Are some Catholics sometimes vain?

[Woodleigh]

Catholic schools HAVE taught that non-Catholics cannot go to heaven. That is a very serious judgement. If the Cathollic church now recognizes that it was wrong to damn those outside its religion, it has the obligation to apologize for its grave mistake (sin?) and let the world know the Church erred.

One of the members who responded to Pinkyyy’s question made the point that no one has the right to condemn anyone…damn them to hell, in effect. Yet Catholics have been told from the altar that they must confess their sins at least once a year and receive Holy Communion during the Eastertime…under pain of mortal sin. Again, damnation to hell should they die without confessing their sin(s) to a priest.

Logically, we can’t have it both ways. Is it a fact that many Catholics no longer confess their sins to a priest yet receive Communion at Mass on a regular basis? The word “sacrilege” comes to mind.

 

[rinnie]

Catholic schools HAVE taught that non-Catholics cannot go to heaven. That is a very serious judgement. If the Cathollic church now recognizes that it was wrong to damn those outside its religion, it has the obligation to apologize for its grave mistake (sin?) and let the world know the Church erred.

One of the members who responded to Pinkyyy’s question made the point that no one has the right to condemn anyone…damn them to hell, in effect. Yet Catholics have been told from the altar that they must confess their sins at least once a year and receive Holy Communion during the Eastertime…under pain of mortal sin. Again, damnation to hell should they die without confessing their sin(s) to a priest.

Logically, we can’t have it both ways. Is it a fact that many Catholics no longer confess their sins to a priest yet receive Communion at Mass on a regular basis? The word “sacrilege” comes to mind.

Yes this is true if you are in mortal sin you must confess your sins to a priest. And you should go to confession at least once a year. But I dont feel that because we as Catholics are told by our faith to go to confession is saying others are going to hell. I mean Jesus said to Peter I give you the keys, he gave Peter the Power to forgive sins, He said I breath on you the Holy Spirit I will never leave you, So we are confessing to God thru a Priest. That is why they receive Holy ORders. But those are the words Jesus left to the Church, they are the rules we as Catholics must obey. IF Father is up in front of the Church preaching those words, I dont understand whats the problem. they are our faith, we should obey. Father is trying to help us get into heaven. That is why we have confession to cleanse our souls. You know myself i dread going, but you know what i am not going to no more. THe last 3 times when I came out I felt so good. If more people went back they would be carry 80% less stress. The saying Confession is good for the soul is not just a saying. Think about it why would Jesus tell us to go if it wasnt for our good. When did Jesus do anything for his good, it was always and always will be for our good.

 

[Woodleigh]

Please comment on this excerpt from my post:

Catholic schools HAVE taught that non-Catholics cannot go to heaven. Period. No exceptions or qualifications were mentioned. The clear message: Only Catholics can hope to spend eternal life with God.

 

[jcoldc]

Please comment on this excerpt from my post:

Catholic schools HAVE taught that non-Catholics cannot go to heaven. Period. No exceptions or qualifications were mentioned. The clear message: Only Catholics can hope to spend eternal life with God.

When was this? (There might have been that teraching before Vatican II???) If the school said this, it is wrong. The Catholic Church teaches invincible ignorance. And if the Church did believe that, why should we apologize? Many protestants go around saying Catholics are going to hell. Have you asked them to apologize?

I’m guessing you are a NCC . If you have been told you won’t get to heaven because you are not a catholic, I feel for you. Because I’m Catholic and have heard this plenty of times from Protestants. And honestly, from where I stand (and I know many NCC) Catholics receive it more than they dish it out.

 

[rinnie]

Please comment on this excerpt from my post:

Catholic schools HAVE taught that non-Catholics cannot go to heaven. Period. No exceptions or qualifications were mentioned. The clear message: Only Catholics can hope to spend eternal life with God.

I am sorry but this is not true, tell me did you yourself go to a Catholic School? If so could you pm me to where it was. I went to a CS all of my life and never i repeat NEVER was taught this. We were never taught that no catholics could not go to heaven. We we not ever taught that anyone could or could not go to heaven. We we taught the Sacraments, to respect, and that on the day we die we will be judged for our sins. That is called judgement day and that is the day we will see if we get into heaven, God will do that, no one else. We were taught that everyone will have this day no matter who you are and will be judged for everything we did or did not do. So please again PM me and let me know the school, that taught this. thankyou.

