Are converts the 'best' Catholics?

[Justin_Mee]

As a convert in RCIA, my conversion has been many years in coming. I have studied Catholic websites, read books and prayed about my decision. Now, I have the increased opportunity to talk to many cradle Catholics and interact with them. I am surprised at the number of them that only believe a portion of the faith. I have talked to some about certain aspects of the faith and been surprised at how little they know about the subject or simply do not believe a critical teaching. I waited until I could justify and believe in the total package until I made my decision. Well, maybe I can’t rationalize a very few things but I determined to accept them on faith alone. I simply don’t see how one can call themselves Catholic and not believe in, the real presence or accept our position on abortion, birth control, Mary or a host of other pillars of the faith. I believe there may be an advantage to convert to the faith as a mature adult and not have the baggage of ill-formed and negative experiences of children in the church. One person I talked to told me, as a child, he was not allowed to even turn his head in the pew during Mass. He was not allowed to smile or approach the Priest at all. The Priest was unapproachable even for his parents. He was made to go to confession at least once a month and confess. He said he just made things up most of time. He told me this ‘soured’ him on the faith. I’m glad I was not reared in the Catholic Church because I might not be here today. The church would greatly benefit from a “Faith Study” program. I think it would be well attended.

 

[Teneas]

To answer your question, with only my opinion, Yes, the majority of converts do make better Catholics. They take the time to learn what they are supposed to know and represent. Not saying that other ones aren’t as avid, cause I have been Catholic from age 9 and I am pretty avid.

 

[chaunceygardner]

My impressions and experiences agree with yours completely. Cradle Catholics that I have known appear to have a spotty understanding of their faith, and little knowledge of the Catechism. Those who convert are taught more and are expected to know more, which definitely helps. I have seen a big divide between what Catholic teens know about their faith and what most Protestant teens know about theirs, and Jewish/Hebrew studies are out of sight in comparison (Muslim faith instruction seems to be right up there as well). And adult faith studies offerings appear to be non-existent in most parishes.

All in all, one is much further ahead understanding their faith by entering the Church through the RCIA program or similar ways than just by being “born” into it.

Your suggestion is a good one; perhaps an RCIA-like program for ALL Catholics would be in order.

 

[crazzeto]

They will have a tendancy to be more enthused, because obviously they had to work for their Catholic faith, where as the rest of us cradle catholics grew up with it and tend to take it for granted.

That said, it’s a fallocy to believe that there aren’t very strong cradel catholics out there. I know my own faith has grown to be pretty strong, and in manyways I almost feel like a convert (revert? lol). If there’s any unenthused cradel catholic out there, wondering what they can do to strengthen their faith I would suggest this, pray the rosary and do it consitantly for several weeks. After doing some thinking, I feel like I can trace back the true ignition of faith in my life to about when I started doing this, so I can only assume that Mary’s 15 promises are very much still in full force!

 

[Teneas]

There are great “cradle Catholics”, great great ones.

I still believe there is something going on in our teachings to the youth. I myself experienced it. Don’t know what it is. Perhaps it’s Satan paying attention and tempting more? I don’t know.

If you guys ever come up with a great plan to teach our youth, my sons included to some extent, better than how we do it now, I am down for it.

I was amazed how little my own sons knew. I have taught them all about Catholicism since they were born. The other day I was shocked to hear them both fumble on the question of who visited Jesus on the night of his birth. The WISE MEN!

facepalm

And I have taught them all about it…don’t know if they just think it’s to boring or what.

 

[twopekinguys]

You’ve gotten some very good responses here, so I guess I will add my 2 cents.

I’m not fond of saying “best” Catholics. But I will say it seems converts take their faith more seriously, and seem to have a deeper appreciation for it.

Personally, I went through RCIA 15 years ago, and have been involved with it ever since. I became so involved that I became the Lay Director of RCIA for our parish 10 years ago.

Our parish program always has some “cradle” Catholics coming through for a refresher type course. We often get feedback telling us how much they learned, or how much they had forgotten and came back to them through the classes. It is truly rewarding.

I will say though, one of our greatest success stories is a gentleman that converted, got both of his parents to convert, and was recently ordained to the Holy Priesthood.

 

[Publisher]

I think “converts” to any faith tradition tend to be better members. I have found among Friends that the “birthright” members take Quakerism for granted…“birthright” Friends tend to miss meeting more often…“birthright Friends” usually want to be in leadership…but they don’t really want to do the work it sometimes takes to be a good leader…resting instead on their laurels and “cashing in” on the fact that their family tree goes back several generations as Friends. I would think the same is true for other faith traditions…I think it even more so now as we have “confirmation” of that perception in this thread.

