Apostolic Pentacostal beliefs?

[Aeg071]

Funny, it’s also what Sabellius would say.

No whats funny is the original Greek and Latin meaning of hypostasis/prospon/personae says just as much.Now I have quoted Protestant Trinitarians who when expressing One God in three persons from the original Greek and Latin. we understand God the same.You sound Trithistic because you express the Trinity in English meaning and definition. Now I will quote a Catholic Jesuit who has given me a great amount of respect for Catholics,I have always thought Catholics were more Trithistic than Protestant Trinitarians. The Jesuit clearly expresses the Trinity in the original Greek and Latin context.He said"In the blessed Trinity,the properties are to generate,to be generated and to proceed.The nature not the person of the Father is communicated to the Son(now all that sounds trithistic to me at first) then He said this BUT"PROPERTIES" ARE NOT PERSONAL DISTINCTIONS EVEN IN IDENTITY.

Oneness Pentecostals don’t take well to Trinitarian terminology.However what the Jesuit expressed is the proper Greek and Latin context of hypostasis/prosopon/personae.What the Jesuit said as to the properties of the Divine is the proper context when Oneness Pentecostals say One God in three manifestations.

Only unlearned Trinitarians are guilty of making the hypostasis sound separate as you confess.I have truly learned that some Trinitarians do know better after all.

 

[Aeg071]

The One you say we will see before the judgement throne said:

Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

[Whatever] everyone else says, it’s just an opinion or a short version (And yes, that includes Peter in Acts).

Was Peter not there when Chris gave the command because I don’t believe they disobeyed. What Jesus said in Mathew and what Peter did in Acts can not be a deviation…The New Testament theme is salvation in Christ not a Trinity.Peter got it right as Christ will be who we will stand before.In politics they say it’s the economy stupid.I will say It’s the saving name…you get the jest. Anybody with common sense know Father,Son and Holy Spirit is not His name.

 

[Isaiah45_9]

Was Peter not there when Chris gave the command because I don’t believe they disobeyed. What Jesus said in Mathew and what Peter did in Acts can not be a deviation…

Just like Peter didn’t deny Christ either?

But the point is that I did not say Peter was being disobedient, you are raising a straw I did not drink from. I said that Peter said a short version. Of course, you can’t argue against that and are in need to bring a straw man in order to defend your theology.

The New Testament theme is salvation in Christ not a Trinity.

Yes, but Christ in the 2nd person of the Trinity. You are missing an entire progression:

John 4:24 God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”

John 10:30 I and the Father are one.”

John 14:26 But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things,[a] and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.

John 16:12 “I have yet many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. 14 He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you. 15 All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you.

John 20:19 On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being shut where the disciples were, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, “Peace be with you.” 20 When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. 21 Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you.” 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.”

And it ends with the great commission.

Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

Further,

1 John 5:6 This is he who came by water and blood, Jesus Christ, not with the water only but with the water and the blood. 7 And the Spirit is the witness, because the Spirit is the truth. 8 There are three witnesses, the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree.[a] 9 If we receive the testimony of men, the testimony of God is greater; for this is the testimony of God that he has borne witness to his Son.

Peter got it right as Christ will be who we will stand before.In politics they say it’s the economy stupid.I will say It’s the saving name…you get the jest.

Irrelevant, I don’t get the jest and I am a Political Science major.

Peter didn’t get it right. Christ did.

Anybody with common sense know Father,Son and Holy Spirit is not His name.

Anybody with common sense is able to see what Christ said.

Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

Using your own logic from your Peter comment above: You are saying that Christ got it wrong.

