Are some Catholics guilty of the same thing they accuse Protestants of doing?

[SyCarl]

Non-Catholic are often accused of attacking Catholicism without knowing what it truly beleives. I think that many Catholics do the same things, attacking what they think the Protestant view is. They end up critcizing a caricature of what Protestantism is.

For example, with respect to the Bible alone, they often seem to view it as requiring that a person actually has to read the Bible to be saved rather than the Bible being the sole infallible rule of faith. They also seem to think it means there is no role for tradition or Church teaching.

Similarly with faith alone, it is often stated that Protestants believe that if you have faith you can do whatever you want without consequence and that there is no place for good works, whereas the truth is that Protestants emphasis that faith requires and results in good works but that the works do nothing to merit salavation.

Similarly with Mary we are asked why we hate her or don’t love her. Protestants do love Mary but they do so without the same titles or methods of veneration that Catholics do.

Even when you try to clarify the actual belief you hold, some people will not abandon their misunderstanding or misrepresentation.

I think it would be best if people on both sides were to accept how members of a denomination define their beliefs rather than trying to do it for them.

 

[ibkc]

I think you’ve got a point, but I also think you need to cut the Catholics some slack. There is no one single Protestant belief system, and sorting through all the endless variations can get really confusing. On the other hand, all a Protestant has to do to find out what the Catholic Church teaches is look at the Catechism, which is conveniently online, and too many Protestants don’t even try to go to that authoritative source.

ETA: I will not vote because your options are far too generalized.

 

[Claire_from_DE]

Non-Catholic are often accused of attacking Catholicism without knowing what it truly beleives. I think that many Catholics do the same things, attacking what they think the Protestant view is. They end up critcizing a caricature of what Protestantism is.

For example, with respect to the Bible alone, they often seem to view it as requiring that a person actually has to read the Bible to be saved rather than the Bible being the sole infallible rule of faith. They also seem to think it means there is no role for tradition or Church teaching.

Similarly with faith alone, it is often stated that Protestants believe that if you have faith you can do whatever you want without consequence and that there is no place for good works, whereas the truth is that Protestants emphasis that faith requires and results in good works but that the works do nothing to merit salavation.

Similarly with Mary we are asked why we hate her or don’t love her. Protestants do love Mary but they do so without the same titles or methods of veneration that Catholics do.

Even when you try to clarify the actual belief you hold, some people will not abandon their misunderstanding or misrepresentation.

I think it would be best if people on both sides were to accept how members of a denomination define their beliefs rather than trying to do it for them.

I agree with your last statement. I get my information about what a denomination believes from what friends in the denomination tell me about what their church teaches and from what I hear preachers from that denomination preach on christian radio or tv.

About the bible alone being the sole rule of faith. It seems that many bible-only protestants who criticize the catholic church’s for holding to scripture and tradition, are completely unaware that they are greatly influenced by the tradition of their own denomination, they don’t recognize that they have a tradition and that it impacts on their beliefs.

I couldn’t respond to the part of the poll that asks if catholics know protestant beliefs. I know quite a lot about a few denominations but there are many I don’t.

 

[reteeks21]

I think you’ve got a point, but I also think you need to cut the Catholics some slack. There is no one single Protestant belief system, and sorting through all the endless variations can get really confusing. On the other hand, all a Protestant has to do to find out what the Catholic Church teaches is look at the Catechism, which is conveniently online, and too many Protestants don’t even try to go to that authoritative source.

ETA: I will not vote because your options are far too generalized.

I understand what you mean by saying that Protestants have more than one belief system, but in reality that is not exactly true. Most Protestants agree on the same fundamentals, but we differ on how those things are lived out. We may have those different ways of living because we do not always choose to walk lock-step with one leader, which can sometimes be a criticism of the Catholic Church.

I am not hater of Catholics by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, I genuinely love the tradition and liturgy associated with the Church. It might be helpful, though, to ecumenism if Protestants and Catholics would stop pigeon-holing each other. Just a thought.

 

[lizaanne]

I don’t need to know every single nuanced difference about all the tens of thousands of protestant sects to know that they are wrong. There are Catholics who know that Christ established ONE Church, not tens of thousands of “churches” - and that the Catholic Church IS that Church. For those of us who believe this, I don’t see why it is necessary to understand the vast array of differences to know what is right and what is wrong, when we already posses that Truth. Now, if I’m conversing with an individual person I may ask them what they believe and why, but from a broader aspect, I don’t feel that it is beholden upon every Catholic to study zillions of sects to understand them just so they can say they know what they believe. That’s ridiculous. And, because there are SO many different flavors of protestantism, how in the world would you ever know if you were ever done finding and studying different beliefs?

So - I was not able to vote, because I don’t feel that any of the options are relevant choices for me.

~Liza

 

[Publisher]

I think many of us are guilty of “speaking past one another” and not exercising the patience to listen to one another.

Catholics come and start from a different place in their belief system. They begin with the church as their authority. They begin with the belief that Jesus established an organization as his church. They begin with the belief that Peter and the apostles passed on their “authority” to priests and bishops and any who do not come from those lines of succession have no authority.

Protestants see the church in a different way…they do not begin with an organizational structure. The concept of “church” is not the same, so when a Protestant speaks about the church, while some of the concepts do carry over, the understanding is not as…“refined” as it is with Catholicism. In some ways, Protestants tend to view the church in more Eastern Orthodox views, not exact, but the church is the gathered group of baptized believers. When a Catholic begins speaking of “30,000” different churches, most Protestants…thing “Huh??? There is only one church made of those whom Christ has redeemed.”

