinformed. Ellen White died in 1915.
Perhaps they were talking about Jehovah’s Witnesses, which is another denomination.

 

[Church_Militant]

So she never made any of those predictions?
That’s not what Liberty Chapel says on their website and they cite her specific writings…

When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.
Deut. 18:22
Read them HERE

But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. Matt. 24:36

 

[Mike_Scheifler]

As I said, the SDA church established itself in 1863. It has never set a date for the second coming. Neither did Ellen White before that. She never set a date, like William Miller did, but he was never SDA.

 

[Church_Militant]

As I said, the SDA church established itself in 1863. It has never set a date for the second coming. Neither did Ellen White before that. She never set a date, like William Miller did, but he was never SDA

Never “officially” SDA, yet he and White and a couple of others precipitated the foundation of the SDA.

So… is this an accurate quote from her writings or not?

I was shown the company present at the Conference. Said the angel: “Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.” Testimonies, Vol. 1, p. 131

www. ellenwhite.org