Christ’s Words and command is reinforced with our earliest witnesses:

Didache,(.A.D. 70)

“And concerning baptism, thus baptize ye: Having first said all these things, BAPTIZE INTO THE NAME OF THE FATHER, AND OF THE SON, AND OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, in living water. But if thou have not living water, baptize into other water; and if thou canst not in cold, in warm. But if thou have not either, pour out water thrice upon the head into THE NAME OF FATHER AND SON AND HOLY SPIRIT. But before the baptism let the baptizer fast, and the baptized, and whatever others can; but thou shalt order the baptized to fast one or two days before.”(7in ANF,VII:379)

Justin Martyr 1st Apology (A.D. 155)

" I will also relate the manner in which we dedicated ourselves to God when we had been made new through Christ; lest, if we omit this, we seem to be unfair in the explanation we are making. As many as are persuaded and believe that what we teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly, are instructed to pray and to entreat God with fasting, for the remission of their sins that are past, we praying and fasting with them. Then they are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, IN THE NAME OF GOD, THE FATHER AND LORD OF THE UNIVERSE, AND OF OUR SAVIOUR JESUS CHRIST, AND OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, THEY THEN RECEIVE THE WASHING WITH WATER.

Irenaeus (A.D. 190)

“We have received baptism…for the remission of sins in the NAME OF GOD THE FATHER, AND IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST THE SON OF GOD, WHO WAS INCARNATE AND DIED AND ROSE AGAIN, AND IN THE HOLY SPIRIT OF GOD.”(Presentation of the Apostolic Preaching,41,in ECD,195)

 

[Aeg071]

Just like Peter didn’t deny Christ either?

But the point is that I did not say Peter was being disobedient, you are raising a straw I did not drink from. I said that Peter said a short version. Of course, you can’t argue against that and are in need to bring a straw man in order to defend your theology.

Yes, but Christ in the 2nd person of the Trinity. You are missing an entire progression:

John 4:24 God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”

John 10:30 I and the Father are one.”

John 14:26 But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things,[a] and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.

John 16:12 “I have yet many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. 14 He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you. 15 All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you.

John 20:19 On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being shut where the disciples were, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, “Peace be with you.” 20 When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. 21 Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you.” 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.”

And it ends with the great commission.

Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

Further,

1 John 5:6 This is he who came by water and blood, Jesus Christ, not with the water only but with the water and the blood. 7 And the Spirit is the witness, because the Spirit is the truth. 8 There are three witnesses, the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree.[a] 9 If we receive the testimony of men, the testimony of God is greater; for this is the testimony of God that he has borne witness to his Son.

Irrelevant, I don’t get the jest and I am a Political Science major.

Peter didn’t get it right. Christ did.



Anybody with common sense is able to see what Christ said.

Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

Using your own logic from your Peter comment above: You are saying that Christ got it wrong.

Christ’s Words and command is reinforced with our earliest witnesses:

Didache,(.A.D. 70)

“And concerning baptism, thus baptize ye: Having first said all these things, BAPTIZE INTO THE NAME OF THE FATHER, AND OF THE SON, AND OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, in living water. But if thou have not living water, baptize into other water; and if thou canst not in cold, in warm. But if thou have not either, pour out water thrice upon the head into THE NAME OF FATHER AND SON AND HOLY SPIRIT. But before the baptism let the baptizer fast, and the baptized, and whatever others can; but thou shalt order the baptized to fast one or two days before.”(7in ANF,VII:379)

Justin Martyr 1st Apology (A.D. 155)

" I will also relate the manner in which we dedicated ourselves to God when we had been made new through Christ; lest, if we omit this, we seem to be unfair in the explanation we are making. As many as are persuaded and believe that what we teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly, are instructed to pray and to entreat God with fasting, for the remission of their sins that are past, we praying and fasting with them. Then they are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, IN THE NAME OF GOD, THE FATHER AND LORD OF THE UNIVERSE, AND OF OUR SAVIOUR JESUS CHRIST, AND OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, THEY THEN RECEIVE THE WASHING WITH WATER.