Most Protestants don’t have an issue with “communion” in other traditions…it is Christ who makes us one by his death and resurrection…not the organization the Church uses to further the message of hope and reconcilliation with God…

Protestants have a difficult time grasping some of the concepts of veneration of the saints and seeking their intercession because those concepts and beliefs are of secondary importance to life in Christ…

Patience on both sides needs to be exercised. Not all of us are ignorant of early church history, we see and interpret it through a differnt lens.

We may be “separated brethren” in Catholic eyes, but many, if not most, of us still see us as “brethren” together in Christ…he is the source of unity, not fine points of doctrine or church government, but we are one in him for only one reason, he has redeemed us.

Now, while as a Friend, I do not embrace the “outward forms” of Christian initiation as most Christians view them, but I understand the concept of “baptism”…and it is “baptism” which makes us part of the mystical Body of Christ…and if being as “one” has any value, then that is the place where being “one” makes all the difference in the world…we have received redemption and been incorporated into his mystical Body…he is the One who makes us “one”…one in him…we are receivers of his grace…and this grace has One Source, and Catholics and Protestants and Orthodox all go to the One Source to receive grace.

 

[Contarini]

I think you’ve got a point, but I also think you need to cut the Catholics some slack. There is no one single Protestant belief system, and sorting through all the endless variations can get really confusing. On the other hand, all a Protestant has to do to find out what the Catholic Church teaches is look at the Catechism, which is conveniently online, and too many Protestants don’t even try to go to that authoritative source.

But it is only some Catholics who define Catholicism primarily in terms of the Catechism. Not to mention that the Catechism is nearly as big, and at least one tenth as complex and difficult, as the Bible.

Edwin

 

[ibkc]

But it is only some Catholics who define Catholicism primarily in terms of the Catechism.

It’s the final word, though. It’s the official position of the church itself.

Not to mention that the Catechism is nearly as big, and at least one tenth as complex and difficult, as the Bible.

The online versions are easily navigable.

 

[qui_est_ce]

From being on the forum, it is impossible to know what the many denominations believe, views on Baptism vary: Baptism of Repentence, Baptism wipes away sin, necessity of Baptism, infant Baptism, Baptism by immersion only, etc., Some believe in OSAS, some in predestination, some in the Real Presence, some symbolic, some believe believe in grape juice, not wine. Some in Sola Fides, some not. Some take the Bible literally, some not.

As for Protestants not understanding Catholics, I have seen some here that really do understand the teachings of the Church. Some disagree with her teachings, some embrace them, but are not Catholics because they seem unable to make that final leap of Culture.

I have also seen Protestants, Atheists, Agnostics come here, a Catholic forum, to attack the CC and misrepresent what she teaches. At first it is out of ignorance, but then an unwillingness to learn. They refuse to read the posts, and just sling more attacks when the can’t answer the post.

This is a Catholic Forum. Catholics are here to DEFEND their faith, not to be led away from it.

 

[Contarini]

It’s the final word, though. It’s the official position of the church itself.

But that assumes that your definition of the “Church” is true rather than that of Richard McBrien or Joan Chittister, etc. Why should a non-Catholic accept your definition, or even that of Pope Benedict (which may not be quite the same as yours, though no doubt you think it is), as the one and only true Catholic view, when obviously there are visible members of the Catholic Church who speak otherwise?

The online versions are easily navigable.

That isn’t the point. The Bible is easily navigable online too. But it’s still very complex.

Edwin

 

[ibkc]

But that assumes that your definition of the “Church” is true rather than that of Richard McBrien or Joan Chittister, etc. Why should a non-Catholic accept your definition, or even that of Pope Benedict (which may not be quite the same as yours, though no doubt you think it is), as the one and only true Catholic view, when obviously there are visible members of the Catholic Church who speak otherwise?

I have no idea why you are taking a snotty tone with me and assuming what I do or do not believe. The fact remains that while the opinions of individuals are certainly interesting, the last word is that of the Magisterium. I mean, I can go to Bob Sungenis’ site and have him tell me that the “correct” Catholic position is that the universe revolves around the Earth. I appreciate his opinion, especially as high comedy, but unfortunately for Bob, it doesn’t represent 21st century Church teaching.

That isn’t the point. The Bible is easily navigable online too. But it’s still very complex.

I am aware that it’s easier to come to a forum like this than to spend a few minutes looking through the Catechism. But, to toss your condescension right back into your face, that isn’t the point. If you want the actual answers and not opinions, you know where to go.

 

[Cat]

Perhaps some Catholics are guilty of misunderstanding of Protestantism, although I find that most Catholics in real life wouldn’t dream of criticizing a Protestant or his/her church. Maybe it happens online because we can be anonymous.

But for all of us who are converts to Catholicism from a Protestant sect–I must say that WE understand our own sect very well! I not only know evangelicalism, I taught it for years and years. I still subscribe to several periodicals and denominational magazines to keep up with my old pals, and most of my family is still evangelical. My husband listens to evangelical radio stations as much as he listens to Catholic radio stations (he always says, “We have to understand what the other side is teaching.”)

We converts are not represented on the poll, so I didn’t answer.