 

[Joe_5859]

I’m a cradle Catholic and I like to think I know a little bit about my faith.

Of course, as with any generalization, there are exceptions: I know many knowledgeable cradle Catholics, and I also know some who “converted” out of convenience (i.e. they were dating a Catholic at the time). But, I think you make a valid point nonetheless.

It makes sense if you think about it. Converts are forced to confront and learn the teachings of the Church as adults. They are converting because, as an adult, they have reason to. For those who grow up with the faith, being Catholic can become simply a cultural thing or else something they do out of habit without ever pausing to consider what the Church teaches and why.

It is also true that any adult cradle Catholic you encounter was (more likely than not) the recipient of some pretty sub-par catechesis as a child. Many times, they may even have been taught precisely the opposite of what the true Church teaching is. In other cases, they were taught that it doesn’t really matter if you agree with the Church or not. Many of our catechetical leaders have no qualms about telling someone that they can feel free to disagree with Church teaching so long as their conscience tells them it’s okay.

I do think the tide is turning, though, so I have hope for future generations of cradle Catholics.

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

There’s definitely an enthusiasm present in converts. They’ve made a decision to join the Church rather than simply being part of it because their parents were.

On the other hand, they don’t have the day-to-day lived experience of cradle Catholics. There’s something to be said for someone whose faith has carried them through the hard times, who has hung in there despite doubts and scandals and whatever difficulties have arisen.

 

[Joe_5859]

I think “converts” to any faith tradition tend to be better members. I have found among Friends that the “birthright” members take Quakerism for granted…“birthright” Friends tend to miss meeting more often…“birthright Friends” usually want to be in leadership…but they don’t really want to do the work it sometimes takes to be a good leader…resting instead on their laurels and “cashing in” on the fact that their family tree goes back several generations as Friends. I would think the same is true for other faith traditions…I think it even more so now as we have “confirmation” of that perception in this thread.

That’s a good point. It’s not unique to Catholicism. Converts usually have more zeal because, at some point in their life, they came to a realization or a belief that turned their life in a completely new direction. Thus, oftentimes, ex-Catholic Christians will be the most virulently anti-Catholic. Ex-Christian atheists will be the most virulently anti-Christian. Ex-pro-aborts will be the most tireless pro-life workers. And so on.

For those who grow up with a certain belief set and never feel compelled to change, it is easier to be lazy and take it for granted.

 

[rep140]

Our parish program always has some “cradle” Catholics coming through for a refresher type course. We often get feedback telling us how much they learned, or how much they had forgotten and came back to them through the classes. It is truly rewarding.

We have had the same in our RCIA classes as well as cradle Catholics coming with friends/relatives/spouses in the program. Their feeling is the same as above.

I love an earlier comment about making up things to tell the priest. I went to parochial school in the late 50’s. We were marched to confession before 1st Friday and I always figured that I should have at least a half dozen things to tell the priest. Many talk about bad catechesis in the 70’s and on. Believe me, the 50’s and 60’s weren’t so hot either.

 

[twopekinguys]

There are great “cradle Catholics”, great great ones.

I still believe there is something going on in our teachings to the youth. I myself experienced it. Don’t know what it is. Perhaps it’s Satan paying attention and tempting more? I don’t know.

If you guys ever come up with a great plan to teach our youth, my sons included to some extent, better than how we do it now, I am down for it.

I was amazed how little my own sons knew. I have taught them all about Catholicism since they were born. The other day I was shocked to hear them both fumble on the question of who visited Jesus on the night of his birth. The WISE MEN!

facepalm

And I have taught them all about it…don’t know if they just think it’s to boring or what.

Does your parish have a Youth Group?

If it does, I have to say that the leadership of the group is critical.

Our parish had a similar problem several years ago. It was like we were losing teens right and left, and we were going through directors right and left.

We finally got a new Youth Group Director (recently ordained Deacon), and the results have been amazing.

They have become so involved in the parish, becoming Lectors, Cantors, Choir members.

All of their group meetings involve Bible study and prayer. It isn’t just a social time for them.

They do a mission trip to our sister parish on the Lakota Indian Reservation in South Dakota, every year.

Our sister parish is very impoverished. Our youth do things like teaching Bible study classes, simple repairs,painting, mowing and maintaining the cemeteries, and alot of fellowship.

