Are Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, Seventh Day Adventists, Christian Science actually Christian?

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My personal viewpoint is I don’t deny the salvation or Christianity of other people who call themselves Christian. Their salvation is between them and God. I’ve been told that when I was a Mormon I wasn’t Christian (which came as a great shock to me) and now I get told by my protestant boss and his wife that Catholics aren’t ‘saved’. Having been on the receiving end of someone else denying that I’m a Christian, I make it a point not to do that to someone else.
 
BartholomewB said:
When you say “fourth” I suppose you are including Muslims as the third. But I think that is a mistaken use of the word. Historically, the Christian Church came into being as a splinter group within Judaism. That is why the term “Abrahamic” can meaningfully cover both Judaism and Christianity. But the origin of Islam, historically, is totally independent. It is not “Abrahamic” in any meaningful sense of the term. As applied to Islam, it’s really no more than a courtesy title.
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That’s not the case. Abraham is the father of three faiths- Judaism and subsequently Christianity (through Isaac) and Islam (through Ishmael). God promised to make a great nation out of Ishmael as well, and He kept that promise.
 
AKDee said:
That’s not the case. Abraham is the father of three faiths- Judaism and subsequently Christianity (through Isaac) and Islam (through Ishmael). God promised to make a great nation out of Ishmael as well, and He kept that promise.
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Yes.
 
pianistclare said:
Anyone can CALL themselves a Christian.
Della has given great answers.
here is a list of faiths and which have valid Baptisms according to the Catholic Church.
Being that this is a Catholic site, I am guessing that the OP asked in this context.

archbalt.org/evangelization/worship/rcia/upload/Validity-of-Baptisms-and-Confirmation.pdf
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Likewise anyone can claim another person is not Christian. They can setup their own standards and insist they are right. In my experience this has to do with exclusion and labels.
 
Janderich said:
Likewise anyone can claim another person is not Christian. They can setup their own standards and insist they are right. In my experience this has to do with exclusion and labels.
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So what was the point of John the Baptist then?
 
pianistclare said:
Anyone can CALL themselves a Christian.
Della has given great answers.
here is a list of faiths and which have valid Baptisms according to the Catholic Church.
Being that this is a Catholic site, I am guessing that the OP asked in this context.

archbalt.org/evangelization/worship/rcia/upload/Validity-of-Baptisms-and-Confirmation.pdf
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If you go back to what I said earlier, yes, any one faith CAN define who is a Christian and who is not according to their own criteria. Perfectly reasonable.

And any one faith CAN define themselves according to their own standards. Perfectly reasonable.

Bottom line? It is all up to who’s talking.

On the third point, scholars and observers and sociologists may also have an objective say in how groups are labeled.
 
Not arguing what people think they believe.
It’s a Catholic site. I give Catholic answers based on what the Church teaches.
YMMV

Catholics believe that water and the Trinitarian formula is necessary for a valid Baptism.
 
pianistclare said:
Not arguing what people think they believe.
It’s a Catholic site. I give Catholic answers based on what the Church teaches.
YMMV

Catholics believe that water and the Trinitarian formula is necessary for a valid Baptism.
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You are right; it is a Catholic site, so yes, this is what the RCC teaches.
 
ComplineSanFran said:
Bottom line? It is all up to who’s talking.
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The Christian faith was founded by Jesus Christ and is proclaimed by His Church and its Magisterial authority.

You may disagree with that, and you may even find the idea quaint.

But such is the nature of Christianity; and while you may be more comfortable treating the faith like a simple sociological phenomenon, I’m afraid that an insistence on such a view is quite misguided.
 
InNomineDomini said:
But such is the nature of Christianity; and while you may be more comfortable treating the faith like a simple sociological phenomenon, I’m afraid that an insistence on such a view is quite misguided.
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To a good a faithful Mormon, the idea of someone outside their faith telling them they are not Christian, well, I imagine it would be distressing.

Just as those who are Roman Catholic would be distressed to be called all sorts of horrid names by other Christians.

As for the sociologists, they are left with the task of grouping all sorts of faith communities and sorting out who goes where. Do they put the Orthodox by themselves? What of the Anglicans, who are ‘in the middle’? Or the Christian Scientists? When one is looking at the religious landscape, it is quite complex.
 
As for Mormons, former president Gordon B. Hinckley of the LDS church spoke of those outside the Mormon church who say Latter-day Saints 'do not believe in the traditional Christ:

'No, I don’t. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak."

(See LDS Church News Week ending June 20, 1998, p. 7).

