Are Orthodox Heretics?

[JohnVIII]

It seems to me that this thread is unable to come to a consensus concerning the Roman Catholic position on the Orthodox. How long do you think a thread in an Orthodox form would go on the question of whether Rome is in the Church? Probably a lot shorter! And the amazing thing is, the Orthodox don’t even have the help of “infallibility” to come to a consensus concerning this issue. In accordance with orthodox-tradition there is one and only one reason that schism can be justified, that is of course “heresy”. I do not know for sure whether the Roman Catholic Church has the same tradition, but if the separation between Roman Catholic and Orthodox is rooted in issues other than heresy, the fact is, the schism that exists is even worse than heresy.

I united with the Roman Catholic Church for a period of about one month. I was briefly convinced that the issue of the filioque was as the Roman Catholic Church today teaches that it is; and so I wasted no time in erasing the schism between myself and the See of Rome. In a very short time thereafter I became convinced that I had been very sorely mistaken; and as such I wasted no time repenting. I would humbly ask to be allowed to be in union with Rome once again if it were possible for me to believe that Rome holds the same faith as St. Peter.

I hope this contributes to this thread without offending anyone. If anyone is offended perhaps will help if I tell you that I don’t mind if I am called a heretic. If you do, one of two things must be true: One, you are speaking the truth and no one should be offended by someone who speaks the truth. Or Two, it is an orthodox-tradition that it is to be considered a great honor if someone who isn’t themselves orthodox condemnes you of heresy!

I trully hope that in the end we will all be saved by the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ!

 

[Peter_J]

I’m sure the fact that he didn’t call them heretics when he called them lost will be a comfort.

(You know, because in A Man For All Seasons, More was asked “Can’t you do what I did, and come with us, for fellowship?”, to which he wittily replied “And when we stand before God, and you are sent to Paradise for doing according to your conscience, and I am damned for not doing according to mine, will you come with me, for fellowship?”)

 

[SedesDomi]

(You know, because in A Man For All Seasons, More was asked “Can’t you do what I did, and come with us, for fellowship?”, to which he wittily replied “And when we stand before God, and you are sent to Paradise for doing according to your conscience, and I am damned for not doing according to mine, will you come with me, for fellowship?”)

Ah, there’s that pesky “conscience” popping up again.

 

[Volodymyr]

They, therefore, walk in the path of dangerous error who believe that they can accept Christ as the Head of the Church, while not adhering loyally to His Vicar on earth. They have taken away the visible head, broken the visible bonds of unity and left the Mystical Body of the Redeemer so obscured and so maimed, that those who are seeking the haven of eternal salvation can neither see it nor find it.

I have never seen before such a statement. But when I read this I think perhaps there will be long time before Orthodox and Catolic believers are in union and communion. Do you Catolic believers really believe that those who are Orthodox and receive Sacraments, life of a life of prayer, devoted to Jesus Christ in hope of union with Holy Trinity in kingdom of Heaven - can neither seen nor find it because they are not “subject” to the Bishop of Rome. This idea that being “subject” perhaps English means different, but this is a political, demeaning term I believe to Pope is important to salvation seems to me to a wrong emphasis even for Catolics. If you believe your church is True church and source of salvation - fine, but not because you are “subjects” of Pope.

 

[ralphinal]

Non Serviam;4886804:

They, therefore, walk in the path of dangerous error who believe that they can accept Christ as the Head of the Church, while not adhering loyally to His Vicar on earth. They have taken away the visible head, broken the visible bonds of unity and left the Mystical Body of the Redeemer so obscured and so maimed, that those who are seeking the haven of eternal salvation can neither see it nor find it.

I have never seen before such a statement. But when I read this I think perhaps there will be long time before Orthodox and Catolic believers are in union and communion. Do you Catolic believers really believe that those who are Orthodox and receive Sacraments, life of a life of prayer, devoted to Jesus Christ in hope of union with Holy Trinity in kingdom of Heaven - can neither seen nor find it because they are not “subject” to the Bishop of Rome. This idea that being “subject” perhaps English means different, but this is a political, demeaning term I believe to Pope is important to salvation seems to me to a wrong emphasis even for Catolics. If you believe your church is True church and source of salvation - fine, but not because you are “subjects” of Pope.

Earlier in this thread, it was pointed out that this statement WAS political in nature, targeting a particular ruler. Catholics would understand this to mean spiritually under the guide of the pope, not physically.

 

[Hesychios]

I like the Sound of Music

http://www.channel4.com/film/media/images/Channel4/film/S/sound_of_music_xl_03--film-B.jpg

 

[mardukm]

Dear brother Volodomyr,

Non Serviam;4886804:

They, therefore, walk in the path of dangerous error who believe that they can accept Christ as the Head of the Church, while not adhering loyally to His Vicar on earth. They have taken away the visible head, broken the visible bonds of unity and left the Mystical Body of the Redeemer so obscured and so maimed, that those who are seeking the haven of eternal salvation can neither see it nor find it.

I have never seen before such a statement. But when I read this I think perhaps there will be long time before Orthodox and Catolic believers are in union and communion. Do you Catolic believers really believe that those who are Orthodox and receive Sacraments, life of a life of prayer, devoted to Jesus Christ in hope of union with Holy Trinity in kingdom of Heaven - can neither seen nor find it because they are not “subject” to the Bishop of Rome. This idea that being “subject” perhaps English means different, but this is a political, demeaning term I believe to Pope is important to salvation seems to me to a wrong emphasis even for Catolics. If you believe your church is True church and source of salvation - fine, but not because you are “subjects” of Pope.

I’ve never viewed the statement you quoted to mean submission to the person of the Pope, but rather adherence to the Truth he represents.

I have myself also wondered how EO can call Catholics heretics, since no teaching of the Catholic Church has been condemned by an Ecumenical Council.

Blessings,
Marduk