 

[kalt]

I just wanted some opinions - from Catholics and from others here. I mean some things that I seem to hear A LOT of on this board (not so much on other boards on this site though) are the following:

• RCC is the only one correct church
• Everyone else is going to Hell - no matter if you profess Jesus as your Savior and believe in the Trininity (and are Baptized).
• the thought that Protestants have no right to basically worship Jesus - the whole argument of why do you copy us and what gives you the right to worship differently than “us” kind of thing.
• I have seen in a post below that it is thought people should convert because the Pope has a large following and because he “does good things” essentially (well nobody does good outside the CC?)
• Unwillingness by some to even acknowledge that the church has done mistakes as well.
• are so happy when people join their religion and are very loving, but throw threats against those who are not a part of their church (or especially those who leave the church - you are damned and are going to Hell type of stuff).

All of these things lead me to think are some Catholics a little vain? Isn’t that too a sin? Shouldn’t they (along with all other Christians - this is not just a slam against Catholics) try to find at least a friendly middle ground without attacking eachother making us look petty and like we can not even come to agreements when regarding our Main religion - Christianity?

Now I am not talking all Catholics - many Catholics get along great with other religions, have friends in Protestant religions, and can get a long very well. They pray for eachother and hope they find the right path to God. They do not pressure eachother and tell eachother how wrong the other one is. I never had anyone tell me at RCIA I was going to Hell unless I converted. On the contrary they acknowledged that while we are differen’t “religions” we worship God and our goals are to become closer to God in the best way we know and that GOD LOVES ALL.

I have not even gotten such cold responses from any of the priests or monks I have met (any of them) telling me that all non-Catholics will go to Hell and trying to tell me how wrong I am. Why do some take it to extremes?

When some Catholics say you are going to Hell if you don’t walk,talk and act like us, do they really think they are influencing the person to consider the CC? If I came up to you and demanded you do this and that and told you everything you knew was wrong and you were damned, you probably would come on here saying how some protestant harassed you

So I guess my two questions are

1- protestants how do you view those Catholics who say things like you are going to Hell

and

2 - What do Catholics think? Especially the ones who do not believe their “Christian brothers” are all hell bound

The Catholics who talk like that are arrogant, and they’re wrong.

 

[Mystic_of_God]

If you’re referring to the Catholics on this forum, it’s not the best sampling group.

 

[kalt]

You cannot be a Catholic for saying this. You are here in disguise for everything you say is AGAINST the Catholic church.

You’ve accused me of not being Catholic, too. What gives with you?

 

[patg]

I am sorry but this is not true, tell me did you yourself go to a Catholic School? If so could you pm me to where it was. I went to a CS all of my life and never i repeat NEVER was taught this. We were never taught that no catholics could not go to heaven. We we not ever taught that anyone could or could not go to heaven. We we taught the Sacraments, to respect, and that on the day we die we will be judged for our sins. That is called judgement day and that is the day we will see if we get into heaven, God will do that, no one else. We were taught that everyone will have this day no matter who you are and will be judged for everything we did or did not do. So please again PM me and let me know the school, that taught this. thankyou.

I am sorry also but in the past this was very true. I was constantly taught this throughout eight years of Catholic school. We were taught that Catholics were the only ones going to heaven and that all other faiths were evil. One of my clearest memories on this subject was one of my teachers (they were all nuns) saying that we should avoid having non-Catholic playmates because why be friends with someone you knew was going to hell?

These are very clear memories of teachings that were consistently emphasized in my Catholic school. From my experience this was very common, at least as recently as 40 years ago.

 

[ralphinal]

Please comment on this excerpt from my post:

Catholic schools HAVE taught that non-Catholics cannot go to heaven. Period. No exceptions or qualifications were mentioned. The clear message: Only Catholics can hope to spend eternal life with God.

