Are the visionaries in Medjugorje real?

[ProdigalSun]

Some people always have visionaries of virgin mary in Medjugorje, the most famous one is Mirjana.

Are the apparitions in Medjugorje approved by the Church already? I heard that Vatican do not approve these visionaries, what are the reasons?

And do you all think Mirjana’s visionaries and messages every month real? If not, then why does she need to pretend? I think she does see Mary talking to her… and I can’t think of why she needs to pretend…

I can’t imagine why a 16 year old child would choose to lie about this and face literally years of threats and arrests by a very corrupt Communist govt.
Mirajanna came from a very privileged family living in Sarajevo. She was by all accounts very bright and privileges while at the same time very shy to the point of being riddeled with fear while speaking to strangers.

The police and gov’t tried for years to make her recount her story. They had her removed from one of the best public schools in the country that was within walking distance of where she lived. She was sent to a ill equipped run down school that was filled with the rejects of society. She was then forced out of university by ridicule and abuse. Her life was a living hell because of the apparitions. It really would be a shock to thick a 16 year old would make this up just to have her life destroyed. It does not make sense.

If you want to hear her story from her own words (quite enlightening) go here.

Book by Mirjana Soldo - My Heart Will Triumph

Mirjana Soldo, one of the six visionaries of Medjugorje, has written her auto-biography. Read her life-changing book.

myheartwilltriumph.com

 

[ProdigalSun]

I didn’t post the link soon enough, but here’s an except from the blog post I referenced:

When Our Lady first allegedly appeared to the six youths in 1981, she reportedly told them she would only appear three more times.

She has since appeared, according to the alleged visionaries, 47,000 more times.

**This, to me is a red flag. **

There is a lot of misinformation out there and this is one of them. She said she would continue to come for as long as the Father allowed it. The visionaries thought in the beginning that these apparitions wouoldn’t last long but htey were mistaken.

 

[ProdigalSun]

ncregister.com/daily-news/faithful-await-vatican-verdict-on-medjugorje

 

[ProdigalSun]

The problem with this is that even though there may be short-term good results for these people, what happens if/when the Church officially condemns the apparitions?

Many, many people have said that they would not be able to obey the Church and would separate from the Church if she would make such a declaration. An apparition which inspires such a spirit of disobedience cannot be considered to be having good fruits.

Who has said this???
What is many people???
YOu have a source that has people saying they would disobey the church???

I believe and I would never disobey my church!!!

I have heard this argument before with no substance to it. I mean really you have personally talked with a wide swathe of the 2.5 mililion pilgrims that go each year to Medjugorje and they have told you that they would disobey???

I don’t believe that as a matter of fact several of the messages tell us that a priests blessing is far greater than anything she can give because they use the hands of Christ…
Do not speak ill of any presit or Bishop because they stand in the place of her Son!

The pilgrms always talk about how we must all Obey the Church!

 

[ProdigalSun]

You didn’t read the article did you?
Pope Francis has avoided the place.
There is a reason why we are told not to discuss it here.

POpe francis avoids it as all the Popes did because to go there would be to approve it. The Church has neither condemed nor approved but allow us to continue to do what has been done now for the many years.

 

[ProdigalSun]

Too many followers of this thing mistakenly believe that Heaven is bypassing the Church; so if the crunch comes, they’ll jump ship.

This is not true and only your subjective opinion!

 

[ProdigalSun]

A lot of the statements made by the alleged apparition go against the doctrine of the faith. For this reason alone I choose not to get involved with it.

Like what???

 

[dshix]

Who has said this???
What is many people???
YOu have a source that has people saying they would disobey the church???

I believe and I would never disobey my church!!!

Whoa, there, don’t blow my statement out of proportion. I did not say that ALL people who believe in Medjugorje will leave the Church, and I certainly did not make a personal accusation against you.

I was referring to numerous testimonies I have heard, in which I learned that there are people who believe so firmly in Medjugorje that they would be willing to commit apostasy if the Church were to condemn the apparitions.

 

[Fiasco]

I was referring to numerous testimonies I have heard, in which I learned that there are people who believe so firmly in Medjugorje that they would be willing to commit apostasy if the Church were to condemn the apparitions.

DITTO.

This is not true and only your subjective opinion!

Tragically, it IS true because i had dealings in the past with a lot of believers of this thing! It’s more than just an opinion.
See **dshix’**s post above as evidence.
The problem is that some (certainly not all!) of these believers say they’d obey Heaven rather than a fallible, sinful bishop.You can’t get through to them that that’s not how things work. Just ask Saint Pio who copped a hard time from his superiors before finally being vindicated.

How do six people keep it going for so many years especially as they were teens when they started? One was ten years old.

What do they gain from it? Are they all rich now?

Some are.

Would Satan bring so many people into the Church via Medjugorje to create a schism?

Yes. We underrate the power of his scheming and far-seeing intellect.

Have the “seers” been excommunicated?

No, but told by the bishop wielding his legitimate authority to stop promoting it.

That’s a good point, a good litmus test would be whether Eucharistic devotion has increased or decreased, because Satan would love nothing more than to decrease Eucharistic devotion.** Satan would never increase devotion to the Eucharist.**

Yes he would, and that’s exactly one way he can suck gullible folks into it: short-term loss for long-term gain, sowing seeds of disobedience.

