Anyone want to refute this Oneness pastor's writing on Hommoousios and the Nicene Creed

  • Thread starter Thread starter joclucsylv
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
J

joclucsylv

Guest
HOMOOUSIOS AND THE NICENE CREED

(Homoousion to patri)

Many think that by the time of the Council of Nicaea (AD 325) the Monarchian doctrine had all but vanished. What we are about to see will show that thought is far from the truth.

The Arian controversy had reached a fervor, something had to be done, or it seemed the Church, indeed the Empire, would be split. Emperor Constantine ordered the first ecumenical council to take place at Nice, Turkey to address the problem (Arius was a deacon from Egypt that taught subordinationism of the Son [Jesus] to the Father - the fourth century champion of Justin’s and Origen’s teachings.) The council was called to forge a document that all the bishops could sign stating an orthodoxy for the church. Two things were apparent: the orthodox meant to formulate a document that would deliver the death blow once and for all to the Arians; second, the Arian bishops fully intended to remain in fellowship. Although they had neither the numbers or the influence to force an Arian document, they meant to force a creed that was ambiguous enough that they, too, could sign.

According to J.N.D. Kelly, “… it was in the fourth characteristic phrase of the Creed, the words ‘of one substance with the Father’ (Homoousion to patri), that the full weight of the Orthodox reply to Arianism was concentrated.” The word ‘HOMOOUSIOS’ asserted the full deity of the Christ. This word implied that Jesus shared the very being or essence of the Father. It was a strong word, to be sure; a word with which most were uncomfortable, but by its use subordinationism was defeated. The word ‘homoousios’ caused most of the bishops concern, because it had been, for generations, the watchword of the Modalistic Monarchians.

Proof that ‘homoousios’ was identified as Monarchian is seen from the account of the two Dionysii, a full sixty years before Nicaea. J.N.D. Kelly gives us the account: “… current interpretation of ‘homoousios’ was provided by the affair of the two Dionysii in the sixties of the third century. Bishop Dionysius of Alexandria, it will be recalled, had been put to much trouble by an outbreak of Sabellianism (Modalistic Monarchianism) in the Libyan Pentapolis. When he took forceful measures to eradicate it, the leaders of the … group made formal complaint to the Roman Pontiff, alleging among other things that the Bishop of Alexandria declined to say that the Son was homoousios with God. There’s little doubt that the Sabellians stood for that ancient and, in popular circles at any rate, widely established brand of Monarchianism which regarded Jesus Christ as the earthly manifestation of the divine Being. To them the Origenist approach, with its distinction of the three hypostases and its tendencies to subordinate the Son, was anathema. When they appealed to ‘homoousios’ as their watchword, they meant by it that the Being or substance of the Son was identical with that of the Father. The way in which they invoked ‘homoousios’ in their complaint to the Pope is thus highly significant. It suggests, first, but it was already becoming in certain circles a technical term to describe the relationship of the Father and the Son, and, secondly, that they expected it would be recognized and approved at Rome.” Kelly goes on to say that Pope Dionysius condemned the views reported to him, and that his reply took a markedly Monarchian line.

Along with this event of the two Dionysii, there is Paul of Somozata. In A.D. 268 Paul of Samozata was condemned by the Synod of Antioch on the strength of this very word. Paul invoked ‘homoousios’ as his explanation of the oneness between the Father and the Son. For this very word he was condemned. Now, the word that is so identifiable with Monarchianism is being employed in the Creed of Nicaea to protect orthodoxy from Arianism. According to J.N.D. Kelly only a “handful” of the bishops wholeheartedly welcomed the language of the Creed. These consisted of the Western bishops among whom were: Hosius of Cordova (the president of the council, whom most suppose was the author of the word “homoousios”), St. Alexander of Alexandria, St. Eustathius of Antioch, Marcellus of Ancyra and a few others. These bishops welcomed the language of the Creed because of the identity of substance between the Father and the Son which it emphasized. It is more than meaningful to me that these bishops mentioned were, themselves, Monarchians. This is a clear testimony of the Monarchian influence upon the Creed of Nicaea.