Here is what the Church has always taught: There is no salvation for those who know that the Catholic Church is the true Church of God and choose to leave it anyway. Period. This has been and will remain the teaching of the Church. When the doctrine was first clarified, it was prior to the Reformation (even prior to the discovery of the Americas) and, at the time, it was felt that everyone had been taught the Good News in such a way that basic human reason would accept it. Because of this, the Church defined it as no salvation outside of the Church. Pagans, Jews, and Muslims were all beleived to have been taught the faith and rejected it dispite knowing better.

Since then, we have learned of new lands, where the people had no chance to learn the faith. We have also learned that the missionary efforts were not as extensive or successful has had been thought. These people, whom the document defined as Pagan, Jews, and Muslims, had never really been offered the chance to understand why they should want to be Catholic, or that it was even an option. Once this was understood, the Church saw that there was still work to be done before there was a universal situation.

Now, there was the Reformation and the breaking off of other denominations. As a rule, there were very few groups that split over strictly theological issues. Very, very few. With the vast majority, there was at least some political or geographic issue as well. Take for example Henry VIII. Obviously, he left over a theological issue, right? He felt that he had the right to divorce and remarry without an annulment. However, look at what he really said and did. He felt that there was no Church over the King. Because of him, an entire nation was forced to leave the faith. Rent “A Man for All Seasons.” It is one of the best movies ever. Now, the Church stated that those who left had some issues. The level of culpability varies. Some knew that they were leaving the true Church and left anyway. Some did not, and some did not even know anything had changed until it was too late. Over time, the Church has come to understand that most people now are born into a faith system and never have the chance to learn about the Catholic Faith.

There is a third part of this equation. We must understand that the Catholic Churhc, since it is the Church founded by Christ, holds the fullness of God’s Truth for men. AS such, we also assist in distribution of Grace. All Protestant denominations hold varying levels of the Truth taken from the Church when they left. Without the Catholic Church to safegard the faith, there would be no Christianity. Therefore, there is no Salvation outside of the Church.

Now, was it taught in Catholic Schools that non-Catholics are going to hell? Yes, and depending on the time and place, that was a correct understanding of the Faith. However, it is more likely that is was a misunderstanding of the true teaching of the Church. In fact, this is one of the most misunderstood teachings that the Church has. Should the Church apologise? No. If it was an incorrect understanding, then the error was with the teachers.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

I just wanted some opinions - from Catholics and from others here. I mean some things that I seem to hear A LOT of on this board (not so much on other boards on this site though) are the following:

• RCC is the only one correct church
• Everyone else is going to Hell - no matter if you profess Jesus as your Savior and believe in the Trininity (and are Baptized).
• the thought that Protestants have no right to basically worship Jesus - the whole argument of why do you copy us and what gives you the right to worship differently than “us” kind of thing.
• I have seen in a post below that it is thought people should convert because the Pope has a large following and because he “does good things” essentially (well nobody does good outside the CC?)
• Unwillingness by some to even acknowledge that the church has done mistakes as well.
• are so happy when people join their religion and are very loving, but throw threats against those who are not a part of their church (or especially those who leave the church - you are damned and are going to Hell type of stuff).

All of these things lead me to think are some Catholics a little vain? Isn’t that too a sin? Shouldn’t they (along with all other Christians - this is not just a slam against Catholics) try to find at least a friendly middle ground without attacking eachother making us look petty and like we can not even come to agreements when regarding our Main religion - Christianity?

Now I am not talking all Catholics - many Catholics get along great with other religions, have friends in Protestant religions, and can get a long very well. They pray for eachother and hope they find the right path to God. They do not pressure eachother and tell eachother how wrong the other one is. I never had anyone tell me at RCIA I was going to Hell unless I converted. On the contrary they acknowledged that while we are differen’t “religions” we worship God and our goals are to become closer to God in the best way we know and that GOD LOVES ALL.

I have not even gotten such cold responses from any of the priests or monks I have met (any of them) telling me that all non-Catholics will go to Hell and trying to tell me how wrong I am. Why do some take it to extremes?