Irenaeus (A.D. 190)

“We have received baptism…for the remission of sins in the NAME OF GOD THE FATHER, AND IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST THE SON OF GOD, WHO WAS INCARNATE AND DIED AND ROSE AGAIN, AND IN THE HOLY SPIRIT OF GOD.”(Presentation of the Apostolic Preaching,41,in ECD,195)

I know no writings but the word of God.I will take those gentlemen at their personal opinions.What verse in the Bible say Jesus Christ is the 2nd person of the Trinity.And it is very relevant that Christ is who we will stand before judgement,not three floating heads of some Divine beings. Be Trinitarian mumbo jumbo added to God;s word was for the Arians not me.

It is apparent that you are more trithistic than monotheistic .So I will leave you to your three God’s knowing there are those Trinitarians understand God in three persons is not three individuals which is all you seem to say.

Peace be unto you in Jesus name.

 

[Isaiah45_9]

I know no writings but the word of God.I will take those gentlemen at their personal opinions.What verse in the Bible say Jesus Christ is the 2nd person of the Trinity.And it is very relevant that Christ is who we will stand before judgement,not three floating heads of some Divine beings. Be Trinitarian mumbo jumbo added to God;s word was for the Arians not me.

It is apparent that you are more trithistic than monotheistic .So I will leave you to your three God’s knowing there are those Trinitarians understand God in three persons is not three individuals which is all you seem to say.

Peace be unto you in Jesus name.

Thank you for the insult and the hypocritical blessing and the lack of a reasonable and convincing argumentation.

And when you accept what the word of God is, you are accepting the opinion of men. Since there is no verse in the Bible that lists said writings.

Your descriptive choice of words (Floating heads, mumbo jumbo) also show a lack of maturity.

 

[Aeg071]

Thank you for the insult and the hypocritical blessing and the lack of a reasonable and convincing argumentation.

And when you accept what the word of God is, you are accepting the opinion of men. Since there is no verse in the Bible that lists said writings.

Your descriptive choice of words (Floating heads, mumbo jumbo) also show a lack of maturity.

My maturity level is just fine because each word that came out of my mouth was with deep conviction and I make no excuses for it…i really don’t no what to say to those you either don’t believe Jesus is God and I don;t know what to say to those who believe three individuals make One God.The Bible speaks about One God our Father,yet everybody says some different.Perhaps this will give a little more insight other than the story book fairy tale pained by the Trinitarian notion

The entire debate on distinctions in God has been misdirected for centuries and the majority of conclusions reach are either incomplete(many Oneness) or just plain incorrect(All Trinitarians who believe the Ousia can share) The distinctions in God could not be done away with even if we all verbally say,there are no real distinction.

We constantly overlook God being distinct in how He as manifested Himself.God has made Himself known as Father,Son and Holy Spirit.The Almighty,His Logos and His Spirit.By His Spirit the Logos took to Himself the form of a servant in the only begotten man.Those are real actual distinctions.You can not take those distinction and say they are individual self awareness in degree of but not really actually individual but individual enough to possess separate personality of attribute to the degree of saying three divine hypostasis sharing the Ousia side by side in Tri unity and call that monotheism,you just can not.
What most of us never consider is sometimes we say one thing without implication and would ultimately confess another thing.What I mean by that is from the premise of the incarnation the distinctions are being discussed by Dulles and Chalfant as regards to the Father and Son relationship.
Let me give you clarity on the term temporal.When Dulles use that term it is to be understood as when the fullness of time came God sent forth His son made of a woman. Temporal…Now Trinitarians don’t get to excited when I say this and my Oneness brethren don’t cringe but the distinctions in God are by all accounts eternal.The Logos and His Spirit makes it so.
When we speak of God in distinction we must always remember God has made Himself known by His Logos and His Spirit and any distinctions said to be in God is in fact by God’s means of self disclosure(not generated and proceeding others outside of Himself) When Oneness say Christ pre existed the incarnation as the Father,We have no choice but to mean Christ pre existed the incarnation as the Logos which is God means of self disclosure. You will either be incomplete or incorrect if we attempt to express the distinctions in God’s being outside of how He has made Himself known(manifested)that is in context of scriptures and our explanation can not make God sound like He really is three people being One God and the insult to injury is to adamantly argue a essential threeness to the point of individuality when the writers of scripture wording doesn’t warrant such a notion.One really is One, ten distinctions or three One really means One distinction and all.Even tho it was a Trinitarian who said God is distinguishable in thought,but not separable in fact.It is pure Oneness who actually understands that fact.