The Monarchian stamp is visible in at least two places in the Creed of Nicaea: first, in the body of the Creed itself, in the word ‘homoousios’ (of the same being or essence); secondly, in the anathema at the end of the Creed which states, “But for those who … assert that the Son of God is of a different hypostasis or substance, or is subject to alteration or change – these the Catholic and apostolic Church anathematizes.”

By both of these ‘characteristic phrases’ of the Creed of Nicaea the modern Trinitarian would be placed outside of orthodoxy. In the Hayes-Green debate of 1987 the Trinitarian, Mr. Green did three things:

1). denied the homoousios of Christ to the Father;

2). openly declared the Father, Son and Holy Ghost to be different hypostases; and

3). taught that the Son of God altered Himself to become a man. (See the book entitled The Godhead Discussion, by Bishop Jerry Hayes.)

If modern Trinitarianism is considered, the Creed of Nicaea is a Monarchian credo.

(This article has been adapted from the author’s book entitled The Godhead Discussion which may be acquired through JHM at: www.jerryhayesmin.org.)
 
I’ve read this 3 times and I still don’t understand this fellow’s point. :confused:

Here’s something I found on the Oneness folks and the Nicene creed that makes more sense to me. Someone else may be able to parse what you’ve quoted better than me.

"Theophilus of Antioch, a second-century Christian, is widely recognized (according to available evidence) as the first individual to use the word “Trinity” in explaining the biblical teachings about God.18 The lack of earlier documentary evidence for the word “Trinity” leads many Oneness Pentecostals to assume that “power hungry bishops” in the early conciliar period devised the doctrine in order to accommodate Greco-Roman traditions.19 They allege that the doctrine was developed further at the Council of Nicaea to accommodate the combined theological and political aspirations of Emperor Constantine.20
This belief system displays three misunderstandings: a misunderstanding of the bases for conciliar proclamations, a misunderstanding of the origins of modalism, and a misunderstanding of what the Bible teaches regarding the Trinity. Properly understanding all three points is vital for accurate Christian theology.
Conciliar Proclamations: Many Christians inaccurately believe that the seven Ecumenical Councils of the early Church were occasions on which new doctrine was developed. Instead, the councils clarified the consensus fidelium (consensus of the faithful, or the “mind of the Church”), and defended it from heretical attacks. For example, the Council of Nicaea (325 A.D.) did not “decide” that Jesus Christ is of the same substance as the Father. Similarly, the Council of Constantinople (381 A.D.) did not “decide” that the Holy Spirit is also God. Instead, these councils, in reaction to heresies afflicting the Church at the time, clarified the biblical teachings for the faithful by creating pronouncements that would teach the biblical doctrines in ways that could be easily understood by the Church. Thus, the Nicene Creed was written at the Council of Nicaea in order to clearly promote the core doctrines of Christianity (including the belief that Jesus Christ is a distinct Person who is of one substance with the Father).
Modalism: The doctrine of the Godhead taught by Oneness Pentecostals, rather than having its roots in the Bible, can instead be traced to the heresy of modalism taught in the third century by Sabellius (although it was first taught in 190 by Theodotus of Byzantium). Sabellius taught that the monotheistic God (called a monad) progressively revealed Himself through the offices of the Trinity. Significantly, Sabellius was excommunicated from the Church for his aberrant teachings. The Oneness Pentecostal teaching that God “manifested” Himself through the offices of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit comes directly from Sabellius, who even used the term “manifesting” to define his doctrine.21 Biblical Teaching of the Trinity: A Oneness teacher wrote, "To say that God is three persons and find substantiation for it in the Scripture is a work in futility. There is literally nothing in the Bible that supports God being three persons.“22 On the contrary, however, the passages at the end of this Profile clearly show that the concept of the Trinity can be found in the Bible. Oneness Pentecostals are correct in pointing out that the God of the Bible is monotheistic. Nonetheless, because the Bible also teaches that there is a Person called God the Father, a Person called God the Son, and a Person called God the Holy Spirit, it is clear that the Bible teaches that within the nature of the one God there exist three separate and distinct Persons.”
 
random post but i think its funny how i dont understand a thing in those writings, but i just feel the need to go to this post and read some of it.
 
