D
distracted
Guest
Please tell us what you know about Jesus, what religion, if any, you were raised in, any other relevent info… and why you do not accept Him…
I promise not to beat you up…
I promise not to beat you up…
Are there very many non-Christains here? If so.. please explain your reasons for rejecting Christ..
- Status
R
rossum
Guest
I was brought up as a Christian. When I hit my teens I dropped religion and switched to atheism. This was mainly because I objected to the rather too common “anyone who does not agree with us is damned for eternity” attitude I found. After a few years I moved away from atheism, I felt that while it did avoid many of the problems with Christianity it was not itself a solution. I looked at different religions to find something that would work for me. None of the Abrahamic religions attracted me - as a hangover from my atheism I still had a problem with the concepts of God and soul. Initially I was interested in Hinduism: the background of Indian religion provides a very different world view: less exclusive - everyone achieves liberation eventually, the concept of karma and a much more relaxed attitude to other religions. Of the Hindu texts the Bhagavad Gita and Patanjali’s Yoga Sutras were the ones that attracted me most. In particular there is hardly any mention of gods in the Yoga Sutras. This seemed to be an interesting direction to explore.
Reading round Hinduism I inevitably came across Jainism and Buddhism. Jaininsm has souls but no gods, or at least no important gods. Buddhism has no souls and its attitude to gods was very casual; like any other living being they need to become enlightened. A mere god is far inferior to a Bodhisattva, let alone to a fully enlightened Buddha. Buddhism seemed to have the elements I was looking for: non-exclusivity, no soul, morality and while it did have gods, they were unimportant. So I tried Buddhism. I studied more on it, went to groups and to meditation classes and found that everything fitted together well and it suited the way I wanted to go.
A frequently quoted Buddhist text is the Kalama sutta which says that if we are to accept something then we have to try it first to check that it is correct. This advice applies to the Buddha’s own words just as much as to anything else. I followed the Buddha’s advice. I tried Buddhism, found that it worked and I have followed it ever since.
In Buddhist terms Jesus appears to have been an advanced Bodhisattva, higher than the gods and close to enlightenment. I do not reject Jesus, so much as follow the fully enlightened Buddha. Since there is a degree of overlap in what they both said, then by following one I am in part following the other: “Love others as you love yourself” - Bhadramayakaravyakarana sutra 91.
Buddhism is a very practical religion. It is a sustained attempt to alleviate the suffering of a less than perfect world. Generally it succeeds.
rossum
M
meedo
Guest
I am a muslim. My faith answers all my questions satisfactorily. Christianiy a best has the risk of elevating a diety o a devine status . Basicly raising up a man ( how ever great he is or however a noble prophet of God he was ) to be equal to God or Godhimself incarnate .Please tell us what you know about Jesus, what religion, if any, you were raised in, any other relevent info… and why you do not accept Him…
I promise not to beat you up…
This is somthing that to my understanding is even against Judaism and not only islam. Indeed Judaism and Islam see eye to eye on this.
It is an unnecessary risk . You can meet God and say to him that in your attempt to worship him alone and taking care to give whats due to the person who deserves it, you worshipped the Abrahamic version or understanding of God . if it turns out that God is Jesus he will understand because before he came to earth and for thousands of years this was the correct undisputed underrstanding of Abrahamic God.
If it turns the other way around , then you have a big problem.
here is God , who ordered people slain for worshipping the calv ask you why did you take another man to worship with divinity beside me ?
beacuse he made miracles — well moses made miracles
because he was born of a virgin — well adam was born with no parents at all . Eve was created from adams body parts !
beacuse he died and appeared again — well God have arisen people from the dead before , couldnt he have risen Jesus as a man who died ? ’
beacsue the holy scripture that i have says so ---- well the Old testament doesnt say so at all except when you twist its interpretation . and in the new testament the ovverwhelming majority of verses that Jesus speaks is talking about a God that jesus consideres his own God .
because jesus said he is the son of god – well other people in teh OT were named the son of God .
why put myself at risk ?
As a muslim i believe in teh God of abraham
I believe in All the prophets.
I believe that jesus was a noble prophet and the messiah
I believe in doing good deeds and in charity¨
I believe that Gods mercy and Grace is the one tha saves me .