So even a former president of the Mormon church admitted that Mormons do not believe in the same Christ as traditional Christianity and are not “Christian” as Catholics and other traditional Christians use the term.
 
👍

Any Church that claims that Christ could have sinned and lost His Salvation and subsequently been eternally annihilated by “God”…
…Has departed so far away from the Scriptures and Creed ( which systematizes Scripture ).
…I would say those folks may be well intentioned and God loves them just as much as anyone else - but they are not Trinitarian Christians.
Reepicheep said:
Affirm the Creed and be validly baptized as a follower of Christ. Absent a better definition by an expert, I’d go with this.
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jas84173 said:
I have heard views from both sides, that they either are or are not. Now I ask this because ironically, some Protestant Christians claim that Catholics are not really Christian. However, the notion that just because someone believes in Jesus does not make someone a Christian. I say this because even in Islam, Jesus is regarded as a major prophet. Do these groups meet the definition of Christianity or do their beliefs make it so they actually are not Christians? I know all of these groups self identify as Christian, but does someone actually have to believe in the trinity to be a Christian? Or does that alone make someone not? I just wanted opinions on this. I know people who are Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses and they adamantly claim that they are in fact “true” Christians.
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For what humans call “Christian” is a matter of definitions and people’s do vary. I personally consider a “Christian” as someone who views Christ as their Savior and try to follow His teaches (whether or not they actually go to Heaven). Others rely on creeds for their definitions, or as someone who’s “been saved”, or many other things.

For what God calls “Christian”, that is for Him to assess in His perfect knowledge, and not me.
 
jane_doe said:
For what humans call “Christian” is a matter of definitions and people’s do vary. I personally consider a “Christian” as someone who views Christ as their Savior and try to follow His teaches (whether or not they actually go to Heaven). Others rely on creeds for their definitions, or as someone who’s “been saved”, or many other things.

For what God calls “Christian”, that is for Him to assess in His perfect knowledge, and not me.
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I mean no offense when I say this jane_doe - under your qualifier or definition…
… Members of "The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster " ‘could be’ Christians.
…After all - despite what they say publically - they might be God’s definition of Christian?

Come on now.

venganza.org/
 
ComplineSanFran said:
To a good a faithful Mormon, the idea of someone outside their faith telling them they are not Christian, well, I imagine it would be distressing.

Just as those who are Roman Catholic would be distressed to be called all sorts of horrid names by other Christians.
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When I was Mormon, I wasn’t bothered when people (usually Evangelical Christians) said that Mormons are not Christian. I understood at a superficial level that we had vastly different beliefs on the nature of God so it didn’t bother me in the least. To me, it was an acknowledgement that Mormonism and Christianity are not the same religion and do not follow the same Jesus Christ as stated by President Gordon Hinckley, former president of the LDS church (see ForrestDupre’s post above). Of course, I thought of myself as the “real” Christian who believed in the “real” Jesus Christ. Now I know that I was terribly wrong.

As a Catholic, I don’t get terribly distressed about negative things said about Catholics or the Catholic Church. I see it as an indication of that person’s ignorance. I am much more concerned about Christians being murdered, raped and sold into slavery.
 
" jane_doe:
For what humans call “Christian” is a matter of definitions and people’s do vary. I personally consider a “Christian” as someone who views Christ as their Savior and try to follow His teaches (whether or not they actually go to Heaven). Others rely on creeds for their definitions, or as someone who’s “been saved”, or many other things.

For what God calls “Christian”, that is for Him to assess in His perfect knowledge, and not me.
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Pythons said:
I mean no offense when I say this jane_doe - under your qualifier or definition…
… Members of "The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster " ‘could be’ Christians.
…After all - despite what they say publically - they might be God’s definition of Christian?

Come on now.

venganza.org/
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Let’s take the hypothetical member of "The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster " (henceforth FSM). If that person (under their definition) call themselves a Christian—

A) That does not mean God automatically recognizes them as His true followers (that’s for Him to judge, not man).

B) Are they Christian in my definition? If said person recognizes Christ as a Savior and try to follow Him (my definition) then yes they pass my definition. This doesn’t mean I don’t think they’re “weird”, or I agree remotely with their doctrine, or that I think they’re on the right path, or that I won’t try to share a better way with them if given the chance. (I also do the same with some Catholics, Baptists, non-denims, JW’s, and Mormons)

C) If “The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster” member does not recognize Christ as a their Savior (fails my definition) and still wants to be called a Christian. Well I can’t really stop them from calling themselves a “Christian”, can I? So the fact that I don’t like what they do is irrelevant.
 
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