Are Catholics chosen?

[valentino]

I been doing some thinking on religion and it occurred to me that Catholics must be chosen to be Catholics.Reason being we know that their are many decent non Catholic people.if are born in a Lutheran family you may not commit many sins except those which Catholics consider sins.Like not going to a priest for confession at least once a year and the many other Church laws.If this Lutheran didn’t break the 10 commandments and overall was a decent person why or what would be his incentive to even seek the Catholic faith?Now if some of you say that Lutheran’s do commit mortal sins and they know in their hearts that being Lutheran’s they aren’t following God’s laws or the bible then lets take another protestant denomination which is even closer to obeying God’s laws.My pt.is that since some protestants don’t if feel inclined to seek Catholicm wouldnt that mean that Catholics are chosen to be Catholics?

 

[GloriousOrder]

All human beings are chosen by God to be Catholics. Our Lord Jesus Christ is the manifestation of that choice by God. The great thing about our heavenly Father is precisely the fact that He extends His own choice to us, too. He has given us the ability to say the same “yes” to truth, being, and reality that is recorded in Genesis 1:1. We are not about predestination in this Church…

Every last person is called, though some think they hear a horn when it is a trumpet. The Church exists to help people sort out what they’re hearing! What a wonderful conductor we have, as the Composer looks on.

 

[bethanysamuel]

Every last person is called, though some think they hear a horn when it is a trumpet. The Church exists to help people sort out what they’re hearing! What a wonderful conductor we have, as the Composer looks on.

Beautiful

 

[Danquayle76]

If you really want to get technical and begin delving deep into the works of Saint Augustine and Saint Thomas Aquinas…the answer is yes: predestination exists!

Yet, we all maintain free will and have the opportunity of accepting God’s grace. How predestination and free will are compatible is a mystery of the faith.

 

[bethanysamuel]

Is it pre-destined that for the last forever i’ve been subjected to endless amounts of pain? I’m not being sarcastic. Was i chosen to undergo this torment? Again, i’m not being sarcastic. I’ve had a particularly tragic life.

 

[asd72]

Is it pre-destined that for the last forever i’ve been subjected to endless amounts of pain? I’m not being sarcastic. Was i chosen to undergo this torment? Again, i’m not being sarcastic. I’ve had a particularly tragic life.

I am the one out of my siblings who has had the most problems. I find life quite difficult, and seem to have problems getting it together. What I have realized is my difficulties have helped draw me to God, so I feel in some ways thankful!

 

[Danquayle76]

Is it pre-destined that for the last forever i’ve been subjected to endless amounts of pain? I’m not being sarcastic. Was i chosen to undergo this torment? Again, i’m not being sarcastic. I’ve had a particularly tragic life.

When talking about predestination we’re just talking about salvation. The idea is that only Christ can save us. We can’t save ourselves. Thus, people who receive God’s grace do so because God willed it not because they themselves willed it .

However, not everyone will die in a state of grace. People have the option of rejecting God’s grace when offered it. However, as God is all-powerful and knowing he already knows whether a person will choose to accept or deny his grace. Thus, the “elect” have been predestined from the beginning of time.

 

[bethanysamuel]

The problem i have there is that i am in a constant battle between hope and despair;one minute i’m in a state of grace,then some further tragedy strikes and i slip into anger and even suicidal thoughts. I so far have survived and at this particular moment i’m in a state of grace otherwise i wouldn’t have received this morning. The thing is: what if i’m pre-destined to eventually giving into temptation and then die in that state? if so, why bother even trying? I do worry at times what will become of me because its like God wants me but the devil wants me even more. Its not in my imagination, there really is a war going on. Who will win?

 

[Danquayle76]

The problem i have there is that i am in a constant battle between hope and despair;one minute i’m in a state of grace,then some further tragedy strikes and i slip into anger and even suicidal thoughts. I so far have survived and at this particular moment i’m in a state of grace otherwise i wouldn’t have received this morning. The thing is: what if i’m pre-destined to eventually giving into temptation and then die in that state? if so, why bother even trying? I do worry at times what will become of me because its like God wants me but the devil wants me even more. Its not in my imagination, there really is a war going on. Who will win?

The whole issue of predestination really doesn’t have much impact on our lives. Predestination explains God’s perspective, but we have free will and that is what matters most. How exactly free will and predestination are compatible is a mystery of the faith.

However, suicidal thoughts are not normal. You should immediately seek spiritual guidance from a good Catholic priest and seek treatment from a Catholic therapist.

