Are we expected to have kids right away?

[mschrank]

Thanks for your replies. You see, I thought that you had to do it on your wedding night otherwise the marriage wouldn’t be valid until you did, and then you wouldn’t be properly married! We are so in love, a few months ago we were talking about eloping, you know, we knew we wouldn’t actually do something like that but we wanted to deep down!

The support network is important. After our wedding, I am going off to Basic Training with the Air Force. After I get out, we’re going wherever the Air Force sends me. So for the first year of our lives together, I don’t think we’d have the kind of stability and support network around us that would help when having a child.

That being said, we would love the child and make due if we were so blessed. Today she told me she was on the train yesterday evening and saw a young couple, probably about our age, with two small children. She told me she wanted that with me more than anything, and had nothing but peace and joy when pondering the possibility.

 

[otjm]

Thanks for your reply.

I was not raised Catholic nor (aside from my lady who is also a convert) have any Catholic friends so I was confused on this issue.

We are ready to have kids, you’re right, otherwise we wouldn’t be getting married. We’re in our mid twenties and fairly well formed and committed to our faith.

I was just a little worried that having kids early could be bad, because you know, that’s what everyone says. Everyone tells me “wait five years” or “don’t go having kids right away, get to know each other first”.

Why do you say it is a glue? Just wondering.

There have been someinteresting studies of married couples, looking at when they had children, and the divorce rate. The studies have shown that those who have children earlier in the marriage tend to have a significantly lower divorce rate than those who wait.

There is a lot of loose talk about it is better to wait. Most of that is spoken in terms of economics; not having children right away allows you to stabalize yourselves financially (believe me, kids are costly!). But that puts undue emphasis on economics, as opposed to family dynamics.

And very practically, having a child (or more) works as glue; you get attached to the little creatures! Someone gets mad; takes a walk around the block (or a drive to let off steam) and they are much more likely to come home and deal with it if that child they are so attached to is there; no child, and it is all too easy to just keep driving/walking/whatever.

Please note: “everyone” says a lot of things; some of them right, some wrong, and some needing a whole lot more information before one can act upon what “everyone” says. You two are the ones who have to make the moral decisiopn as to how many children you have, and when, God willing that you have any. Not anyone else. God bless on your marriage and decision making as partners in this journey.

 

[johnnyjoe]

Hey Johnny,

Hmm, it’s a long story for us. My parents were sort of non-denominational. She was baptized Catholic but never raised with any religion (weird family story). We both began to realize the importance of faith in college, and we just met last summer!

So then, it’s normal for a lady to be tracking her fertility before the marriage? I just thought, haha, well, it’s be inappropriate to say… “so, how is your ovulation going? what about the mucus” when you’re not married yet, haha, you know what I mean!?!

She’s a virgin and I’m not, but I may as well be one, I am very sheepish about this kind of thing now in regards to her!

I, as the lesser half of a CCL teaching couple, don’t think it inappropriate for you to learn all the information your fiance’ will be learning to properly chart her fertility signs. Studies have shown the single most significant factor in the successful use of NFP in marriage is the support of the husband. We instruct the men that the temperature taking (we teach the Sympto-Thermal method which charts BOTH the mucus and temperature signs) is their responsibilty - it’s really the only thing we can “do”. I get up every morning and take my wife’s temperature at 6:00 am - rain or shine, weekend or not. Since you cannot do that for your fiance, with engaged men we ask they take full ownership of the process of learning NFP. You should learn the science and biology of your wife’s fertility cycle so you can be a responsible partner for her when the need arises.

When a couple discerns they have a serious reason to postpone - a decision I think is best undertaken with the (name removed by moderator)ut of a good spritual advisor as well - then it is often the husband who has to have the discipline to abstain in the fertile time. The sexual self possesion you have exhibited as you have courted your fiance will still need to be practiced in marriage as well. We use the term “marital chastity” - a responsible expression of the powers of fertility in a balanced and joyful way. Don’t get me wrong… we aren’t prudes about the joys of marital intimacy. In fact, we believe it is the duty of NFP teachers to give the couple every opportunity to engage in the marital act - whether they are seeking to achieve or postpone a pregnancy.

Now learning these details is only most appropriate as preparation of marriage, and while the Church does not in all cases REQUIRE taking the classes, she certainly encourages knowing and understanding the basic concepts behind perodic abstinance or the use of Natural Family Planning.

I am an NFP teacher, but experience has taught me that for some the practice of NFP can give rise to a level of economic materialism that can be a real harm to a marriage. Having young children is a young persons game. (We had twins at 38, and your age and stamina will catch up with you!) That being said, the ONLY people who can determine what a “serious reason” for postponing pregnancy REALLY is are the couple themselves, with the (name removed by moderator)ut of a good spiritual advisor as well, I pray.

Feel free to contact me on the PM system if you have more specific questions…

Pax Christi
John

 

[johnnyjoe]

Bolded emphasis is mine. I disagree with that statement. Children should not be the glue that binds the couple’s relationship. Love should be the glue, the tie that binds the couple. Children are the fruit of the love.

I would contend you are splitting a few hairs. The love for a child is different, of course, than the love for a spouse, but the unique quality of love for a child is that it is intimately tied between the spouses.

That is the kind of “glue” that I was referring. One cannot replace the marital sacramental bond with the love of children, but the marital sacrament is improved and strengthened by the begetting of children.

 

[johnnyjoe]

What is wrong with wanting to spend some time togethor before the life changing responsibility of children - like for example a year? Once you have children the focus goes off each other and onto the child, which is fair enough, but I get the distinct impression that Catholics actually will this because children are a good way to force a couple to stop ‘selfishly’ enjoying each others company - as if there’s something wrong with that - and get on to the real business.

Any couple who loses the ability to “focus” on each other after they have children will certianly hamper their ability to be good parents. The most important thing a couple can give a child is the witness of a loving marriage.

Having children does not in and of itself inhibit that witness. It can, I suppose, but that would reflect a defect in the character of the spouses, and not a problem with the children.

There is such a thing as “selfishly enjoying each other”. Contraception is a typical way for couples to “selfishly enjoy each other”. Many marriages today do not exhibit mutual self-giving. Many today are contractual arrangements for mutual use of the other. There is a large difference between the gifting of oneself, and the use of the other, and if you would like to explore them, google the term “Theology of the Body” and read up…

 

[hasikelee]

H-- using NFP and postponing pregnancy for a time is NOT an intention against children and does not invalidate a marriage.

A *permanent *intent against children, manifested before the marriage, is an impediment. However, the scenario described by the OP in no way meets that criteria.

mschrank: Our original wedding date was 11/24/07. It was the cutest thing: his parents were married on the 23 and mine the 25th. Due to several compelling reasons, unfortunately, we are moving it forward to 2008, August.

1ke, I do agree with your clear and helpful lines for determining validity. My post was more on my personal development in understanding my motives and desires I have grown in faith.

There are instances where a person might not be entirely truthful with themselves, let alone their future spouse. Wanting to put off kids for a vague amount of time seems to be very popular in my age bracket. Most people say things such as “someday” “maybe” “when I have more money” etc. Notice I am not talking of people making specific plans to better care for a new of future family.

It just seems that if these people want to get married now, yet are not even sure IF or when they will accept children, it is questionable how honest they would be during the wedding vows. Even if the person intended to use a valid exercise such as NFP, the fact remains that they very well may be intending to reject children.

My meanderings didn’t apply to those who are trying to work with God and their bodies for the betterment of their new family life together, all the while ready to accept any new life.

I hope that makes more sense!