Our youth are also becoming more involved in our local community as well, volunteering in many different ways. Simply put, living their faith.

For alot of our youth, their peers think it is “uncool” (I think I just showed my age) to be a Christian, let alone a Catholic Christian, and that adds to the difficulties sometimes.

Our diocese has started a Youth March, where they gather in our downtown area for talks, prayer, and fellowship, then march to our Cathedral, carrying banners, saying the rosary, etc. Once they arrive at the Cathedral, they are greeted by the Bishop, who celebrates Mass with the youth.

It helps reinforce that it is OK to be a Catholic Christian and be young.

Maybe these are a couple of things that could be explored in your parish/diocese.

 

[kimmielittle]

Does your parish have a Youth Group?

If it does, I have to say that the leadership of the group is critical.

Our parish had a similar problem several years ago. It was like we were losing teens right and left, and we were going through directors right and left.

We finally got a new Youth Group Director (recently ordained Deacon), and the results have been amazing.

They have become so involved in the parish, becoming Lectors, Cantors, Choir members.

All of their group meetings involve Bible study and prayer. It isn’t just a social time for them.

They do a mission trip to our sister parish on the Lakota Indian Reservation in South Dakota, every year.

Our sister parish is very impoverished. Our youth do things like teaching Bible study classes, simple repairs,painting, mowing and maintaining the cemeteries, and alot of fellowship.

Our youth are also becoming more involved in our local community as well, volunteering in many different ways. Simply put, living their faith.

For alot of our youth, their peers think it is “uncool” (I think I just showed my age) to be a Christian, let alone a Catholic Christian, and that adds to the difficulties sometimes.

Our diocese has started a Youth March, where they gather in our downtown area for talks, prayer, and fellowship, then march to our Cathedral, carrying banners, saying the rosary, etc. Once they arrive at the Cathedral, they are greeted by the Bishop, who celebrates Mass with the youth.

It helps reinforce that it is OK to be a Catholic Christian and be young.

Maybe these are a couple of things that could be explored in your parish/diocese.

:clapping::clapping:

IMHO Grwnups can’t complain… if they don’t help pass the torch.

 

[JRKH]

As individuals no one can say. One individual is just as uniques as the next.
Also, each person grows closer to God at their own pace.
It also depends on why one converts. If it is simply because your fiance is catholic - welllll

As a class I would say that converts are probably the better catachized somply because they had to study and choose to become catholc. I also think they bring a lot to the process of evangelization and apologetics.

Spiritually - I think it depends a lot more on the individual.

Peace
James

 

[rinnie]

I tend to disagree. I have learned more from CC then converts. I have been a CC all of my life. While I agree converts tend to study more intense at times, and CC don’t its because we never have questioned our faith.

Growing up if the the RCC says it, its true. I never had a need to question or doubt it. Why? Because it never lied to me. Everything I was ever told was true.

Now I will say that the one thing that I did have trouble in was WHERE IS THAT IN THE BIBLE! See as a RR we never used the bible only as a big teaching tool. I went to a Catholic School it was SS and Tradtition Together. It was never, it has to be in the bible.

I think that converts research things more because they feel the need it. I never did. In my family and church there was one truth. So there was never anything to question. It wasn’t until I came to this site that I saw how many people questioned the Church’s teaching. I guess I kinda lived in a bubble. I mean everyone in my family was Catholic generations and generations. Friends etc. And the ones that were not we never discussed our differences, really still don’t.

In our house the Pope is the teacher and you do not disobey him. And I never will. Its kinda like if the pope says jump, im jumping

I believe that God left him in charge, If I did not I would not be Catholic. And look at the teachings he has taught us through the years. He was right too. People fight to abort their babys. How many really can/t say I wish I would have listened to the Pope and trusted God. God would have found a way.

So I believe we may have taken for granted our faith. But I believe when you are a Cradle Catholic you have be given such a gift from birth:shrug: ANd it is a kind of contentment and type of security you will have forever. And when you are a true Cradle C. You never ever doubt the teachings of your church.

 

[rinnie]

There’s definitely an enthusiasm present in converts. They’ve made a decision to join the Church rather than simply being part of it because their parents were.

On the other hand, they don’t have the day-to-day lived experience of cradle Catholics. There’s something to be said for someone whose faith has carried them through the hard times, who has hung in there despite doubts and scandals and whatever difficulties have arisen.