You will find some reason to say I’m wrong.however,Quoting the Jesuit Gill as to the properties of the Blessed Trinity.Properties are not personal distinctions even in identity.That would mean what i said and the Jesuit stated are within context of scriptures and the Geek and Latin meaning of hypostasis/prosopon/personae.

Most of the people on this sight seem to be unlearned and per so called orthodoxy one must be qualified to speak on the Trinity.You express God trithisticly which means you are not really qualified to express God’s absolute oneness in the so called Trinity.

We Oneness believe God is Father,Son and Holy Spirit.We just don’t see God in a Trinity and it is a statistical fact most Protestant Trinitarians understand the Trinity from a Oneness theological context. as it should be.

 

[Seakeroftruth]

I have read this hole posting and have found it fascinating. I grew up in a somewhat Catholic home. My dad is Catholic and my mom was Protestant. They did not force on religion on me. They left it for me to choose.

Over the years I have become a Pentecostal. That has never stopped me from seeking the Truth. For me to seek truth I ask questions, pray over the answers and allow God and the Holy Spirit to guide me.

So here is my question.

In Revolutions 1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ. 10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, 11 Saying , I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest , write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea. 12 And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned , I saw seven golden candlesticks; 13 And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. 14 His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; 15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters. 16 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. 17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: 18 I am he that liveth , and was dead; and, behold , I am alive for evermore , Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

In verse 11 the voice says I am the Alpha and the Omega, The first and the last:

Then in verse 17 & 18 the same voice says Fear not; I am the first and the last: I am he that liveth, and was dead and behold I am alive for evermore, Amen; and I have the keys of hell and of death.

So my understanding is that this is Jesus. So then how can he be the Alpha and the Omega (GOD) and the one who liveth, was dead and alive evermore (Jesus) at the same time?

The Holy Spirit or Ghost was released upon the earth after Jesus ascended to Heaven. But 3 times in Revelations Jesus refers himself a the Alpha and the Omega, The first and the last.

How can there be three if two are as one here. I understand the Holy Ghost is the spirit of God and God is everywhere but here it clearly states two of them were as one.

Another question. In Matthew 28 it does say Baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. But who was he talking to? Matthew 28 it says verse

16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them. 17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted . 18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying , All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo , I am with you alway , even unto the end of the world. Amen.

He was talking to the remaining 11 if I understand this correctly. This was right before Jesus ascended to heaven. The Apostles already knew at this point that Jesus is the Son of God.

Peter was given the keys to heaven for saying it in Matthew 15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am ? 16 And Simon Peter answered and said , Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. 17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou , Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. 18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

 

[Seakeroftruth]

So why did Peter baptize in the name of Jesus with all the apostles and even Paul later on did the same thing?

Jesus gave the command that they baptize in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost in Matthew. So why didn’t they do it in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost? All through out Acts and the Bible not once does it say they baptize in the NAME OF but every time it was done in Jesus name. Why? Is it because Jesus is the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost? As stated earlier Jesus says in Revelations he is the Alpha and the Omega. But God is the Alpha and Omega.

Isaiah 43:10 KJV
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen : that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before (Alpha) me there was no God formed , neither shall there be after (Omega) me.

Can anyone try and clear this up for me? I did think of an analogy to try and think about it better. Is it like water? You have the water liquid, water the ice, water the vapor (humidity). No matter what form, it is still water right?