However i need to show the metal of my faith by obeying Gods commandements.
what am i missing? and why take nnecessary risks ( at best )
best reagrds,
N
Nebogipfel
Guest
Hi distracted,
I have no religion - if you want to call me an atheist, that’s fine by me
I was raised as a cradle Catholic, and in my teens was really quite religious, trying various different forms of Christianity. However, about two years ago, I suddenly realised that I did not believe in God, and probably never really had, and that all religions were almost certainly just cultural artefacts.
What made me reach this conclusion? Lots of reasons really, I don’t think there’s any one thing, but top among them are (and I hope no-one will be offended by me saying this):
That doesn’t mean I regard Bibles as just a waste of good trees. Jesus (like the Platonic Socrates), was clearly an important moral and ethical teacher, although he was neither the first nor the only person to formulate things like the Golden Rule. But to regard the Bible as literally true…? I don’t see any reason to do that.
Just my $0.02. Hope it helps!
I have no religion - if you want to call me an atheist, that’s fine by me
I was raised as a cradle Catholic, and in my teens was really quite religious, trying various different forms of Christianity. However, about two years ago, I suddenly realised that I did not believe in God, and probably never really had, and that all religions were almost certainly just cultural artefacts.
What made me reach this conclusion? Lots of reasons really, I don’t think there’s any one thing, but top among them are (and I hope no-one will be offended by me saying this):
- The problem of evil - why does a loving God permit such terrible things to happen in the world?
- If God really was talking to a particular group of people, it would surely be objectively obvious who those people were, and what God was saying to them. Instead there are thousands of different religions, all saying mutually contradictory things. And even the people who claim to follow the same religion can’t agree with each other on what that religion means.
- Science has revealed a universe which is, as someone once put it, not only more wierd and more wonderful than we imagined, but more wierd and more wonderful than we can imagine. The God I see described in the Bible is just too small and parochial to have brought this cosmos into existence.
That doesn’t mean I regard Bibles as just a waste of good trees. Jesus (like the Platonic Socrates), was clearly an important moral and ethical teacher, although he was neither the first nor the only person to formulate things like the Golden Rule. But to regard the Bible as literally true…? I don’t see any reason to do that.
Just my $0.02. Hope it helps!
O
OneTrueCathApos
Guest
Buddha didn’t die for our sins,
Mohammed didn’t die for our sins,
But Jesus Christ died for our sins.
Mohammed didn’t die for our sins,
But Jesus Christ died for our sins.
K
kt342206
Guest
I was raised Catholic and was a faithful Catholic until last year. In fact, I have posted on this forum several times over the past several years (under a different user name) strongly defending every single teaching of the Catholic Church. I was not a cafeteria Catholic. I studied apologetics as a hobby. I was faithful to the church in every regard, including the “hard” issues. Daily rosary, monthly confession, weekly (sometimes daily) mass, Divine Mercy devotion…I could go on. You get the point.
Then I decided that I needed to know why I believed what I believed. Since I was raised Catholic, I wanted to make sure that things still made sense if I were to look at my faith without the assumption that Catholicism or even Christianity were the truth. I needed to look at things outside the box.
When I decided to do that, I was surprised at what I found. I realized that maybe Catholicism, and therefore Christianity, was not what I thought it was (I know enough to confidently state that if Christianity holds the truth, the fullness of that truth is found only in Catholicism).
I would now consider myself a sort of weak agnostic. I do not think I believe in the Christian God, but I do not discount that there may be some kind of god somewhere…I think that there is inconclusive evidence.
I am not really interested in any kind of discussion pertaining to what I have posted; in other words, people can comment on my post all they like and ask me questions, but I won’t be answering. I don’t mean to say that in a haughty, “I know better that you,” way. I simply do not have the desire to enter into a discussion about my beliefs at this time. I guess I thought I would let you guys know about that ahead of time so you didn’t think I was avoiding you or being ignorant.
I am very aware of what the Church says on all of the issues I have grappled with in the past year. I still examine Catholic teaching and visit this site almost every single day. Without claiming to know and understand everything, I want you to know that there is probably not much you can say to “win me back to the fold” at this time. Remember, I was one of you less than a year ago. I was playing your role. I can probably anticipate most of the responses you would give because those would be the responses I would give, too.
In closing, I would like to say that even though I consider myself to have left the church for the time being, I do not have any contempt for the Church. I am not angry. I am not bitter. I still have a great deal of respect for the Church and for Catholics.
