Are we the lepers of our time?

[I_AM_1]

NO way that I ask this will be easy…I am prepared even if you want to delete this because it is such a controversial subject. I tried to bring it up before but was shut down and was left to wonder why so many Catholics still want to live in denial instead of facing tough decisions that need to be made and making them.

When I was fourteen I was sexually abused and Raped by a Catholic Priest. I lost my faith and stopped the process of becoming catholic at that time. 15 years later I am back in church and was just baptized last April. I wanted to be a part of Gods family again.

At fourteen when it happened, the catholic people shunned me and didn’t want to have anything to do with me. I was pushed to the side and frankly when the thread I began on this blog was deleted, I felt the same force pushing me to the side once more – outside of the church.

Does the Catholic church welcome victims of Priest Abuse with open arms or are we too heavy on the eyes to look at? Are we the lepers of our time, where only Jesus himself would choose to have us in his company? Shunned my the church and it’s people, I sense this is true. Is it?

 

[CatsAndDogs]

NO way that I ask this will be easy…I am prepared even if you want to delete this because it is such a controversial subject. I tried to bring it up before but was shut down and was left to wonder why so many Catholics still want to live in denial instead of facing tough decisions that need to be made and making them.

When I was fourteen I was sexually abused and Raped by a Catholic Priest. I lost my faith and stopped the process of becoming catholic at that time. 15 years later I am back in church and was just baptized last April. I wanted to be a part of Gods family again.

At fourteen when it happened, the catholic people shunned me and didn’t want to have anything to do with me. I was pushed to the side and frankly when the thread I began on this blog was deleted, I felt the same force pushing me to the side once more – outside of the church.

Does the Catholic church welcome victims of Priest Abuse with open arms or are we too heavy on the eyes to look at? Are we the lepers of our time, where only Jesus himself would choose to have us in his company? Shunned my the church and it’s people, I sense this is true. Is it?

Benedict XVI doesn’t seem to think so, as he met with some victims of that evil, when he didn’t really have to.

If the abusees goal is to simply attack the Church, instead of attacking the evil-doers, then that is not a “leper”, but rather a self-defiling person who smears feces on themself to claim victimhood for personal gain.

It’s more than appropriate to attack, charitably, the evil-doers. I personally have absolutely no problem with identifying evil-doers and shaming them to promote contrition and forgiveness.

 

[I_AM_1]

I don’t want to shame them…I want to forgive them. I think we should promote forgiveness of the priests…but my experience is that the people don’t even want to talk to the victims, let alone the perpetrators. I really believe that the holy spirit is leading me to help bring back the victims of priest abuse to the church…to their home. I can’t do this with conviction without knowing first if the church will accept them without anguish or hypocrisy.
Forgiveness is my motive.

 

[Swamp_Yankee]

Benedict XVI doesn’t seem to think so, as he met with some victims of that evil, when he didn’t really have to.

If the abusees goal is to simply attack the Church, instead of attacking the evil-doers, then that is not a “leper”, but rather a self-defiling person who smears feces on themself to claim victimhood for personal gain.

It’s more than appropriate to attack, charitably, the evil-doers. I personally have absolutely no problem with identifying evil-doers and shaming them to promote contrition and forgiveness.

I think the Pope absolutely had to and should meet with the victims, and the Church deserves the black eye it has recieved because of the scandle. I believe every accused priest should be brought to trial as well as those in leadership positions who knowingly transfered offending priests to other parishes . The church should give up any known or suspected pedifiles to the authorities. In case I have been unclear let me sum-up. No quarter should be given to any child predator, secular or religious. I don’t have any official authority, but as a catholic , I_AM I appologise for what happened to you, for the physical and emotional insult done to you . It’s inexcusable.

 

[CatsAndDogs]

I don’t want to shame them…I want to forgive them. I think we should promote forgiveness of the priests…but my experience is that the people don’t even want to talk to the victims, let alone the perpetrators. I really believe that the holy spirit is leading me to help bring back the victims of priest abuse to the church…to their home. I can’t do this with conviction without knowing first if the church will accept them without anguish or hypocrisy.
Forgiveness is my motive.