 

[richlo]

Here are a couple of scriptures on this:

“Dear friends, **God the Father chose you long ago **and knew you would become His children.” 1 Peter 1:2

John 15:15-17
New American Standard Bible (NASB)

15 No longer do I call you slaves, for the slave does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I have heard from My Father I have made known to you. 16 You did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you that you would go and bear fruit, and that your fruit would remain, so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you. 17 This I command you, that you love one another.

Ephesians 1:5
New American Standard Bible (NASB)

5 He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the **kind intention of His will,

Ephesians 1:11
New American Standard Bible (NASB)

11 also we have obtained an inheritance, **having been predestined **according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will

There is allot more than this in the scriptures…**

 

[valentino]

If you really want to get technical and begin delving deep into the works of Saint Augustine and Saint Thomas Aquinas…the answer is yes: predestination exists!

Yet, we all maintain free will and have the opportunity of accepting God’s grace. How predestination and free will are compatible is a mystery of the faith.

thanks.as a matter of fact i did want to get technical.I read the same thing in the Catechism i believe.It said that there are a very few who are predestined for heaven and likewise their are a few predestined for hell.Predestined for hell hinted at the fact that a few people are from a very early age are so hardened in their heart that they just refuse to recieve the grace that God gives them.IMO it may be like a hundred since man was created.Maybe more but that’s just a guess on my part with no information to back this up.

 

[valentino]

Is it pre-destined that for the last forever i’ve been subjected to endless amounts of pain? I’m not being sarcastic. Was i chosen to undergo this torment? Again, i’m not being sarcastic. I’ve had a particularly tragic life.

Friend IMO you’re not one of them.God Bless you.

 

[The_Old_Medic]

No, people are NOT chosen to be Catholics. If that were the case, then we would have no free will, we could not be saved or condemned, because we would have no control over out lives and our choices.

And, if a person is NOT a Catholic, they are under no obligation at all to confess their sins to a Priest, to receive the Eucharist, etc. Failing to do those things would never be a sin for anyone that did not accept the responsibility.

If we really had no choice about accepting or rejecting, then were literally WOULD BE SLAVES.

In that case, the idea of redemption by Jesus would literally make no sense. It would not have been necessary at all.

There is absolutely no teaching by the Catholic Church that even hints at the concept that we are “Chosen”. I can;t help but wonder how people that claim to be Catholics, can be so wrong about what their own church teaches.

 

[valentino]

Here are a couple of scriptures on this:

“Dear friends, **God the Father chose you long ago **and knew you would become His children.” 1 Peter 1:2

John 15:15-17
New American Standard Bible (NASB)

15 No longer do I call you slaves, for the slave does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I have heard from My Father I have made known to you. 16 You did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you that you would go and bear fruit, and that your fruit would remain, so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you. 17 This I command you, that you love one another.

Ephesians 1:5
New American Standard Bible (NASB)

5 He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the **kind intention of His will,

Ephesians 1:11
New American Standard Bible (NASB)

11 also we have obtained an inheritance, **having been predestined ****according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will

There is allot more than this in the scriptures…

thanks for you relating those quotes.I believe that Catholics are chosen to be Catholics.It in no way means that Catholics are to have an easier path to heaven however.On the contrary we Catholic have a great responsibility place on us.A life of sacrifice and self denial is not an easy path to follow.Again this is just my opinion(the way I understand it).

 

[richlo]

thanks for you relating those quotes.I believe that Catholics are chosen to be Catholics.It in no way means that Catholics are to have an easier path to heaven however.On the contrary we Catholic have a great responsibility place on us.A life of sacrifice and self denial is not an easy path to follow.Again this is just my opinion(the way I understand it).

I believe so as well the paths is narrower for us, so its not an easy path to walk

 

[HelenRose]

The problem i have there is that i am in a constant battle between hope and despair;one minute i’m in a state of grace,then some further tragedy strikes and i slip into anger and even suicidal thoughts. I so far have survived and at this particular moment i’m in a state of grace otherwise i wouldn’t have received this morning. The thing is: what if i’m pre-destined to eventually giving into temptation and then die in that state? if so, why bother even trying? I do worry at times what will become of me because its like God wants me but the devil wants me even more. Its not in my imagination, there really is a war going on. Who will win?

This argument is a wonderful tactic that the father of lies uses to encourage despair. You do know don’t you that the devil is incapable of telling the truth? He does not want you. He wants to destroy you.