Vonier…like you said we have the magisterium of the Church to teach us what scripture says. Tell me…say there are 4 different Oneness pentecostals in the room. From what you know…would each one of them have a different interpretation of scripture? I can’t make head or tails out of what I quoted either. I am beginning to think that is the way he works. Listen…he has suggested to my brother that he would like to come where we live and debate a Catholic apologist. Our priest is amazing and help lead my sister in law out of this cult into the truth of the Church. My brother would like to ask Fr. Jim to debate him. What do you think??
 
(Gr. homoousion - from homos, same, and ousia, essence; Latin consubstantialem, of one essence or substance), the word used by the Council of Nicaea (325) to express the Divinity of Christ. Arius had taught that the Son, being, in the language of Philo, the Intermediator between God and the world, was not eternal, and therefore not of the Divine substance, but a creature brought forth by the free will of God. (See ARIANISM) Homoousion was indeed used by philosophical writers to signify “of the same or similar substance”; but as the unity of the Divine nature wasn’t questioned, the word carried the fuller meaning: “of one and the same substance”. However, not only is homos ambiguous; the word ousia itself was often taken as equivalent to hypostasis (person), as apparently is the case in the anathema attached to the Nicene Symbol. And therefore the affirmation of the identity of nature might be taken in the heretical sense of the Sabellians, who denied the distinction of person. It was only after many years of controversy that the two words acquired their distinct meanings, and the orthodox were able to describe the Trinity as one in ousia and three in hypostasis or persona. Previously to the Council of Nicaea, Tertullian had already used the Latin equivalent of Homoousion, conceding to Praxeas the Sabellian that the Father and the Son were unius substantiae, of one substance, but adding duarum personarum, of two persons (Adv. Prax., xiii). And Dionysius of Alexandria used the actual word in a letter to Dionysius of Rome (Athan., “De dec. Syn. Nic.”, xxv, 26) and again in his letter to Paul of Samosata. On the other hand, Origen, who is, however, inconsistent in his vocabulary, expressed the anti-Sabellian sense of Dionysius of Alexandria by calling the Son “Heteroousion”. The question was brought into discussion by the Council of Antioch (264-272); and the Fathers seem to have rejected Homoousion, even going so far as to propose the phrase heteras ousias, that is, Heteroousion, “of other or different ousia”. Athanasius and Basil give as the reason for this rejection of Homoousion the fact that the Sabellian Paul of Samosata took it to mean “of the same of similar substance”. But Hilary says that Paul himself admitted it in the Sabellian sense “of the same substance or person”, and thus compelled the council to allow him the prescriptive right to the expression. Now, if we may take Hilary’s explanation, it is obvious that when, half a century afterwards, Arius denied the Son to be of the Divine ousia or substance, the situation was exactly reversed. Homoousion directly contradicted the heretic. In the conflicts which ensued, the extreme Arians persisted in the Heteroousion Symbol. But the Semi-Arians were more moderate, and consequently more plausible, in their Homoiousion (of like substance). When one considers how the four creeds formulated at Antioch (341) by the Semi-Arians approached the Nicene Creed as nearly as possible without the actual word Homoousion, there may be a temptation to think that the question was one of words only; and the Councils of Rimini and Seleucia (359) may seem to have been well advised in their conciliatory formula “that the Son was like the Father in all things, according to the Holy Writ”. But this very formula was forced from the Fathers by the Emperor Constantius; and the force and fraud which the Semi-Arians used throughout the greater part of the fourth century, are proof sufficient that the dispute was not merely verbal. The dogma of the Trinity was at stake, and Homoousion proved itself to be in the words of Epiphanius “the bond of faith”, or, according to the expression of Marius Victorinus, “the rampart and wall of orthodoxy.” (See ARIANISM; TRINITY.)
newadvent.org/cathen/07449a.htm
 
What I don’t understand is this: how could Christ allow the Church to err in the most important concept: THE NATURE OF GOD.