If you WANT to forgive them, then you have forgiven them.

But to be forgiven, they must be contrite and actually want real as-Catholics-know-it forgiveness, and show they do so.

No one LIKES being near a “nasty situation”, but if the abusee is truly seeking to SUPPORT the Church, and demonstrates that, the people of God won’t have any problem with them (abusees) doing that.

But angry people throwing things at that which didn’t hurt them (the Church), instead of showing the truths of those who did hurt them (persons), will be rebuffed, and rightly so, by those who love the Church.

 

[CatsAndDogs]

I think the Pope absolutely had to and should meet with the victims, and the Church deserves the black eye it has recieved because of the scandle. I believe every accused priest should be brought to trial as well as those in leadership positions who knowingly transfered offending priests to other parishes . The church should give up any known or suspected pedifiles to the authorities. In case I have been unclear let me sum-up. No quarter should be given to any child predator, secular or religious. I don’t have any official authority, but as a catholic , I_AM I appologise for what happened to you, for the physical and emotional insult done to you . It’s inexcusable.

The Church qua the Church is not culpable of this sin.

The people of the Church who did these evils should be treated as the scum they are by the temporal authorities in the most harsh way possible, where I agree with you totally.

The Church’s job is to forgive, or not, mostly dependent on the intension of the person having done the evil, but temporal crimes are the business of temporal authorities, and the disposition of the soul of the evil-doer is God’s business.

So, yeah, I agree with you entirely!

 

[AliciaCL]

I think you are very welcome in the RCC. You are indeed someone who has shown great faith to be able to come back to it despite what happened to you. Although it may be difficult for some to hear what happened to you, you are a great tesimony of faith to many others. Welcome back. So sorry for your pain.

 

[I_AM_1]

In my case, the priest was from the Philippines and the local diocese bishop met with him where he confessed, asked for forgiveness and then they let him go. He boarded a plane back to his homeland and hence avoided facing any charges they had against him. It’s been 15 years and he has not been heard from…the authorities know where he is but there is no extradition treaty with the Philippines so they can’t touch him. More than likely he’s still a priest.

The fact that he hasn’t faced charges doesn’t bother me. I know he is human and I know that he made a horrible mistake. What is of a greater offence is how the church has responded to the abuses…they have turned their backs on the victims, seeing them more as a liability than family. God’s family has become dysfunctional and it’s manifesting in patterns of denial, making it easier for family members to continue to hurt one another. Can’t fix a problem if you deny it’s there.

More needs to be done to repair relationships. I am back in the family but I still have a fear of being denied if I tell anyone what happened, why I lost my faith for some any years. Then there’s a part of me that needs to tell…to talk about it and try to work together for a common solution to stop the pattern of abuse and save others from becoming victims or perpetrators…is there a way we can prevent this from happening, in the same manner we prevent accidents from happening in our home? Safety first; proactive response. Are there mechanisms we can put in place to pad the journey a priest makes throughout his life? Can we find the cause for the behavior or maybe environmental factors that contribute for such an abuse to take place?

I have a perspective that not too many people hold. I can see things that others can’t. What I see is a church that will be led out of the darkness by having a strong leader show them the way. We need to stop pointing fingers and seeking revenge or attacking the church or even the priests that have done this to so many…Can we understand why they did it? Can we prevent others from not falling into the same pattern of dysfunction?

I am ready to be a part of the movement and take my place as the lost sheep returning to the flock…my story is one that can lead others back to the church…but again does the church want me?

 

[AliciaCL]

Again, you are welcome in the RCC. That doesn’t mean you won’t encounter some negative responses from people. You’ve been tested at a deeper level than most. You’re a bit like someone who came back from a war and people turn away who are squeamish about the details. The ugliness will always be there. I think work does need to be done. As far as I understand science doesn’t know why people do these things. There may be an orientation, there may be instigation by people who just take a curious peek at child porn and then get sucked in. Who knows? If we knew what caused it, perhaps it could be better addressed. There are some security checks in place but as yet there isn’t a way to identify who has these tendencies. The seminaries need to know and they are trying to find out what persons are not appropriate for priesthood because of this. I would try to get in touch with the people who met the Pope and see if you can find a group which is genuinely trying to help matters rather than make noise and protest.

