Apostasy, Heresy and Schism

[Matthew_Holford]

Can someone please explain in layman’s terms what apostasy, heresy, and schism mean and how they differ from each other.

I am not a stupid person (educated to postgraduate level) but I am not a theologian and do not understand theological language.

I appreciate and understand that it is inappropriate to label non-Catholic Christians with these terms. It is insulting and perjorative and is not conducive to ecumenism and unity. However, out of academic interest I would like to know what is the current, official Church line on the:

1. 
   *]Assyrian Church of the East
   *]Eastern Orthodox churches
   *]Oriental Orthodox churches
   *]Anglican Communion
   *]Protestant churches
   
   in terms of whether they are regarded as being in apostasy, heresy and/or schism with the Catholic Church (Latin and 22 Eastern churches sui iuris).
   
   Thanks
   
   Matthew

 

[diggerdomer]

Can someone please explain in layman’s terms what apostasy, heresy, and schism mean and how they differ from each other.

I am not a stupid person (educated to postgraduate level) but I am not a theologian and do not understand theological language.

I appreciate and understand that it is inappropriate to label non-Catholic Christians with these terms. It is insulting and perjorative and is not conducive to ecumenism and unity. However, out of academic interest I would like to know what is the current, official Church line on the:

1. 
   *]Assyrian Church of the East
   *]Eastern Orthodox churches
   *]Oriental Orthodox churches
   *]Anglican Communion
   *]Protestant churches
   
   in terms of whether they are regarded as being in apostasy, heresy and/or schism with the Catholic Church (Latin and 22 Eastern churches sui iuris).
   
   Thanks
   
   Matthew

1. 
   From the Catholic Encyclopedia, edited:
   
   Apostasy: In the strict, traditional sense of the word, is the gravely sinful act by which one totally abandons, inwardly and outwardly, the Catholic faith in which he has been baptized and which he has heretofore professed.
   
   Heresy: In canon law heresy is the offense of one who, having been baptized and retaining the name of Christian, pertinaciously denies or doubts any of the truths that one is under obligation of divine and Catholic faith to believe.
   
   Schism: The Code of Canon Law defines schism as “the refusal of submission to the Supreme Pontiff or of communion with the members of the Church subject to him” (Codex iuris canonici 751). In light of Vatican Council II, it is evident that the term is applied canonically only to those baptized or later received into the Catholic Church. It does not apply to persons born and baptized into communions that are separated from the Catholic Church (Unitatis redintegratio 3).
   
   Hope this helps.

 

[thistle]

Can someone please explain in layman’s terms what apostasy, heresy, and schism mean and how they differ from each other.

I am not a stupid person (educated to postgraduate level) but I am not a theologian and do not understand theological language.

I appreciate and understand that it is inappropriate to label non-Catholic Christians with these terms. It is insulting and perjorative and is not conducive to ecumenism and unity. However, out of academic interest I would like to know what is the current, official Church line on the:

1. 
   *]Assyrian Church of the East
   *]Eastern Orthodox churches
   *]Oriental Orthodox churches
   *]Anglican Communion
   *]Protestant churches
   
   in terms of whether they are regarded as being in apostasy, heresy and/or schism with the Catholic Church (Latin and 22 Eastern churches sui iuris).
   
   Thanks
   
   Matthew

1. 
   From the Modern Catholic Dictionary:
   
   APOSTASY IN FAITH. The complete abandonment of the Christian religion and not merely a denial of some article of the creed. Since apostolic times, it was classified among the major crimes, along with murder and adultery, whose remission in the sacrament of penance carried severe censures and, among certain rigorists, even remission of the sin was denied. St. Cyprian (d. 258), Bishop of Carthage, defended the Church’s right to remit apostasy before the hour of death, and the practice was supported by Pope Cornelius (d. 253). Under the Christian Roman Empire, apostates were punished by deprivation of civil rights, including the power to bequeath or inherit property. During the late Middle Ages, Christian who apostatized were subject to trial and punishment by the Inquisition.
   
   The code of canon law of 1918 declared that apostates from the faith (as also heretics and schismatics) incur ipso facto excommunication, are deprived, after warning, of any benefice, dignity, pension, office, or any position they may have in the Church, and are declared under infamy. After a second warning, clerics are to be deposed, and members of a religious community automatically dismissed.
   
   HERESY. Commonly refers to a doctrinal belief held in opposition to the recognized standards of an established system of thought. Theologically it means an opinion at variance with the authorized teachings of any church, notably the Christian, and especially when this promotes separation from the main body of faithful believers.
   
   In the Roman Catholic Church, heresy has a very specific meaning. Anyone who, after receiving baptism, while remaining nominally a Christian, pertinaciously denies or doubts any of the truths that must be believed with divine and Catholic faith is considered a heretic. Accordingly four elements must be verified to constitute formal heresy; previous valid baptism, which need not have been in the Catholic Church; external profession of still being a Christian, otherwise a person becomes an apostate; outright denial or positive doubt regarding a truth that the Catholic Church has actually proposed as revealed by God; and the disbelief must be morally culpable, where a nominal Christian refuses to accept what he knows is a doctrinal imperative.
   