What it ultimately comes down to is Matthew 16:18-19
"The gates of hell shall not prevail"
Oh, and note that the Church is the “pillar of truth” (1 Tim 3:15).
 
The use of the word Hommoousios does not prove that Modalists formed the The Nicene Creed because this council was called to respond to Arius who like Jehovah’s Witnesses today denies the deity of Christ. The creed itself spells out relationships among the three persons of the godhead.

google.com/#sclient=psy&hl=en&source=hp&q=homoousios+site:http%3A%2F%2Fwww.newadvent.org&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=44415a5dbc737203&biw=1024&bih=524

One need only read the The Nicene Creed to see his interpretation falls flat – simply note the relationships,

We believe (I believe) in one God, the Father Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible. **And in one **Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, and born of the Father before all ages. (God of God) light of light, true God of true God. Begotten not made, consubstantial to the Father, by whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven. And was incarnate of the Holy Ghost and of the Virgin Mary and was made man; was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate, suffered and was buried; and the third day rose again according to the Scriptures. And ascended into heaven, sits at the right hand of the Father, and shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead, of whose Kingdom there shall be no end. And (I believe) in the Holy Ghost, the Lord and Giver of life, who proceeds from the Father (and the Son), **who together with the Father and the Son **is to be adored and glorified, who spoke by the Prophets. And one holy, catholic, and apostolic Church. We confess (I confess) one baptism for the remission of sins. And we look for (I look for) the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come. Amen."
newadvent.org/cathen/11049a.htm

In fact, ask him to name the Bishops who were known to be modalists at the council.
 
Vonier…like you said we have the magisterium of the Church to teach us what scripture says. Tell me…say there are 4 different Oneness pentecostals in the room. From what you know…would each one of them have a different interpretation of scripture? I can’t make head or tails out of what I quoted either. I am beginning to think that is the way he works. Listen…he has suggested to my brother that he would like to come where we live and debate a Catholic apologist. Our priest is amazing and help lead my sister in law out of this cult into the truth of the Church. My brother would like to ask Fr. Jim to debate him. What do you think??
Are there not Catholic Apologetists on the radio like Karl Keating? Why not email Karl to see if he is interrested. Maybe there is a catholic apologetist who is a former UPC person to debate on the radio. This could be done by phone over the radio.
 
What I don’t understand is this: how could Christ allow the Church to err in the most important concept: THE NATURE OF GOD.

What it ultimately comes down to is Matthew 16:18-19
"The gates of hell shall not prevail"
Oh, and note that the Church is the “pillar of truth” (1 Tim 3:15).
That question is a death blow to his position.
 
My bad, here is the unedited edition of the orignial Nicene Creed

We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of all things visible and invisible
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, begotten of the Father [the only-begotten; that is, of the essence of the Father, God of God], Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance (ὁμοούσιον) with the Father; by whom all things were made [both in heaven and on earth]; who for us men, and for our salvation, came down and was incarnate and was made man; he suffered, and the third day he rose again, ascended into heaven; from thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.
And in the Holy Ghost.
ccel.org/ccel/schaff/creeds1.iv.iii.html

A word gets its meaning from its context. The creed makes distinctions between The Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Then it goes on to emphasize in parallels the Nature of the godhead — **essence **of the Father, **God of God], **Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, **being of one substance **(ὁμοούσιον) with the Father;

being one person would simply not make sense in those parallels – same essence, God of God, Light of light, very God of very God, begotten, one substance.

Just because someone comes along first decades latter and reads their interpretation into a word in a paragraph then someone else comes along thousands of years later and also reads their interpretation into that same word does not make those two persons right.

Bottom line a word gets its meaning from context.