 

[CatsAndDogs]

I have a perspective that not too many people hold. I can see things that others can’t. What I see is a church that will be led out of the darkness by having a strong leader show them the way. We need to stop pointing fingers and seeking revenge or attacking the church or even the priests that have done this to so many…Can we understand why they did it? Can we prevent others from not falling into the same pattern of dysfunction?

I am ready to be a part of the movement and take my place as the lost sheep returning to the flock…my story is one that can lead others back to the church…but again does the church want me?

Any PERSON who helped another CRIMINALLY RESPONSIBLE PERSON evade proper authority is complicit in the crime commited, and needs to be delivered to the proper authority as regards the crime commited.

We, or at least I, in the Church DEMAND that all those complicit in these crimes (perpetrator and those complicit with the perp) be forgiven and absolved by the Church, in as much as they accept said forgiveness, and then be handed over to the proper authority for prosecution, with any and all evidence of the crime(s) found by ecclesial authorities.

There is NO other way to show true remorse, by the PERSONS in authoritative positions in the Church, than to do this, and nothing short of this will improve the image of the PERSONS in authority in the Church.

“Systemic Transparency” means nothing if you consider the nature of the Church. There is no way to convince anyone that there is a “system” which will guarantee that any criminal acts by PERSONS in the Church will ALWAYS be given to the public.

What we need to do is to make martyrs, or punished dissenters, of those who are guilty of temporal crimes!

 

[I_AM_1]

That’s a really good idea…just putting it out there - does anyone know the name of the group that met with the Pope?

I wrote to the Pope too…about all that has happened and how I feel God wants to use me and my story as a way to help others return to the church. I posted it here but it offended people so quickly that they deleted it. My message and my mission is all about love, compassion, forgiveness, and family. I am not out to hurt anyone, just open their eyes and ask for a hand in helping heal the church, and it’s people.

 

[GraceDK]

In my case, the priest was from the Philippines and the local diocese bishop met with him where he confessed, asked for forgiveness and then they let him go. He boarded a plane back to his homeland and hence avoided facing any charges they had against him. It’s been 15 years and he has not been heard from…the authorities know where he is but there is no extradition treaty with the Philippines so they can’t touch him. More than likely he’s still a priest.

The fact that he hasn’t faced charges doesn’t bother me. I know he is human and I know that he made a horrible mistake. What is of a greater offence is how the church has responded to the abuses…they have turned their backs on the victims, seeing them more as a liability than family. God’s family has become dysfunctional and it’s manifesting in patterns of denial, making it easier for family members to continue to hurt one another. Can’t fix a problem if you deny it’s there.

More needs to be done to repair relationships. I am back in the family but I still have a fear of being denied if I tell anyone what happened, why I lost my faith for some any years. Then there’s a part of me that needs to tell…to talk about it and try to work together for a common solution to stop the pattern of abuse and save others from becoming victims or perpetrators…is there a way we can prevent this from happening, in the same manner we prevent accidents from happening in our home? Safety first; proactive response. Are there mechanisms we can put in place to pad the journey a priest makes throughout his life? Can we find the cause for the behavior or maybe environmental factors that contribute for such an abuse to take place?

I have a perspective that not too many people hold. I can see things that others can’t. What I see is a church that will be led out of the darkness by having a strong leader show them the way. We need to stop pointing fingers and seeking revenge or attacking the church or even the priests that have done this to so many…Can we understand why they did it? Can we prevent others from not falling into the same pattern of dysfunction?

I am ready to be a part of the movement and take my place as the lost sheep returning to the flock…my story is one that can lead others back to the church…but again does the church want me?

WE WANT YOU!

as for child molesting priests… they should be given over to the devil… excommunicated.

