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holdencaulfield
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That’s a beautiful picture of the Sacred Heart. Does anyone know exactly when and where it originated? I mean the Sacred Heart. I understand the significance just not where it came from.
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Brennan_Doherty
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I don’t know that there is a dogmatic statement on whether the damned can ever leave Hell. Certainly I think exorcists think it is possible for someone to be inhabited by one of the souls of the damned, such as Judas. Apparently in the actual case that the “Exorcism of Emily Rose” film was based on, she was allegedly possessed by Judas as well as some demons.I’d agree that demons appear as ghosts, to make people doubt Catholicism’s explanation of the after life.
Isn’t it a dogma that a damned is static in hell and can’t get out ever? I’m not sure but if you can quote a dogmatic sentence in this matter it’d be helpful.
I’m also reminded of a story where Padre Pio, after hearing some movement around the altar after hours, saw a monk straightening out the candles on the altar. No one was supposed to be there and when Padre Pio asked him what he was doing there the monk told him that he was a monk in the same monastery from years ago and he was careless with taking care of the altar pieces during Mass so for his purgatorial penance he had to continually make sure the altar pieces were in good order. And when they checked out the name and year of that monk in the records they found out it matched.
There’s also “An Unpublished Manuscript on Purgatory” where supposedly a nun in purgatory was allowed by God to visit a living nun and give her spiritual advice (and, in my estimation, it was good):
my.homewithgod.com/gertrude/purgatory/
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holdencaulfield
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I don’t understand how Judas could leave Hell to possess someone. He is not a demon, he’s a human.I don’t know that there is a dogmatic statement on whether the damned can ever leave Hell. Certainly I think exorcists think it is possible for someone to be inhabited by one of the souls of the damned, such as Judas. Apparently in the actual case that the “Exorcism of Emily Rose” film was based on, she was allegedly possessed by Judas as well as some demons.
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Brennan_Doherty
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I’m not saying that I understand the process exactly either. I am just saying that from what I understand, in some exorcisms one of the entities possessing a person has been a damned soul, or allegedly a damned soul.I don’t understand how Judas could leave Hell to possess someone. He is not a demon, he’s a human.
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holdencaulfield
Guest
Yea maybe, perhaps the demon that possessed Judas?I’m not saying that I understand the process exactly either. I am just saying that from what I understand, in some exorcisms one of the entities possessing a person has been a damned soul, or allegedly a damned soul.
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Brennan_Doherty
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I don’t know. Or maybe it was a demon mimicing Judas. But I don’t think we can say definitively it was not Judas, as I supposed if God can allow a demon to possess a person then why not a damned soul?Yea maybe, perhaps the demon that possessed Judas?
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piouswoman
Guest
It is a Jewish symbol…aren’t we Roman Catholics? Aren’t the Jews Christ deniers?Thank You.
Why would a Roman Catholic care to display a Star of David on their signature?
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holdencaulfield
Guest
Because we know that one can not send messages from Hell. Wouldn’t the rich man have done that then from the Parable of Lazarus? We know that people in Heaven can send messages with God’s will. However do we have any real proof that one can from Hell. We know that angels and demons can leave Heaven or Hell. However I can only think of people from Heaven communing with people on Earth.I don’t know. Or maybe it was a demon mimicing Judas. But I don’t think we can say definitively it was not Judas, as I supposed if God can allow a demon to possess a person then why not a damned soul?
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Brennan_Doherty
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Well, we know people can’t just send messages from Hell because they want to. But we can’t preclude God from allowing a possession to take place involving a damned soul as well as a demon. I don’t think we can definitively rule it out, even if we can’t prove such has taken place.Because we know that one can not send messages from Hell. Wouldn’t the rich man have done that then from the Parable of Lazarus? We know that people in Heaven can send messages with God’s will. However do we have any real proof that one can from Hell. We know that angels and demons can leave Heaven or Hell. However I can only think of people from Heaven communing with people on Earth.