What the so-called bishop is doing is a common word study fallacy known as,

Technical Fallacy - This fallacy results from reading your doctrinal understanding in technical terms into a particular word. For instance:

Sanctification is a theological term that describes the continued moral cleansing that takes place in a Christian over his life. But this is not, often, the way scripture uses the term. 1 Cor 7:14 states that, “the unbelieving husband is sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified through her believing husband.” This is not another way of salvation, sanctification is being used here in a different way, namely, a setting apart.

In John 2:23 we have another example of a passage that is liable to misunderstanding because we are reading in a theological definition of a term. It reads, “Now when He was in Jerusalem at the Passover, during the feast, many believed in His name, observing His signs which He was doing.” We usually understand the term “believed” to mean a trusting in the substitutionary work of Christ for the forgiveness of our sins. However, reading on a bit it does not seem that this is the correct definition for this context. Rather what is in view here seems to be an intellectual belief that Jesus is from God, but it lacks the personal trust in Him that we normally associate with the word “believe.”
studydesk.org/Hermeneutics/06%20Observation%20-%20Word%20Study%20Fallacies.htm
 
The Triune God
A Biblical, Historical, and Theological Study
By Thomas A. Marsh

-Book DescriptionThe theology of the Trinity is undergoing an intense renewal filled with a vitality and vibrancy not seen since the fourth century. What had become, for most believers, dormant and peripheral to the understanding of the Christian faith is once again at the center of lively theological discussions.

The Triune God offers a comprehensive overview of the theology of the Trinity from its origin in the Bible, through the significant periods of development in the early church, and up to the present time. Author Thomas Marsh reviews key biblical understandings of God, explains early church developments, highlights controversies about the Trinity considered at church councils, and chronicles the scholastic distinctions of the middle ages. He also explores contemporary efforts to revitalize the theology of the Trinity, and considers the question of inclusive God-language, the “rebirth” of the Spirit, and the role of the Trinity in the theology of the kingdom and in the place of the church in society.

The Triune God is a serious exploration of the Tirnity well suited to college, seminary, and university courses. Anyone interested in an in-depth examination of the Trinity from a scriptural, historical, and pastoral perspective will find this book essential reading.
wipfandstock.com/store/The_Triune_God_A_Biblical_Historical_and_Theological_Study
 
We can’t know the arguments that went back and forth, but we do have an explanation as to why Eusebius of Caesarea agreed to the addition of this non-Scriptural (not to say unscriptural) term. He explained himself in a letter back to Caesarea:

That he is consubstantial with the Father then simply implies, that the Son of God has no resemblance to created things, but is in every respect like the Father only who begat him; and that he is of no other substance or essence but of the Father.

To this doctrine, explained in this way, it appeared right to assent, especially since we knew that some eminent bishops and learned writers among the ancients have used the term “homoousios” in their theological discourses concerning the nature of the Father and the Son. (The Ecclesiastical History of Socrates Scholasticus I:8)

The final version of the Nicene Creed, according to a letter Eusebius sent back to Caesarea, read like this:

The Creed of Nicea As Finalized by the Council of Nicea
I give the same disclaimer as above. The wording is from The Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, series 2, vol. II. Please excuse the century-old wording and punctuation. Again, paragraphs are mine.

We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of all things visible and invisible:

And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the only-begotten of the Father, that is of the substance of the Father; God of God, Light of light, true God of true God; begotten not made, consubstantial with the Father; by whom all things were made both which are in heaven and on earth; who for the sake of us men, and on account of our salvation, descended, became incarnate, was made man, suffered and rose again on the third day; he ascended into the heavens, and will come to judge the living and the dead.

[We believe] also in the Holy Spirit.

But those who say “There was a time when he was not,” or “He did not exist before he was begotten,” or “He was made of nothing” or assert that “He is of other substance or essence than the Father,” or that the Son of God is created, or mutable, or susceptible of change, the catholic and apostolic Church of God anathematizes.