So liquid= God or Word you can drink the Bible?
ice = Jesus you can touch and see?
vapor = Holy Ghost you can feel even though you cannot see?

 

[pablope]

So why did Peter baptize in the name of Jesus with all the apostles and even Paul later on did the same thing?

Jesus gave the command that they baptize in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost in Matthew. So why didn’t they do it in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost? All through out Acts and the Bible not once does it say they baptize in the NAME OF but every time it was done in Jesus name. Why? Is it because Jesus is the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost? As stated earlier Jesus says in Revelations he is the Alpha and the Omega. But God is the Alpha and Omega.

Isaiah 43:10 KJV
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen : that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before (Alpha) me there was no God formed , neither shall there be after (Omega) me.

Can anyone try and clear this up for me? I did think of an analogy to try and think about it better. Is it like water? You have the water liquid, water the ice, water the vapor (humidity). No matter what form, it is still water right?

So liquid= God or Word you can drink the Bible?
ice = Jesus you can touch and see?
vapor = Holy Ghost you can feel even though you cannot see?

It is in in the interpretation, and looking at some historical facts to clarify what is mean by the passage…I am hoping this links will help clarify:

catholic.com/tracts/trinitarian-baptism

threeminuteapologetics.blogspot.com/2012/05/did-catholic-church-change-way.html

Catholics have been baptizing using the Trinitarian formula from the earliest days. There is a document of early Christian practices from about 50 AD called the DIDACHE (pronounced did-a-kay) that details how the early Christians baptized:
“In regard to baptism - baptize thus: After the foregoing instructions, baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living water. If you have no living water, then baptize in other water; and if you are not able in cold, then in warm.”

So why does this verse in Acts say we should be baptizing in Jesus’ name and not in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit? It is made to offer a distinction from other baptisms that were occurring during the earliest days of Christianity. There were the baptisms done by followers of John the Baptist, baptisms done in Jewish liturgies, and baptisms done in pagan rituals. By proclaiming baptisms be done “in the name of Jesus Christ”, the inspired author of Acts was merely attempting to disassociate ourselves from the baptisms done by other sects. It was not an instruction on how to baptize.

 

[Duane1966]

It is in in the interpretation, and looking at some historical facts to clarify what is mean by the passage…I am hoping this links will help clarify:

catholic.com/tracts/trinitarian-baptism

threeminuteapologetics.blogspot.com/2012/05/did-catholic-church-change-way.html

Catholics have been baptizing using the Trinitarian formula from the earliest days. There is a document of early Christian practices from about 50 AD called the DIDACHE (pronounced did-a-kay) that details how the early Christians baptized:
“In regard to baptism - baptize thus: After the foregoing instructions, baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living water. If you have no living water, then baptize in other water; and if you are not able in cold, then in warm.”

So why does this verse in Acts say we should be baptizing in Jesus’ name and not in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit? It is made to offer a distinction from other baptisms that were occurring during the earliest days of Christianity. There were the baptisms done by followers of John the Baptist, baptisms done in Jewish liturgies, and baptisms done in pagan rituals. By proclaiming baptisms be done “in the name of Jesus Christ”, the inspired author of Acts was merely attempting to disassociate ourselves from the baptisms done by other sects. It was not an instruction on how to baptize.

You hit the bullseye! :clapping:

 

[Seakeroftruth]

Okay I have read the links you have provided. But I am still confused I guess about the trinity.

In Matthew 28:19 it says "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

So what is the name of God? I know the name of the son is Jesus but what is the name of God? What is the name of the Holy Ghost?

Jesus told the apostles to Baptize in the NAME of. So what is the Name of all three? The Son is easy that would be Jesus. So Baptize in the name of Jesus who is the son but what is the name of the other two?

Who do we pray to also? Is there only one God or is there three Gods?

 

[GaryTaylor]

Who do we pray to also? Is there only one God or is there three Gods?