Amen. This is also what I wanted to say! No convert will ever have that catholic from birth experience. Its like we never had that void because it was filled from the start with Jesus Christ. I started learning about Jesus about the 2nd day out of my Mom womb. She took me to church every Sunday from day one. I was learning about Gods love for us and protection before I even could talk.

Its like being rich all your life and getting a new car every year on your birthday. You are happy but you are used to it.

But being poor and never having one, its like look I got a new car. To a rich person it would be like Yeah!

 

[ralphinal]

I think that the question has a flaw in it. The real problem is not that converts make better Catholics, it is that some Cradle Catholics are very poor examples of the Faith. The bar is not too high, and many converts fly over it.

 

[Alexandra]

I’m a cradle Catholic who came from a culturally Catholic family. We never went to church until they decided it was time for first communion (when I was 11!) I don’t remember any of the teaching. In fact, as an adult I was, despite having recited the Apostle’s Creed, surprised to learn that Jesus was coming back. I left the church, and now am thinking of coming back and reading everything I can about the church and what it believes. I went through Catechism class in the 60s. My only memories of those classes have only to do with non church things that we discussed. So certainly someone learning about the church as an adult will be more grounded than those of us with a less than stellar background.

 

[adelore]

Are Coverts the Best Catholics? Maybe, maybe not. It just depends on each person.

Do each, Conversts or Cradle Catholcs each have something to offer the other. Very much so.

The Cradle Catholic who like myself left the chruch to Wander and search other Religions, had the advantange of the Truth, being so deeply planted in me from birth, that like the Prodigal Son, The Truth of the Catholic Church Brought me home even though many years had passed.

I never could agree, even though I was attending “Prodesent Churchs, different ones, even for years” I just couldn’t / wouldn’t give up my Catholic Beliefs, (such as about Mary, Jesus being present for Real in the Communion, Communion of the Saints, the Pope as the leader of the Church, ect.) However; the learning experience I had in attending the different Prodesent churchs over the years, did many things for me, but most of all it brought me home to the Catholic Church. I met several wonderful Christians in these Prodesents Churchs who have a love for Jesus that is very strong. Yet, I missed the Mass Deeply.

Now as a Cradle Catholic, now back home to the Catholic Church, my understanding of a lot of the things the Pope says, now and Popes before him, truely make tons of sense and many other things as well, that just maybe as a Cradle Catholic I took for granted.

A Convert to the Faith is so wonderful to see. I love their excitment. For when I see a convert to our faith I can truely relate. They are excited because to them, they “see” things they never could see before. The Truth of All our beliefs gives them a sense of Freedom. And the best part to them, is the Mass and the Real Presence of Jesus there with us.

Both “types” of Catholics have tons to offer. The Cradle Catholic who never left home, is what gives us our solid foundation, to come home with open arms. They are there like the father of the Prodical son who returned. There are there to help the convert with their new found faith and truths.

It’s not really that the Craddle Catholic or the Convert, or even the Revert, is the Best Catholic. It’s the fact that all of us together as a whole, stand firm, stand strong, and we are who make up the Catholic Church. When one of us is down or weak, where are there to pull each other up again. When some of us have wandered and come home, open arms are there waiting for us, When a new Convert comes into the Church, we celebrate because truely a New Catholic has been born. So each type of Catholic, no matter how or when you came into the Catholic Church, truely is the best type Catholic. Many of us have short commings and are less than perfect, so we have confession.

Ok that’s my two cents.

 

[rinnie]

I’m a cradle Catholic who came from a culturally Catholic family. We never went to church until they decided it was time for first communion (when I was 11!) I don’t remember any of the teaching. In fact, as an adult I was, despite having recited the Apostle’s Creed, surprised to learn that Jesus was coming back. I left the church, and now am thinking of coming back and reading everything I can about the church and what it believes. I went through Catechism class in the 60s. My only memories of those classes have only to do with non church things that we discussed. So certainly someone learning about the church as an adult will be more grounded than those of us with a less than stellar background.

See alexandra you just hit on a important point, some people take their kids for ccd etc the sacraments and thats it. Learning the Catholic Faith is a on going process. UNTIL YOU DIE! You cannot just learn the basis in a 1 hour a week basic religion class. You must go every single sunday, pay attention in church, read the bible. Heck you can read the bible every sunday in the RCC. Its called a missilette. (sorry know I spelled it wrong).

There is so so much to learn. But bible study is every single sunday in Mass. Think about it, the Priest reads the gospel, then explains it, Every single sunday. People just do not pay attention.