~Ecclesiastical History of Socrates Scholastictus I:8 (emphasis mine)

christian-history.org/council-of-nicea-4.html

Did Origen apply the word Homoousios to the Son? 1 edition
.By Hanson, R. P. C Bp of Clogher
accessmylibrary.com/article-1G1-21263302/did-origen-apply-word.html
openlibrary.org/works/OL12995705W/Did_Origen_apply_the_word_Homoousios_to_the_Son

Athenagoras goes on to answer that question immediately:

We acknowledge a God, and a Son his Logos, and a Holy Spirit, united in substance. (ibid.)
Justin Martyr, a couple decades earlier, adds his testimony to that of Athenagoras:

I asserted that this Power * was begotten from the Father, but not by abscission *, as if the substance of the Father were divided. (Dialogue with Trypho, a Jew 128)

christian-history.org/council-of-nicea-3.html*

christian-history.org/council-of-nicea.html

Some Reflections on St. Basil’s Pneumatology : The “Economy” of Silence

Furthermore, the Nicean watchword homoousios was so suspect as non-Biblical that Basil avoided to use it. Instead of using homoousios, Basil employs the terms physike koinonia (community of nature) and homotimia, which actually have the same meaning as homoousia, since the Holy Spirit’s equal dignity and honor in the traditional doxology presupposes and is possible only by identity of substance or ousia (5).


  1. Letters 90 (FC vol. 13,1, p. 200); 8 (FC vol. 13,1, pp. 35-40); 38 ( ib., pp. 88-96); 258 (FC vol. 28, II, pp. 217-221). Cf. Homily XXIV: Against Sabellians, Arians and Anomoeans, PG 31, 600b. Adversus Eunomium II & III, PG 29, 653b & 657b; 573a-652c. Espec. left. 159 (FC vol. 13,1, p. 313, PG 32, 621a; and De Spiritu Sancto, 27, PG 32,193a. Cp. B. Pruche, "Autour du traite sur le Saint-Esprit de Saint Basile de Cesaree ", in Recherches de Science Religieuse 52 (1964) 208-211 especially.
apostoliki-diakonia.gr/en_main/catehism/theologia_zoi/themata.asp?cat=patr&NF=1&contents=contents_Texts.asp&main=texts&file=1.htm

Modalism and Church History

christiandefense.org/oneness_c.hstoy.htm

Dr. Edward Dalcour’s, Definitive Look at Oneness Theology: In the Light of Biblical Trinitarianism
christiandefense.org/products.htm*
 
On the Trinity (Hilary of Poitiers) > Book IV
  1. What foolish and godless fears! What impious anxiety on God’s behalf! The meaning which they profess to detect in the word homoousion, and in the assertion of the eternity of the Son, is detested, rejected, denounced by the Church. She confesses one God from Whom are all things; she confesses one Jesus Christ our Lord, through whom are all things; One from Whom, One through Whom; One the Source of all, One the Agent through Whom all were created. In the One from Whom are all things she recognises the Majesty which has no beginning, and in the One through Whom are all things she recognises a might coequal with His Source; for Both are jointly supreme in the work of creation and in rule over created things. In the Spirit she recognises God as Spirit, impassible and indivisible, for she has learned from the Lord that Spirit has neither flesh nor bones Luke 24:39; a warning to save her from supposing that God, being Spirit, could be burdened with bodily suffering and loss. She recognises one God, unborn from everlasting; she recognises also one Only-begotten Son of God. She confesses the Father eternal and without beginning; she confesses also that the Son’s beginning is from eternity. Not that He has no beginning, but that He is Son of the Father Who has none; not that He is self-originated, but that He is from Him Who is unbegotten from everlasting; born from eternity, receiving, that is, His birth from the eternity of the Father. Thus our faith is free from the guesswork of heretical perversity; it is expressed in fixed and published terms, though as yet no reasoned defence of our confession has been put forth. Still, lest any suspicion should linger around the sense in which the Fathers have used the word homoousion and round our confession of the eternity of the Son, I have set down the proofs whereby we may be assured that the Son abides ever in that substance wherein He was begotten from the Father, and that the birth of His Son has not diminished ought of that Substance wherein the Father was abiding; that holy men, inspired by the teaching of God, when they said that the Son is homoousios with the Father pointed to no such flaws or defects as I have mentioned. My purpose has been to counteract the impression that this ousia, this assertion that He is homoousios with the Father, is a negation of the nativity of the Only-begotten Son.
newadvent.org/fathers/330204.htm