The Incarnate Word of God is God for there can be no other God, we would have to agree this is even possible otherwise, and to make a long story short, its not imho. Jesus divinely established a Church. It is written;

17
Jesus said to him in reply, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah. For flesh and blood* has not revealed this to you, but my heavenly Father.
18
k And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church,* and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.
19
l I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven.* Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

God has always been Himself. man has had continued issues understanding this, and also he is not god, God is God who was and is immutable. And He always had His Word and Wisdom for it is also written. The Spirit of God was always God and from the start of creation.

The question is to me, why did God become man, how did He become man, and surely He didn’t “have to” to do this? And surely God was still God should He become man?

 

[Kliska]

Is there only one God or is there three Gods?

One God, Three Persons.

I braid my hair a lot; 3 strands, 1 braid, all hair.

 

[Seakeroftruth]

One God, Three Persons.

I braid my hair a lot; 3 strands, 1 braid, all hair.

Okay so it is like My dad, Me, and my son?

Back to my question though.

Why does Matthew 28 say Baptize in the name of the father and of the son and of the holy ghost?

We why don’t christians be baptized in God, Jesus and the Holy Ghost? The name of the son is Jesus and so to be baptized in the name of then it means it has to use Jesus name. There is power in Jesus name right? Didn’t Jesus say ask for all things in my name?

I am truly trying to understand. I have another question about the Virgin Mary and who made her pregnant. Was it God who made her pregnant or the Holy Ghost?

 

[Darryl_B]

In Matthew 28:19 it says "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

So what is the name of God? I know the name of the son is Jesus but what is the name of God? What is the name of the Holy Ghost?

Jesus told the apostles to Baptize in the NAME of. So what is the Name of all three? The Son is easy that would be Jesus. So Baptize in the name of Jesus who is the son but what is the name of the other two?

Who do we pray to also? Is there only one God or is there three Gods?

My friend, when it says “baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit”, Jesus is not leaving us to guess what the name(s) is/are. He is not saying think about it, and make up your own understanding about this. He is not saying change it to “YHWH”. He is not saying start with the obvious one “Jesus” for the Son and go from there. He is not saying if that is as far as you can understand, then stick with that instead. He is not providing us with that license.

Instead what he is doing is defining three distinct Persons within One Saviour God, and he is also defining relationship within that entity. Which also answers your question.

 

[Kliska]

Okay so it is like My dad, Me, and my son?

No, because any metaphor is going to come up short at some point, even my braid metaphor; you guys don’t have the same DNA.

Back to my question though.

You’ve not just had one question, I answered several.

Why does Matthew 28 say Baptize in the name of the father and of the son and of the holy ghost?

I don’t really “get” your question; we baptize in the authority of Jesus using the formula He gave as it is recorded; Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. It’s like someone being sent by the ruler of a far country and doing things in their name. It is an affirmation of the act being done and directly invokes the trinity. There were other types of baptism, such as John’s baptism. John’s baptism and Jesus’ baptism are two different things. Baptizing someone in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is doing so with the formula Jesus gave, when it is talked about elsewhere such as “in the name of the Lord Jesus” it is talking about under Whose authority.

I am truly trying to understand. I have another question about the Virgin Mary and who made her pregnant. Was it God who made her pregnant or the Holy Ghost?

The Holy Spirit is God.

 

[Adamski]

A lot of them are oneness Pentecostals that deny the trinity all can trace thier roots to less than 100 years ago in San fransisco

 

[Porknpie]

Okay so it is like My dad, Me, and my son?

Back to my question though.

Why does Matthew 28 say Baptize in the name of the father and of the son and of the holy ghost?

We why don’t christians be baptized in God, Jesus and the Holy Ghost? The name of the son is Jesus and so to be baptized in the name of then it means it has to use Jesus name. There is power in Jesus name right? Didn’t Jesus say ask for all things in my name?

I am truly trying to understand. I have another question about the Virgin Mary and who made her pregnant. Was it God who made her pregnant or the Holy Ghost?