When some Catholics say you are going to Hell if you don’t walk,talk and act like us, do they really think they are influencing the person to consider the CC? If I came up to you and demanded you do this and that and told you everything you knew was wrong and you were damned, you probably would come on here saying how some protestant harassed you

So I guess my two questions are

1- protestants how do you view those Catholics who say things like you are going to Hell

and

2 - What do Catholics think? Especially the ones who do not believe their “Christian brothers” are all hell bound

Hi,
I dont know a single catholic outside this forum that thinks they are the only ones going to heaven. And actually not one thinks that the CC is the only true church. Even though this is what the CC teaches-all the catholics I know dont buy it.

I think the ones(who say this) on this forum are just a different breed of catholics that are extremely legalistic. I could say the same for some people of all religions as well.

As a born again believer who loves Christ and gave my life up to follow Him, it is irritating and arrogant to me for anyone to say their church is the only way
To me, that is limiting God and putting Him in a box.

 

[jcoldc]

From my experience this was very common, at least as recently as 40 years ago.

I think, again, this is a pre-Vatican II thing. (I’m born and bred post Vatican II.) 40 years ago, isn’t all that recent, considering Vatican II. But it makes sense to me, that you’ve experienced this, before V II.

Remember we’re still guided by the Holy Spirit. We are given guidance when we need it.

Raphinal, you said it wonderfully in your post.

 

[rinnie]

I am sorry also but in the past this was very true. I was constantly taught this throughout eight years of Catholic school. We were taught that Catholics were the only ones going to heaven and that all other faiths were evil. One of my clearest memories on this subject was one of my teachers (they were all nuns) saying that we should avoid having non-Catholic playmates because why be friends with someone you knew was going to hell?

These are very clear memories of teachings that were consistently emphasized in my Catholic school. From my experience this was very common, at least as recently as 40 years ago.

ok heres the thing, I wasnt taught that, so why dont you do this, Go back, talk to the School, or if the school isnt there go to the parish, Do you think that it is possible that is the way you umderstood it to be. If in fact that is what you were taught, then Sister made a mistake, according to your own words ONE of my teachers, Nuns arent God. So this nun made a mistake, Thats still not the teachings of the RCC. Do you agree with this? Or do you feel that is what the RCC teaches? That is what I am sticking up for my Faith. I am sorry if this in fact is true, then the teacher made a mistake, But again how can you blame the Religion.

 

[Righteousone]

You’ve accused me of not being Catholic, too. What gives with you?

Because Catholics don’t argue with other Catholics.

 

[Righteousone]

If Jesus started the Catholic church, and that church only, then how can there be salvation without it?

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Because Catholics don’t argue with other Catholics.

Well that has already been proven wrong!

 

[jcoldc]

… it is irritating and arrogant to me for anyone to say their church is the only way(

I feel the same way. Maybe I’m just hedging my bets. But I feel like I’m doing my best to do what I think is right. I know others are doing the same thing. I’d hate to think someone won’t be saved because they were mistaken, but did what they felt was right. (What if I was mistaken?)

I don’t know if I have a problem with people thinking their way is the right way. I think most people do. But I think it’s proper to believe in God’s mercy, particularly for those who also love Him, even if it is differently than the next guy.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

If Jesus started the Catholic church, and that church only, then how can there be salvation without it?

You Konw–that is a great comment!! I would like to hear the answer for that one as well
How on earth then can I possibly think I have a chance at heaven if Im not a member of the CC?

 

[Righteousone]

You Konw–that is a great comment!! I would like to hear the answer for that one as well
How on earth then can I possibly think I have a chance at heaven if Im not a member of the CC?

Perhaps you should look into it.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

I feel the same way. Maybe I’m just hedging my bets. But I feel like I’m doing my best to do what I think is right. I know others are doing the same thing. I’d hate to think someone won’t be saved because they were mistaken, but did what they felt was right. (What if I was mistaken?)

I don’t know if I have a problem with people thinking their way is the right way. I think most people do. But I think it’s proper to believe in God’s mercy, particularly for those who also love Him, even if it is differently than the next guy.

I believe that if you truly love Christ with all your being–it shouldnt matter where you worship Him as long as you are with your heart:thumbsup:

I would like to believe that believing in wrong doctrine will not keep you out of heaven. It may hinder your relationship with God here on earth, but ultimately not your salvation. Unless of course you do not believe in Christ and what He did for us and try to follow His ways the best you can.