Letters (St. Basil of Caesarea) > Letter 226
  1. But of course this is not the real cause of our separation. It was when they found that they would recommend themselves to Euzoius if they were alienated from me, that they devised these pretences. The object was to find some ground of recommendation with the authorities for their attack upon me. Now they are beginning to run down even the Nicene Creed, and nickname me Homoousiast, because in that creed the Only begotten Son is said to be homoousios with God the Father. Not that one essence is divided into two kindred parts; God forbid! This was not the meaning of that holy and God-beloved synod; their meaning was that what the Father is in essence, such is the Son. And thus they themselves have explained it to us, in the phrase Light of Light. Now it is the Nicene Creed, brought by themselves from the west, which they presented to the Synod at Tyana, by which they were received. But they have an ingenious theory as to changes of this kind; they use the words of the creed as physicians use a remedy for the particular moment, and substitute now one and now another to suit particular diseases. The unsoundness of such a sophism it is rather for you to consider than for me to prove. For “the Lord will give you understanding” 2 Timothy 2:7 to know what is the right doctrine, and what the crooked and perverse. If indeed we are to subscribe one creed today and another tomorrow, and shift with the seasons, then is the declaration false of him who said, “One Lord, one faith, one baptism.” Ephesians 4:5 But if it is true, then “Let no man deceive you with [these] vain words.” They falsely accuse me of introducing novelties about the Holy Spirit. Ask what the novelty is. I confess what I have received, that the Paraclete is ranked with Father and Son, and not numbered with created beings. We have made profession of our faith in Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, and we are baptized in the name of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. Wherefore we never separate the Spirit from conjunction with the Father and the Son. For our mind, enlightened by the Spirit, looks at the Son, and in Him, as in an image, beholds the Father. And I do not invent names of myself, but call the Holy Ghost Paraclete; nor do I consent to destroy His due glory. These are truly my doctrines. If any one wishes to accuse me for them, let him accuse me; let my persecutor persecute me. Let him who believes in the slanders against me be ready for the judgment. “The Lord is at hand.” “I am careful for nothing.”
newadvent.org/fathers/3202226.htm
 
Pier Franco Beatrice, “The Word ‘Homoousios’ from Hellenism to Christianity,” Church History 71, no. 2 (June 2002): 243-272.
Pier Franco Beatrice (2002). The Word “Homoousios” from Hellenism to Christianity. Church History, 71, pp 243-272 doi:10.1017/S0009640700095688

findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb050/is_2_71/ai_n28931566/

Pre-Nicene use of the term
The term ‘’’’ had been used before its adoption by the Nicene theology. The Gnostics were the first theologians to use the word “homoousios”, while before the Gnostics there is no trace at all of its existence. The early church theologians were probably made aware of this concept, and thus of the doctrine of emanation, by the Gnostics. In Gnostic texts the word “homoousios” is used with these meanings: (1) identity of substance between generating and generated; (2) identity of substance between things generated of the same substance; (3) identity of substance between the partners of a syzygy. For example, Basilides, the first known Gnostic thinker to use “homoousios” in the first half of the 2nd century, speaks of a threefold sonship consubstantial with the god who is not. The Valentinian Gnostic Ptolemy claims in his letter to Flora that it is the nature of the good God to beget and bring forth only beings similar to, and consubstantial with himself. “Homoousios” was already in current use by the 2nd-century Gnostics, and through their works it became known to the orthodox heresiologists, though this Gnostic use of the term had no reference to the specific relationship between Father and Son, as is the case in the Nicene Creed.

facebook.com/pages/Homoousian/138961959455243
 
The last three posts tries to trace the use of Hommoousios in the Church Fathers and how the gnostics before them used this word. None of them used it in the sense of “one person”, all used it in the sense “of same substance” as the Father.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top