   Objectively, therefore, to become a heretic in the strict canonical sense and be excommunicated from the faithful, one must deny or question a truth that is taught not merely on the authority of the Church but on the word of God revealed in the Scriptures or sacred tradition. Subjectively a person must recognize his obligation to believe. If he acts in good faith, as with most persons brought up in non-Catholic surroundings, the heresy is only material and implies neither guilt nor sin against faith. (Etym. Latin haeresis, from the Greek hairesis, a taking, choice, sect, heresy.)
   
   SCHISM. A willful separation from the unity of the Christian Church. Although St. Paul used the term to condemn the factions at Corinth, these were not properly schismatical, but petty cliques that favored one or another Apostle. A generation later Clement I reprobated the first authentic schism of which there is record. Paul’s exhortation to the Corinthians also gives an accurate description of the concept. “Why do we wrench and tear apart the members of Christ,” he asks, “and revolt against our own body, and reach such folly as to forget that we are members of one another?” While the early Church was often plagued with heresy and schism, the exact relation between the two divisive elements was not clarified until later in the patristic age. “By false doctrines concerning God,” declared St. Augustine, “heretics wound the faith; by sinful dissensions schismatics deviate from fraternal charity, although they believe what we believe.” Heresy, therefore, by its nature refers to the mind and is opposed to religious belief, whereas schism is fundamentally volitional and offends against the union of Christian charity. (Etym. Latin schisma; from Greek skhisma, a split, division, from skhizein, to tear, rend.)

 

[Matthew_Holford]

Thank you for that thistle, it was most useful.

 

[Junebug999]

This was a very helpfup thread – thank you – I have used some of those words in the wrong context!

 

[steve_b]

Can someone please explain in layman’s terms what apostasy, heresy, and schism mean and how they differ from each other.

I am not a stupid person (educated to postgraduate level) but I am not a theologian and do not understand theological language.

From the Catechism

2089 scborromeo.org/ccc/para/2089.htm

• *Incredulity *is the neglect of revealed truth or the willful refusal to assent to it.
• "*Heresy *is the obstinate post-baptismal denial of some truth which must be believed with divine and catholic faith, or it is likewise an obstinate doubt concerning the same;
• *apostasy *is the total repudiation of the Christian faith;
• *schism *is the refusal of submission to the Roman Pontiff or of communion with the members of the Church subject to him."

mh:

I appreciate and understand that it is inappropriate to label non-Catholic Christians with these terms. It is insulting and perjorative and is not conducive to ecumenism and unity. However, out of academic interest I would like to know what is the current, official Church line on the:

1. • Assyrian Church of the East
   • Eastern Orthodox churches
   • Oriental Orthodox churches
   • Anglican Communion
   • Protestant churches
   in terms of whether they are regarded as being in apostasy, heresy and/or schism with the Catholic Church (Latin and 22 Eastern churches sui iuris).
   
   Thanks
   
   Matthew

1. 
   Based on the definitions of terms above, + Based on this link ewtn.com/expert/answers/catholic_rites_and_churches.htm
   
   These are in union with the pope. If one is not in union with the pope, they are schismatic, & probably also deny certain truth(s) that must be believed with Catholic faith. Therefore, they are guilty of heresy as well.

 

[diggerdomer]

From the Catechism

2089 scborromeo.org/ccc/para/2089.htm

• *Incredulity *is the neglect of revealed truth or the willful refusal to assent to it.
• "Heresy is the obstinate post-baptismal denial of some truth which must be believed with divine and catholic faith, or it is likewise an obstinate doubt concerning the same;
• apostasy is the total repudiation of the Christian faith;
• *schism *is the refusal of submission to the Roman Pontiff or of communion with the members of the Church subject to him."

Based on the definitions of terms above, + Based on this link ewtn.com/expert/answers/catholic_rites_and_churches.htm

These are in union with the pope. If one is not in union with the pope, they are schismatic, & probably also deny certain truth(s) that must be believed with Catholic faith. Therefore, they are guilty of heresy as well.

No, none of the the Churches in the list you cited are in union with Pope.

Or did I misunderstand your post? Thanks.

 

[steve_b]

No, none of the the Churches in the list you cited are in union with Pope.

Or did I misunderstand your post? Thanks.

You didn’t misunderstand.

I gave the EWTN link that specifies who is in communion with Rome and who is not so people could see the official list for themselves.

 

[Matthew_Holford]

You didn’t misunderstand.

I gave the EWTN link that specifies who is in communion with Rome and who is not so people could see the official list for themselves.

Steve

I think all the Churches listed in your EWTN link are in communion/union with Rome. It lists the Latin (Roman) Catholic Church plus the 22 Eastern/Oriental Catholic Churches in communion/union with Rome. It does point out that some of these Eastern/Oriental Churches have an Eastern Orthodox “equivalent” and that they are often in the majority in some of the territories mentioned, e.g. there’s a Romanian Catholic Church but the majority of Romanian Christians belong to the Romanian Orthodox Church.

