Archbishop Chaput on Conscience

[Janet_S]

Actually, “actual” Catholic teachings go beyond what is at CA. CA is only one subset of the entire Church. Rome realizes this, and San Diego is not Rome.

Are you saying there are 2 “actual” Catholic teachings about female priestesses?

There is actually only 1 teaching about this, and we can look to the Pope if we want to know what it is.

 

[Janet_S]

Bishop Fabian W. Bruskewitz’s decision to excommunicate members of Call to Action in his diocese must have had some bite to it, otherwise why did they appeal to the Holy See?

catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0606995.htm

In a Nov. 24 letter to the Lincoln bishop, made public Dec. 8, Cardinal Giovanni Battista Re, prefect of the Vatican Congregation for Bishops, told Bishop Bruskewitz that his ruling “was properly taken within your competence as pastor of that diocese.”

“The judgment of the Holy See is that the activities of Call to Action in the course of these years are in contrast with the Catholic faith due to views and positions held which are unacceptable from a doctrinal and disciplinary standpoint,” the cardinal said in his letter.

Guess the Holy See isn’t the advocate of “primacy of conscience” after all.

 

[Brendan]

It all amounts to nothing for obvious reasons. I recall discussing it in a pastoral ministry class oh in 1995 that he was going to do it. Nothing has changed because he didn’t excommunicate “anyone” just a lot of anonymous “anyone’s”.

No, quite a number of people are under excommunication.

He set the parameters for excommunication, and anyone who meets those are now excommunicated.

Anyone in his diocese who chose to remain in CTA are now excommunicated. They may not recieve the Sacraments from any Catholic anywhere until the excommunication is lifted, under penalty of Mortal Sin. If any Catholic minister knowingly offers them the Sacraments, they too are under Mortal Sin.

 

[joseph_virgen]

what is truth? and i believe " the wind blows wherever it pleases. you hear the sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. so it is with everyone born of the spirit."

sorry, i never recieved the memo informing me the church had successfully monapolized the Holy Spirit.

 

[Dameedna]

This is from an article by Archbishop Chaput entitled, “10 points for Catholic Citizens to Remember.” (All italics belong to the Archbishop.)

1. Each of us needs to follow his or her own properly formed conscience. But conscience doesn’t emerge from a vacuum. It’s not a matter of personal opinion or preference. If our conscience has the habit of telling us what we want to hear on difficult issues, then it’s probably badly formed. A healthy conscience is the voice of God’s truth in our hearts, and it should usually make us uncomfortable, because none of us is yet a saint. The way we get a healthy conscience is by submitting it and shaping it to the will of God; and the way we find God’s will is by opening our hearts to the counsel and guidance of the Church that Jesus left us. If we find ourselves disagreeing as Catholics with the Catholic teaching of our Church on a serious matter, it’s probably not the Church that’s wrong. The problem is much more likely with us.

And what happens when we are happy with the Churches teaching and uncomfortable with another view? Do we then say “Oh, well you are happy with it , therefore the church is correct”. hmmm…

Claiming that feeling “uncomfortable” is a way to the truth , imo is very accurate. But claiming that when you feel uncomfortable you need to err on the side of the church is inconsistant.

It is more important to figure out what those uncomfortable feelings actually mean, than worry wether or not they agree with a religion.

You may not agree with that, but if not…how on earth do you think all those people out there, who are following OTHER religions, will change? If one is uncomfortable, then they must take it all the way and follow through on their doubts, even if those are doubts against Christianity and the lessons they are learning by their denomination.

I don’t agree with erring on the side of caution with a church. I think it’s better to live in discomfort, and the unknown…consistancy isn’t alway’s the truth.

 

[Dameedna]

He’s right on with this statement.

“Conscience” as understood by a number of Catholics today, is an excuse to dissent from Church teachings. This false idea of conscience can be traced back to the 1960’s when so many theologians disagreed with the Pope about Humanae Vitae and devised a reason to do it. Before this time, you won’t find any Catholics who used the noble idea of conscience as an excuse to dissent from Church teachings or as a rationale to explain away their sins.

The false idea of conscience, embraced by some Catholics in the modern world, is a very wimpy, anemic force. It doesn’t make any hard demands and urges them to just go with the flow. It saves them from the hard work of conversion and renewing their minds in truth.

The classic, noble idea of conscience is a very different thing. It makes demands on the faithful. Real conscience is what leads one to become a martyr and/or a saint.

Why I think you may be right to a degree, I think you will also find that if people “push” those uncomfortable feelings any further, they will walk away from the church not embrace it.

Many of them aren’t just being lazy. They are simply not willing to push those feelings to their obvious conclusion, which is that they don’t “agree” with the church nor will they ever.

I know very few catholics, who support some of the more “big ticket” items, like no contraception, illegalizing abortion, and putting a women under the ultimate direction of a male. I know many, and they all disagree with current teachings for “specific” reasons.

They ONLY remain in the church, because they like a many good things about it. Push them…and they won’t toe the line. They will leave. That may be the best for the church, but I do not think so.

Don’t make the assumption that a conscience that grows, will ultimately align with the church. More often than not, it is the opposite.