So yeah.
Then I decided that I needed to know why I believed what I believed. Since I was raised Catholic, I wanted to make sure that things still made sense if I were to look at my faith without the assumption that Catholicism or even Christianity were the truth. I needed to look at things outside the box.
When I decided to do that, I was surprised at what I found. I realized that maybe Catholicism, and therefore Christianity, was not what I thought it was (I know enough to confidently state that if Christianity holds the truth, the fullness of that truth is found only in Catholicism).
I would now consider myself a sort of weak agnostic. I do not think I believe in the Christian God, but I do not discount that there may be some kind of god somewhere…I think that there is inconclusive evidence.
I am not really interested in any kind of discussion pertaining to what I have posted; in other words, people can comment on my post all they like and ask me questions, but I won’t be answering. I don’t mean to say that in a haughty, “I know better that you,” way. I simply do not have the desire to enter into a discussion about my beliefs at this time. I guess I thought I would let you guys know about that ahead of time so you didn’t think I was avoiding you or being ignorant.
I am very aware of what the Church says on all of the issues I have grappled with in the past year. I still examine Catholic teaching and visit this site almost every single day. Without claiming to know and understand everything, I want you to know that there is probably not much you can say to “win me back to the fold” at this time. Remember, I was one of you less than a year ago. I was playing your role. I can probably anticipate most of the responses you would give because those would be the responses I would give, too.
In closing, I would like to say that even though I consider myself to have left the church for the time being, I do not have any contempt for the Church. I am not angry. I am not bitter. I still have a great deal of respect for the Church and for Catholics.
So yeah.
O
OneTrueCathApos
Guest
I am sad for your rejecting the one true church that Christ founded. I will pray for your return.
M
Muslim_Woman
Guest
In the name of Allah , Most Gracious, Most Merciful
Salaam/peace
Jesus Through a Muslim Lens
“In the Muslim view, Jesus’ essential work was not to replicate magic bread or to test our credulity, but to complement the legalism of the Torah with a leavening compassion rarely expressed in the older testament. His actions and words introduce something new to monotheism: They develop the merciful spirit of God’s nature.”
Read Michael Wolfe’s entire article on how Muslims perceive Jesus here
readingislam.com/servlet/Satellite?c=Article_C&cid=1154235132144&pagename=Zone-English-Discover_Islam%2FDIELayout
Salaam/peace
Muslims do accept him but not as son of God or God Himself but a blessed messenger of God Almighty. We don’t worship him but it’s a must for us to respect both Mother Mary & Jesus (pbut).
Jesus Through a Muslim Lens
“In the Muslim view, Jesus’ essential work was not to replicate magic bread or to test our credulity, but to complement the legalism of the Torah with a leavening compassion rarely expressed in the older testament. His actions and words introduce something new to monotheism: They develop the merciful spirit of God’s nature.”
Read Michael Wolfe’s entire article on how Muslims perceive Jesus here
readingislam.com/servlet/Satellite?c=Article_C&cid=1154235132144&pagename=Zone-English-Discover_Islam%2FDIELayout
1
1234
Guest
I’m an atheist, fut am influenced by Buddhism and, secondarily, Christianity.
I object to Christianity because of severe unanswered philosophical problems, mainly the problem of evil, and of severe problems with the New Testament, written about Jews speaking Aramaic–in Greek, with a lot of interpolations and contradictions; with the earliest gospel, Mark, written at least 30 years after the events, with the most detailed gospels, Luke and John, written either much later, or by s non-eye witness Gentile. All of the gospels written after Paul’s epistles. I regard Christianity as Paul’s religion. Jesus was a Jew and did not intend to leave Judaism or found a new religion.
I object to Christianity because of severe unanswered philosophical problems, mainly the problem of evil, and of severe problems with the New Testament, written about Jews speaking Aramaic–in Greek, with a lot of interpolations and contradictions; with the earliest gospel, Mark, written at least 30 years after the events, with the most detailed gospels, Luke and John, written either much later, or by s non-eye witness Gentile. All of the gospels written after Paul’s epistles. I regard Christianity as Paul’s religion. Jesus was a Jew and did not intend to leave Judaism or found a new religion.