Luke 1

30 And the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. 31 And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus.

32 He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High;
and the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David,
33 and he will reign over the house of Jacob for ever;
and of his kingdom there will be no end.”
34 And Mary said to the angel, “How can this be, since I have no husband?” 35 And the angel said to her,

“The Holy Spirit will come upon you,
and the power of the Most High will overshadow you;
therefore the child to be born will be called holy,
the Son of God.

St Gregory of Nazianzen’s words in the late 4th century seem fitting to the conversation:

“For the Father is not Son, and yet this is not due to either deficiency or subjection of Essence; but the very fact of being Unbegotten or Begotten, or Proceeding has given the name of Father to the First, of the Son to the Second, and of the Third, Him of Whom we are speaking, of the Holy Ghost that the distinction of the Three Persons may be preserved in the one nature and dignity of the Godhead. For neither is the Son Father, for the Father is One, but He is what the Father is; nor is the Spirit Son because He is of God, for the Only-begotten is One, but He is what the Son is. The Three are One in Godhead, and the One Three in properties; so that neither is the Unity a Sabellian one, nor does the Trinity countenance the present evil distinction. What then? Is the Spirit God? Most certainly. Well then, is He Consubstantial? Yes, if He is God.” Gregory of Nazianzen, 5th Oration - On the Holy Spirit, 9-10 (A.D. 383).

 

[Son_of_Niall]

Okay I have read the links you have provided. But I am still confused I guess about the trinity.

In Matthew 28:19 it says "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

So what is the name of God? I know the name of the son is Jesus but what is the name of God? What is the name of the Holy Ghost?

Jesus told the apostles to Baptize in the NAME of. So what is the Name of all three? The Son is easy that would be Jesus. So Baptize in the name of Jesus who is the son but what is the name of the other two?

Who do we pray to also? Is there only one God or is there three Gods?

Curious how you went DIRECTLY to four month old thread posting the same as the now banned Aeg071…curious.

 

[Seakeroftruth]

Curious how you went DIRECTLY to four month old thread posting the same as the now banned Aeg071…curious.

As God is my witness I am not the Aeg071. I put my daughter into a private Christian school and they are one God Apostolic Pentecostals and wanted to find out more about what they believe and compare it to how I was raised by my Catholic Father. I am Pentecostal and we baptize in the name of the father and of the son and of the holy spirit.

It has moved in me to find the truth about the bible. I never fallow what man tells me to fallow. I fallow where the Holy Ghost leads me. I am trying to understand the trinity.

If the bible says to baptize in the name of the son, Then why don’t we baptize in the name of Jesus? It is the name of the son? Why is it we do not use Jesus name in Pentecostal or in Catholic practices? Because back in 50 - 70 AD some men got together and said so or do we fallow the Logos which is truth? Is it because of tradition we do this?

The Jews did not see the coming of Jesus because they were so caught up in tradition that anything outside of it was a sin. It was a threat to the way they always did thinks. It would change everything. Most people are not open to change. To me, that is a mistake. Change could be bad but in more times than not it is good.

I have read some of the posted links in this thread and have been researching the Catholic history. If anyone wanted to do something against the churches approval then they would call them heretics and put them to death. Look at William Tyndale. All he was doing was converting the Latin bible to English. But the church burned him at the stake and sent his soul to burn in hell forever. The Catholic church from my understanding if someone is found guilty of Heresy then they will be judged to burn in hell as well. I may be wrong but that is what I was told by a number of Catholics inside my family and out.

Why does the Catholic Church have the power to try, convict, kill and condemn anyone who does not go with the church doctrine? I thought that only Jesus who is God on earth in my opinion has that right to judge and condemn on the day of Judgment?

I have asked a lot of questions and I have not found any real answer to them. I find scripture that counters what some of the answers were given. I use to be a police officer and I would gather evidence from all sources, not just one side, and make my decision based of the evidence.

Examples to fallow.