Matt

 

[steve_b]

Steve

I think all the Churches listed in your EWTN link are in communion/union with Rome.

As you can see from the list, it specifies which are, and which aren’t, in communion with Rome.
mh:

It lists the Latin (Roman) Catholic Church plus the 22 Eastern/Oriental Catholic Churches in communion/union with Rome. It does point out that some of these Eastern/Oriental Churches have an Eastern Orthodox “equivalent” and that they are often in the majority in some of the territories mentioned, e.g. there’s a Romanian Catholic Church but the majority of Romanian Christians belong to the Romanian Orthodox Church.

True. The point I was making with the EWTN list is to fine tune, when it comes to the East and Oriental, the exceptions.

 

[diggerdomer]

You didn’t misunderstand.

I gave the EWTN link that specifies who is in communion with Rome and who is not so people could see the official list for themselves.

Thanks…so your point was that those you listed are not in communion with the Catholic Church? Is that right?

 

[steve_b]

Thanks…so your point was that those you listed are not in communion with the Catholic Church? Is that right?

There were 2 lists. This was the one I gave
ewtn.com/expert/answers/catholic_rites_and_churches.htm

the following is the list Matthew gave (emphasis mine)

1. • Assyrian Church of the East
   • Eastern Orthodox churches
   • Oriental Orthodox churches
   • Anglican Communion
   • Protestant churches
   Matthews list IMO could be misleading
   
   For example. Regarding:
   • “Oriental Orthodox” Copts for example refer to themselves as Oriental Orthodox. Look at the list I gave from EWTN. There are Copts who are in communion with us.
   • Assyrian/Syrian associated with Antioch, look at the EWTN list. Chaldeans and Syro Malabar are in communion with us.
   EO, Anglicans(which are Protestants), and Protestants, obviously aren’t in communion with us
   
   I like the EWTN list because it fine tunes the list of Churches in communion with Rome.

 

[Matthew_Holford]

There were 2 lists. This was the one I gave
ewtn.com/expert/answers/catholic_rites_and_churches.htm

the following is the list Matthew gave (emphasis mine)

1. • Assyrian Church of the East
   • Eastern Orthodox churches
   • Oriental Orthodox churches
   • Anglican Communion
   • Protestant churches
   Matthews list IMO could be misleading
   
   For example. Regarding:
   • “Oriental Orthodox” Copts for example refer to themselves as Oriental Orthodox. Look at the list I gave from EWTN. There are Copts who are in communion with us.
   • Assyrian/Syrian associated with Antioch, look at the EWTN list. Chaldeans and Syro Malabar are in communion with us.
   EO, Anglicans(which are Protestants), and Protestants, obviously aren’t in communion with us
   
   I like the EWTN list because it fine tunes the list of Churches in communion with Rome.

1. 
   There does seem to be some confusions arising here.
   
   The twenty-three Churches listed on the EWTN link, which was originally given in post #6 by steve b does two things. It distinguishes a Church from a Rite. Then it lists the 23 Churches which are all Eastern Catholic Churches sui iuris that are in communion with each other and with the Holy See. They each have a primate and the Pope is the Supreme Pontiff over all of them. In an aside with some of them it states that the Christians in some of the countries where Eastern Catholics are found are in the main adherents of other Eastern Churches, e.g. that country’s Eastern Orthodox Church.
   
   I’m not sure how my list of non-Catholic Churches was confusing. The majority of non-Catholic Eastern churches are Eastern Orthodox Churches and became separated from Catholicism through the Great Schism. The Oriental Orthodox Churches split away earlier following the Council of Chalcedon. The Assyrian Church does not fit into either of the previous two categories.
   
   The other two groups I listed are western Christian churches that arose at the Reformation or subsequent to it. I listed Anglicans and Protestants as separate as a matter of respect. There is some debate as to whether Anglicans are Protestants and I do know many Anglicans do not consider themselves to be Protestants.

 

[diggerdomer]

There were 2 lists. This was the one I gave
ewtn.com/expert/answers/catholic_rites_and_churches.htm

the following is the list Matthew gave (emphasis mine)

1. • Assyrian Church of the East
   • Eastern Orthodox churches
   • Oriental Orthodox churches
   • Anglican Communion
   • Protestant churches
   Matthews list IMO could be misleading
   
   For example. Regarding:
   • “Oriental Orthodox” Copts for example refer to themselves as Oriental Orthodox. Look at the list I gave from EWTN. There are Copts who are in communion with us.
   • Assyrian/Syrian associated with Antioch, look at the EWTN list. Chaldeans and Syro Malabar are in communion with us.
   EO, Anglicans(which are Protestants), and Protestants, obviously aren’t in communion with us
   
   I like the EWTN list because it fine tunes the list of Churches in communion with Rome.

1. 
   Thanks. To my understanding, none of the 5 listed are in communion with the Catholic Church. Right?