O
OneTrueCathApos
Guest
Sorry, but your views on Christianity are distorted. Perhaps if you took the time to read and fully know Christ and accept Him as your Lord and Savior, you’d understand. If you do not understand Christianity/Catholicism, then you really can’t comment. To be ignorant of Scripture is ignorant of Christ. Your Messiah, your Savior.
L
Linna
Guest
I was raised in the Church and loved the Church until I got divorced and got kicked out. Since divorce is not the unpardonable sin, I strongly believe God forgives divorce just as he forgave the woman at the well and the thief on the cross. Excluding those who are divorced from the sacraments of the Chruch teaches a God looking for people to condemn, not save and love. Catholics often think of God as a vengeful being waitiing to throw someone into hell every time they think a bad thought. God is more loving than that. The Bible doesn’t teach a hateful God, either, but a Father who loves his children. Catholics love guilt.
So…I believe the Bible, in Jesus Christ, and the love God has for us all. I don’t think God would condemn me for having to get divorced.
So…I believe the Bible, in Jesus Christ, and the love God has for us all. I don’t think God would condemn me for having to get divorced.
T
Tantum_ergo
Guest
Linna if you are divorced but have not remarried another person, you are not 'condemned, it is not the ‘unforgiveable sin’, and you are perfectly free provided you are otherwise in a state of grace to receive communion.
WHERE did you get the idea that being divorced cut you off from the sacraments forever?
Now, if you’re divorced but have since remarried without a decree of nullity, you are not free to receive but not because you’re divorced. . .you wouldn’t be free because you would still validly married in the eyes of GOD to your first husband and thus are living in sin with a second husband.
I think you had posted on this earlier but I had not seen whether you were divorced and not remarried.
Again, if you are divorced and not remarried you are free (if in a state of grace) to receive and participate fully in the Church.
And if you are divorced and remarried without a decree-it is not the divorce that is the problem but your willful disobedience in an invalid and unlawful remarriage. And it’s not “The Church” at fault, or God, because they weren’t the ones responsible.
WHERE did you get the idea that being divorced cut you off from the sacraments forever?
Now, if you’re divorced but have since remarried without a decree of nullity, you are not free to receive but not because you’re divorced. . .you wouldn’t be free because you would still validly married in the eyes of GOD to your first husband and thus are living in sin with a second husband.
I think you had posted on this earlier but I had not seen whether you were divorced and not remarried.
Again, if you are divorced and not remarried you are free (if in a state of grace) to receive and participate fully in the Church.
And if you are divorced and remarried without a decree-it is not the divorce that is the problem but your willful disobedience in an invalid and unlawful remarriage. And it’s not “The Church” at fault, or God, because they weren’t the ones responsible.
N
Nebogipfel
Guest
I should perhaps point out that I don’t single Jesus out specially for rejection - from where I’m standing, anyone who claims to have supernatural knowledge or attributes is (or was) almost certainly mistaken in that belief.
Some interesting replies above; as regards to Buddha and Mohammad not having died for our sins… doesn’t that beg the question? How does one man’s death atone for the sins of the whole world? What is a “sin” anyway?
I don’t mean to derail distracted’s thread. I’m happy to discuss this somewhere else…
Some interesting replies above; as regards to Buddha and Mohammad not having died for our sins… doesn’t that beg the question? How does one man’s death atone for the sins of the whole world? What is a “sin” anyway?
I don’t mean to derail distracted’s thread. I’m happy to discuss this somewhere else…
R
rossum
Guest
Sin is a Christian concept, not a Buddhist one. In Buddhism there are just wise and unwise actions, and all actions have consequences. Buddhism also has no forgiveness of sins - if you do the crime then you do the time. No parole and no Get Out of Jail Free cards:Mind precedes all conditions,
mind is their chief, they are mind-made.
If you speak or act with an evil mind then suffering will follow you,
as the wheel follows the draught ox.
Mind precedes all conditions,
mind is their chief, they are mind-made.
If you speak or act with a pure mind then happiness will follow you,
as a shadow that never leaves.
Dhammapada 1:1-2
rossum
L
Linna
Guest
Who decided adultry wasn’t a “confessable sin” Jesus said remarriage after a divorce caused adultry, but he didn’t say it couldn’t be forgiven. The Pope says that. The Pope made it up like many things in the Catholic faith.