**A warning:
**
catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=7724

**And a longer version of the above:
**
catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=6602

And at a Pilgrim mass he specifically prayed to Our Lady Queen of Peace (which is Our Lady of Medjugorje’s title).

Our Lady has had the title “Queen of Peace” for centuries.
There’s even one shrine dedicated to her under that title in the same diocese, not far from Medjugorje, and dedicated before “Medjugorje” started. (Nothing supernatural involved, though.)

Speaking of red flags: Vicka’s flinching is one.

 

[ProdigalSun]

Whoa, there, don’t blow my statement out of proportion. I did not say that ALL people who believe in Medjugorje will leave the Church, and I certainly did not make a personal accusation against you.

I was referring to numerous testimonies I have heard, in which I learned that there are people who believe so firmly in Medjugorje that they would be willing to commit apostasy if the Church were to condemn the apparitions.

BEcause you spoke with group of people about this that gave you anecdotal evidence that they would apostacize does note mean “MANY” would do the same. considering 2.5 million people go here every year. I know hundreds of people who have gone and there faith and obediance to the church has increased just like mine.

Even the seers talk about obedience to the church is of the most importance.

Time will tell what is happening in Medjugorje I personally believe all of us will be pleasantly suprised.

 

[Techno2000]

BEcause you spoke with group of people about this that gave you anecdotal evidence that they would apostacize does note mean “MANY” would do the same. considering 2.5 million people go here every year. I know hundreds of people who have gone and there faith and obediance to the church has increased just like mine.

Even the seers talk about obedience to the church is of the most importance.

Time will tell what is happening in Medjugorje I personally believe all of us will be pleasantly suprised.

True, I started saying the Rosary 20 years ago because of Medjugorje.

 

[dshix]

Even the seers talk about obedience to the church is of the most importance.

And yet they are directly disobedient to their own bishop? Don’t you see the hypocrisy?

Padre Pio was obedient when they took away his faculties. Why aren’t these “seers” obedient?

 

[Nelka]

Speaking of red flags: Vicka’s flinching is one.

What do you mean?

And yet they are directly disobedient to their own bishop? Don’t you see the hypocrisy?

Padre Pio was obedient when they took away his faculties. Why aren’t these “seers” obedient?

St. Philip Neri started a group up and was told by his to stop it and so he did even though it was a good group, later on he was allowed to continue it.

 

[dshix]

St. Philip Neri started a group up and was told by his to stop it and so he did even though it was a good group, later on he was allowed to continue it.

Right, exactly. Such obedience is very fitting, and if the group is virtuous and part of God’s will, God will provide for its eventual growth.

 

[Fiasco]

What do you mean?

Vicka flinches when a believer pokes two fingers towards her eyes during an “ecstasy”.
She later claimed that “the Gospa” was holding the Infant, and it looked like He was about to fall. She said she flinched in fright.

This link worked from here:
(“Video 2” is probably the easiest to watch.)

www.marcocorvaglia.com/medjugorje-en/a-practical-test.html

If it doesn’t work, the words “vicka flinches” bring up a fair few hits.

 

[ProdigalSun]

And yet they are directly disobedient to their own bishop? Don’t you see the hypocrisy?

Padre Pio was obedient when they took away his faculties. Why aren’t these “seers” obedient?

This is not true

The seers are not disobedient to there Bishop…

 

[ProdigalSun]

Right, exactly. Such obedience is very fitting, and if the group is virtuous and part of God’s will, God will provide for its eventual growth.

There has been exponential growth in Medjugorje. Obedience is a very important virue for sure!

 

[dshix]

There has been exponential growth in Medjugorje. Obedience is a very important virue for sure!

Growth without obedience is a very bad thing. It is a bad fruit to be disobedient to your prelate, and such bad fruit is evidence of something not right.

Give me an example of a previously approved apparition or miracle of the Church where the person(s) involved were directly disobedient to the Church.

 

[ProdigalSun]

Growth without obedience is a very bad thing. It is a bad fruit to be disobedient to your prelate, and such bad fruit is evidence of something not right.

Give me an example of a previously approved apparition or miracle of the Church where the person(s) involved were directly disobedient to the Church.

You speak as though the Seers are disobedient. I say they are not. Nor are the Fransiscans who run the Parish. Everything the Bishop has asked of them they have done.

Cheers!

 

[dshix]

THE MEDJUGORJE VIRGIN

Former prefect of the Congregation for the Causes of Saints, José Cardinal Saraiva Martins has doubts about the reality of the apparitions of Mary in Medjugorje. He said, “It could be a trick of the devil”.

Question: Eminence, in some of the apparitions, the Virgin is said to have asked the six “seers” of Medjugorje not to obey the prohibitions of their diocesan Bishop, such as, for example, to not speak publicly any more of the alleged “visions”.

He replied, “The Madonna could not, in any case at all, be anti-hierarchical and incite disobedience, even if the Bishop of Mostar were wrong. This is another element on which to reflect.”

Notably the bishop removed Fr Slavko but the Virgin told him to stay on - see the message of Sunday, February 3, 1985: “I wish for Father Slavko to stay here, for him to guide life, and to assemble all the news, so that when I leave there will be a complete image of everything that has happened here. I am also praying now for Slavko and for all those who work in this parish.” Slavko is dead and note how the message states that he is the one who will record all her doings in Medjugorje. If you want to believe in the visions then you cannot believe in any that follow Slavko’s cessation of recording keeping never mind his death.