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holdencaulfield
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Yea I guess you are right, we can’t prove or disprove it.Well, we know people can’t just send messages from Hell because they want to. But we can’t preclude God from allowing a possession to take place involving a damned soul as well as a demon. I don’t think we can definitively rule it out, even if we can’t prove such has taken place.
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7rosario
Guest
If Judas went out of hell to possess someone, wouldn’t that give him a break from hell? But we know for a fact that hell has no breaks.I don’t know. Or maybe it was a demon mimicing Judas. But I don’t think we can say definitively it was not Judas, as I supposed if God can allow a demon to possess a person then why not a damned soul?
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7rosario
Guest
I don’t know where and when the Sorrowful and Immaculate Heart of Mary was drawn.That’s a beautiful picture of the Sacred Heart. Does anyone know exactly when and where it originated? I mean the Sacred Heart. I understand the significance just not where it came from.
As for the Sacred Heart of JESUS, read the book on the subject which was commanded to be written, by Our Lord Himself: books.google.com/books?id=XIcEAAAAQAAJ&pg=PR1&dq=croiset+1863#PPA264,M1
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holdencaulfield
Guest
So who wrote it?I don’t know where and when the Sorrowful and Immaculate Heart of Mary was drawn.
As for the Sacred Heart of JESUS, read the book on the subject which was commanded to be written, by Our Lord Himself: books.google.com/books?id=XIcEAAAAQAAJ&pg=PR1&dq=croiset+1863#PPA264,M1
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7rosario
Guest
Fr. Croiset.So who wrote it?
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Brennan_Doherty
Guest
I don’t think Judas would have a break from an eternal seperation from God even if he did possess someone. And who can say God wouldn’t allow such a thing?If Judas went out of hell to possess someone, wouldn’t that give him a break from hell? But we know for a fact that hell has no breaks.
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Brennan_Doherty
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Well, the rich man did see and talk to Abraham from Hell, so God apparently allowed that.Because we know that one can not send messages from Hell. Wouldn’t the rich man have done that then from the Parable of Lazarus? We know that people in Heaven can send messages with God’s will. However do we have any real proof that one can from Hell. We know that angels and demons can leave Heaven or Hell. However I can only think of people from Heaven communing with people on Earth.
Also, the gulf spoken of was one which would not allow the rich man to cross over to “Abrahams’ bosom” which to me indicates a type of paradise or even heaven and I don’t think any damned soul can cross over to heaven.
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7rosario
Guest
I meant break from hellfire.I don’t think Judas would have a break from an eternal seperation from God even if he did possess someone. And who can say God wouldn’t allow such a thing?
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Brennan_Doherty
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Okay, but is this theoretically impossible? What if God allows it?I meant break from hellfire.
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da_nolo
Guest
then why do we read the OT? its is the then and now…NT fulfils the OT and there for it is reasonably sane and right for a Catholic to have the Star of David as he/she so chooses.It is a Jewish symbol…aren’t we Roman Catholics? Aren’t the Jews Christ deniers?
Why would a Roman Catholic care to display a Star of David on their signature?
Havent we been oover this already?
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da_nolo
Guest
People are possessed and are able to be possessed if the person deals with or in some type of dark act. Now to think about it in a bit of a different way from hell being a place…one must realize hell is not truly a place. Nor is Heaven, but it shall be a new Isreal on Earth…but lets stay on topic. We serve our lives to know Him, serve Him, and love Him…that is our Catholic calling…our calling from God…reason we are alive. And in doing good acts according to the Ten Commandments, and 7 virtues. By doing this we become closer to God. Heaven is the presence of God and we work towards that presence. Therefore Hell is, and as it has been stated, the absence of the Love, Grace, and presence of God. It is not a place to which God can not reach nor a place for all evil, but simply is evil. If we commit any crimes against ourselves and against the Lord, then we are seperating ourselves from Him. And so if we are in absence of god in our lives and the good acts, we become closer to hell. Closer to evil. And it has been noticed that most people possessed dealt with some evil act. So if hell is not a place and we move closer to it instead of God, would that not allow us to becoming dark and empty…similar to if not being hell.
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