Seems to me the Pope sets up these laws which are “man made” and not even biblical. Your comment back to me is just like a Catholic - condemning, judgmental, unforgiving. Personally, as a Christian I’m not a judge and I’m not willing to judge other people. I’m more than happy to let God be the judge. Catholics are unforgiving people. God would not have wanted me to live unmarried the rest of my life and be alone and unhappy. To believe that is to believe God Himself is unforgiving.
So, don’t judge me. You ARE Catholic, but you aren’t the judge.My remarriage is a matter between me and God, not between me and the Pope. Remarriage after a divorce is a forgiveable sin – “one time” since God forgives all sins and tells us that once you are forgiven he doesn’t want to hear it anymore.
But, Catholics aren’t like that.They love to rub it in, judge you, and keep God away from you. That’s why I’d have to think very carefully about being a Catholic again.
Seems to me the Pope sets up these laws which are “man made” and not even biblical. Your comment back to me is just like a Catholic - condemning, judgmental, unforgiving. Personally, as a Christian I’m not a judge and I’m not willing to judge other people. I’m more than happy to let God be the judge. Catholics are unforgiving people. God would not have wanted me to live unmarried the rest of my life and be alone and unhappy. To believe that is to believe God Himself is unforgiving.
So, don’t judge me. You ARE Catholic, but you aren’t the judge.My remarriage is a matter between me and God, not between me and the Pope. Remarriage after a divorce is a forgiveable sin – “one time” since God forgives all sins and tells us that once you are forgiven he doesn’t want to hear it anymore.
But, Catholics aren’t like that.They love to rub it in, judge you, and keep God away from you. That’s why I’d have to think very carefully about being a Catholic again.
1
1234
Guest
Hear, hear!
(or is it “Here! Here!”?)
Anyway, I find Christians, but particularly Catholics,* preoccupied *with sin. It’s easy for them to be so preoccupied, because almost everything is a sin! This preoccupation doesn’t make them better, it just makes them miserable.
Whereas, Buddhists are happy because they either have destroyed or (usually) are trying to destroy their egos, the source of unhappiness.
L
Linna
Guest
Christians are very happy people also because they believe in the loving grace of God. Jesus didn’t die on the cross so He could withhold Himself from his children. Christians believe God forgives sin ( 7 times 70 and 700 more) Catholics believe God is ready to zap people and throw them into hell if they don’t do what the Pope says. Catholics also believe God condemns and withholds his love from those who do not obey the Pope. This is man’s law, not God’s. Catholics need to abide by the Bible more and stop obeying laws and condemnations invented by the Pope to enslave God’s children. Christianity is supposed to free men fromtheir sins, not enslave them.
D
distracted
Guest
thanks for sharing your journey…
not trying to start a problem… but what about Buddha leaving his wife/child… on the day the child was born? I mean, how “enlightened” is that? Obviously, Jesus would never have done that. Jesus remained a virgin… to show to the world that all things of this world, including sex, are not to be … idolized… We are not to be attached to anything or any one… but only to God…
(Jesus is God… although i am sure you don’t accept that…)
Have you ever looked into Catholicism? If so, How did that go?
It would be nice to know your age/sex, but if you dont want to say, that’s understandable…
God bless…
D
distracted
Guest
i don’t have much time right now… so will only comment on a few of your points…
Jesus said that if you have seen Him you have seen the Father… We either believe all of what Jesus said or we can believe NONE… He either is God as he says or he is a terrible liar and fraud… There is no in-between…
I will leave it at that for now…
D
distracted
Guest
not much time so will answer this…
God allows evil because human beings (who are, essentially “gods” becaue they have the power to do as they please)… choose to do evil…
God created us free beings… He will not force anyone to choose Him… and so tht is why there is evil in the world… We have the means at our disposal to end world hunger but people are greedy and selfish & uncaring… so people starve… People also tend to think they are better than others… I know religious groups that believe that if a person is poor (Christian person) he is doing something wrong with his relationship with God… becaues God doesn’t want anyone to be poor… Hmmm… strange belief considering that Jesus himself was “poor” (materially)…
anyway… God is love so he brings good out of evil… but that doesn’t mean he is going to let evil-doers get away with hteir evil forever… I have no trouble believing in Hell… Eternal Hell is something that i used to struggle with… .b ut seeing the ugly nature of sin… well, i don’t struggle with it too much. Sin drags one to the ground… and lower… If one does not rise above it through repentance… regeneration … one ends up… still on the ground… and lower…
God bless…
- Status