Ask yourself this: If I do have free will I and choose life, then will I not be fulfilling God’s wonderful plan for me? On a practical thought. What do you have to lose by living a life fill with life? If you are wrong, well then… you have at least not made life worse for those around you and perhaps you may even be able to give joy and happiness to one soul who is struggling with the same sorrows that you are dealing with.

I know you are not really asking for advise but here it is anyway. Try to step out of yourself and give joy to at least one other human being each day. Even if that joy is a simple smile to someone on the street.

Since I am a Catholic, I DO believe in freewill and I have accepted God’s love for me. What you are dealing with is a simplistic version of Calvin’s rational.

 

[bethanysamuel]

Well i mean the Creed does say that Jesus will come again to judge the living and the dead. He is the just Judge. So my interpretation of that is that he’ll weigh everything up,then decide who goes where. When he looks at me he’ll see i tried my best and had a good heart. These days i feel very close to God but its almost as if the closer i get to God,the more i’m tested! As for helping others,yes,i do. Mainly by trying not to judge them and being empathetic.

 

[HelenRose]

Well i mean the Creed does say that Jesus will come again to judge the living and the dead. He is the just Judge. So my interpretation of that is that he’ll weigh everything up,then decide who goes where. When he looks at me he’ll see i tried my best and had a good heart. These days i feel very close to God but its almost as if the closer i get to God,the more i’m tested! As for helping others,yes,i do. Mainly by trying not to judge them and being empathetic.

If you are a Catholic, go to confession. It sounds as if you are suffering with what Catholics call “scruples” a good priest can help you understand what is happening.

You may also be experiencing a “Dark Night of the Soul”
It is also possible you are needing the help of a good therapist. Depression is a serious problem and there is no shame in seeking help from a professional counselor.

Your questions are not going to be easily answered. It is a life long journey.

We are all sinners. Trust in God’s Divine Mercy. Ask for Mercy.
As Christ Himself said, “Take my yoke upon you. My yoke is easy and my burden is light.”

 

[valentino]

No, people are NOT chosen to be Catholics. If that were the case, then we would have no free will, we could not be saved or condemned, because we would have no control over out lives and our choices.

And, if a person is NOT a Catholic, they are under no obligation at all to confess their sins to a Priest, to receive the Eucharist, etc. Failing to do those things would never be a sin for anyone that did not accept the responsibility.

If we really had no choice about accepting or rejecting, then were literally WOULD BE SLAVES.

In that case, the idea of redemption by Jesus would literally make no sense. It would not have been necessary at all.

There is absolutely no teaching by the Catholic Church that even hints at the concept that we are “Chosen”. I can;t help but wonder how people that claim to be Catholics, can be so wrong about what their own church teaches.

I respect your opinion.i wasn’t ?s saying that Catholics were chosen or not.I just gave my opinion why i thought Catholics may be chosen.we consider priests chosen to be priests.where have you read that Catholics aren’t chosen?the Jews were chosen people.I don’t think you understand what i was trying to say.Say anyone who converts to Catholicm or a person who is baptized into the Church as a baby.Could you not say that that baby was chosen to be Catholic since he was born into a Catholic family?Or the convert chosen since he chose to become Catholic and not a Baptist,mormon,or of any other denomination?Is there a grace working in him that led him into the Church?I wasn’t try to claim this was some doctrine of the Church or something.

 

[wisdomseeker]

No, people are NOT chosen to be Catholics. If that were the case, then we would have no free will, we could not be saved or condemned, because we would have no control over out lives and our choices.

And, if a person is NOT a Catholic, they are under no obligation at all to confess their sins to a Priest, to receive the Eucharist, etc. Failing to do those things would never be a sin for anyone that did not accept the responsibility.

If we really had no choice about accepting or rejecting, then were literally WOULD BE SLAVES.

In that case, the idea of redemption by Jesus would literally make no sense. It would not have been necessary at all.

There is absolutely no teaching by the Catholic Church that even hints at the concept that we are “Chosen”. I can;t help but wonder how people that claim to be Catholics, can be so wrong about what their own church teaches.

Perhaps the confusion is what it means by chosen. the jews certainly call themselves chosen people of God. Certainly the Church leads the chosen people of God. There is a difference between those of the world and those who are chosen.

But what it all means? what it means to be the chosen ones? how do you become the chosen ones. Certainly the people of God must be different from those of the world.