Are atheists immoral?

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ChrisGriffin said:
Honest question to atheist…

If you google worst genocides of the 20th century you won’t find many Christian perpetrators (maybe 1 or 2 out of 20, I’m not an expert). Certainly Mao, Hitler, Stalin and Tojo were not Christians. Is history in favor of Christianity and disfavors atheist and secularism and oriental religion. I’m sure this point has been made many times before but I have never heard the answer myself.
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To me it’s generally come across as painting with a wide brush and using a grouping to malign another person that is otherwise unlike those that have displayed the bad behaviour (there are similar arguments that are used against the concept of religion, and I feel the same way about those). Someone that isn’t convinced there is a God doesn’t necessarily have ideological agreement or a shared value system with the people that you mentioned above. Having a theistic position of some type also doesn’t prevent someone from having a desire to kill a group of people. You can find 20th century examples of people and groups that have wanted to kill other groups sometimes for religiously motivated reasons.

There’s also many peaceful people that follow eastern religions. I don’t think that the people that you’ve listed above reflect the disposition and behaviour of these people.
 
ChrisGriffin said:
I think some of what you said is true but I can’t escape the blatant fact that all or almost all 20 century genocides are perpetrated by non-Christians. I don’t know of any of the top 20 that were perpetrated by Christians(although there my be 1 or 2).
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I think the use of the word “Escape” here presents my position as being one of being in a dilemma when that isn’t the case. Some of the nations that are considered to be powerful, Christian, and stable today have at their histories or foundations actions that can be classified as genocide and demonstrate putting a low value on the lives of others. The nation in which my home exists is probably a good example of this. The selection of the 20th century as a cut off for consideration to me feels like an intentional filtering out of these histories and foundations.

BTW: I think Germany has been mainly Christian throughout the 20th century. It might not be the best of data points for the point that I think you are trying to make.
 
STT said:
So you have got the meaning!? Everything is empty without the meaning.

Perhaps there is no meaning in life!? I don’t know.
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If there is no meaning in life there is no meaning in the assertion that there is no meaning in life - or any other assertion for that matter 🙂 It is other words it is sheer nonsense - like atheism!
 
tonyrey said:
If there is no meaning in life there is no meaning in the assertion that there is no meaning in life - or any other assertion for that matter 🙂
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You are combining two different meanings into a one.
tonyrey said:
It is other words it is sheer nonsense - like atheism!
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So, you haven’t got the meaning. We have feelings and are rational beings. Meaning is something different from feelings and rationality.
 
STT said:
If there is no meaning in life there is no meaning in the assertion that there is no meaning in life - or any other assertion for that matter
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All meanings are fundamentally the same. Either an assertion is meaningful or meaningless.
It is other words it is sheer nonsense - like atheism!
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So, you haven’t got the meaning. We have feelings and are rational beings. Meaning is something different from feelings and rationality.
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In that case what is it? :confused:
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tonyrey said:
In that case what is it? :confused:
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In reality we are moving because of feelings and choose destination by thinking. Feelings are not the reason for creation. Therefore there should be an ultimate purpose/meaning if there is a God.
 
STT said:
In reality we are moving because of feelings and choose destination by thinking. Feelings are not the reason for creation. Therefore there should be an ultimate purpose/meaning if there is a God.
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Feelings mean something. We clearly experience meaning in our emotions. That’s why we have words that differentiate them. Love. guilt, etc. And our emotions meaningfully relate to objective reality and our experience of it. There is meaning in our experiences which shouldn’t exist at all if everything is just blind meaningless physical processes.

The existence of God is not an improbable proposition.
 
IWantGod said:
Feelings mean something.
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What do you mean?
IWantGod said:
We clearly experience meaning in our emotions.
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That is not correct. We just merely experience emotions. There is no meaning in feeling.
IWantGod said:
That’s why we have words that differentiate them. Love. guilt, etc.
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Yes, feelings are different and need different names. But feelings has nothing to do with meaning.
IWantGod said:
And our emotions meaningfully relate to objective reality and our experience of it.
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That is not correct. We are following our feelings blindly to make sure that life keeps going.
IWantGod said:
There is meaning in our experiences which shouldn’t exist at all if everything is just blind meaningless physical processes.
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Why we don’t share meaning if it is real? Am I missing such a thing?
IWantGod said:
The existence of God is not an improbable proposition.
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That is off topic.
 
STT said:
What would be the purpose of feelings if they don’t push us to live life?
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Life has no meaning so how can feelings push us to “live” if our emotions contain no meaning.
 
STT said:
In reality we are moving because of feelings and choose destination by thinking. Feelings are not the reason for creation. Therefore there should be an ultimate purpose/meaning if there is a God.
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It is more reasonable to believe the ultimate purpose/meaning of our life is that we exist in order to choose what to believe, how to live and who to love. Our thoughts, feelings, emotions, values, choices, principles and decisions are all part of the reason for creating us with our power of insight and self-control.
 
tonyrey said:
It is more reasonable to believe the ultimate purpose/meaning of our life is that we exist in order to choose what to believe, how to live and who to love. Our thoughts, feelings, emotions, values, choices, principles and decisions are all part of the reason for creating us with our power of insight and self-control.
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That sounds really close to saying we decide what meaning is.
 
HerCrazierHalf said:
It is more reasonable to believe the ultimate purpose/meaning of our life is that we exist in order to choose what to believe, how to live and who to love. Our thoughts, feelings, emotions, values, choices, principles and decisions are all part of the reason for creating us with our power of insight and self-control.
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We do as far as our own lives are concerned. That’s the beauty of life. 🙂
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tonyrey said:
It is more reasonable to believe the ultimate purpose/meaning of our life is that we exist in order to choose what to believe, how to live and who to love. Our thoughts, feelings, emotions, values, choices, principles and decisions are all part of the reason for creating us with our power of insight and self-control.
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How there could be any meaning when there are people who feel so empty and commit suicide? We are all just so busy with all you said that we could not distinguish that there is no meaning for life, at least we don’t know.
 
PRmerger said:
Yes, atheists are immoral.

Theists are immoral as well. 🤷
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Just do good" was his challenge, “and we’ll find a meeting point.”

Francis explained himself, “The Lord created us in His image and likeness, and we are the image of the Lord, and He does good and all of us have this commandment at heart, do good and do not do evil. All of us. ‘But, Father, this is not Catholic! He cannot do good.’ Yes, he can… “The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ, all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone!” We must meet one another doing good. ‘But I don’t believe, Father, I am an atheist!’ But do good: we will meet one another there.”
 
STT said:
It is more reasonable to believe the ultimate purpose/meaning of our life is that we exist in order to choose what to believe, how to live and who to love. Our thoughts, feelings, emotions, values, choices, principles and decisions are all part of the reason for creating us with our power of insight and self-control.
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Feelings are notoriously deceptive. We’re not here to baseour life just on our feelings but to choose what to believe, how to live and who to love.
We are all just so busy with all you said that we could not distinguish that there is no meaning for life, at least we don’t know.
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Who are “we”? :confused:
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