 

[I_AM_1]

When this first happened, I was blamed. The sister who had helped our family during a rough period in our lives blamed me for what had happened. “he was a good man. Like a child. and you led him astray. You should feel guilty about what happened…what you did” these were her words. I came to her for comfort and guidance and this is what she said to me.

My mom came to the church because our family was experiencing a lot turmoil. My parents were separated and I had just recently been sexually abused (a “relationship” which lasted over a year beginning when I was 12) by another man who was 15 years my senior. My mom wanted to bring God back into our lives. She went one night to talk to the sister at our neighborhood Catholic church. She reassured my mother that she had done the right thing returning to the church and that she would help take care of the family…lead us on the right path. My mother divulged information of all the trials the family and I had gone through and asked her to help put the pieces of our family and our lives back together.

I was enrolled in CCD classes and then participated in World youth Day in 1993. It’s ironic that the theme for that year was “One Body”; I felt as if I were part of something for the first time…part of a family…part of love…I was peaceful for the first time in my life.

While I was in Denver I talked with the same sister and talked about how I felt God was calling me to become a sister…I wanted to devote my life to God completely. My experiences at such a young age with men left me with such a deep impression on my heart that I felt the only way to fill it was to keep close to God and do his work…in time he would heal me.

It was on the bus back home from my journey towards peace and fulfillment when I was directed down another path by the priest. He offered me a hand but it was not to lift me up nor was not to lift me up; he showed me things but they were nothing to do with God.

All the while he told my Mother how he was counseling me, in preparation of my joining a convent…becoming a sister. Doing the work of God.

What was worse than the rape was the betrayal of the church. I became a social pariah and wasn’t wanted in church. They were angry and they directed it towards me, the victim.

I was lower than low and believed what they said…I led a godly man astray. I was the temptress in their eyes. Evil. Unwelcome in God’s family. – I was just a kid. A confused kid who had already been victimized once before.

Why me out of all the other kids who went on the same trip with the group? My guess is that the sister informed him of my past…maybe that’s why he made his advances. Easy target; will fall fast. I probably had this written on my forehead. Later, I was marked with the scarlet letter to wear on my heart, while time has faded the color of the mark, it’s still visible to those who have eyes to see.

I have stayed away for 15 years. moving from church to church, trying to find my place…a place that felt right. felt like home.

Then I went home…here I am. What will we do to fix this? What will we do to make a difference in the lives of the victims?

 

[the_phoenix]

You are welcome in my book.

Today is St. Antony of Padua’s feast day. Here’s part of what it says about him on the Liturgy of the Hours website:

“His sermons are full of gentleness, but he reproved the wicked with fearless severity – especially backsliding clergy and the oppressors of the weak.”

universalis.com/

St. Antony of Padua, pray for us.

~~ the phoenix

 

[LilyM]

That’s a really good idea…just putting it out there - does anyone know the name of the group that met with the Pope?

I wrote to the Pope too…about all that has happened and how I feel God wants to use me and my story as a way to help others return to the church. I posted it here but it offended people so quickly that they deleted it. My message and my mission is all about love, compassion, forgiveness, and family. I am not out to hurt anyone, just open their eyes and ask for a hand in helping heal the church, and it’s people.

The only thing you did wrong in the last thread was to name a name and to imply that he’d been found guilty which was not the case. Now if this man had either been proven guilty or admitted guilt that would’ve been fine, but remember ‘innocent until proven guilty’ is the only possible rule we can live by as a decent society, so that’s the only reason the thread was deleted.

Think about how damaging unproven allegations are to people - imagine if you’d been in the same boat, having your name smeared without anything other than allegations being offered of the things said about you?

 

[rpp]

I think I am like most in that I do not know exactly what to say or do.

But I certainly do know that you must not be shunned or, in any way, held responsible.

I would not evade or avoid you.

I am certain I do not have to tell you that when children have been sexually abused, as they grow older, all sorts of difficulties happen. The wounds deep and slow to heal as I know you are well aware.

It is up to us who have not been wounded in this manner to reach out and be both welcoming and comforting. I believe most Catholics honestly do feel this way.

However, I think many just do not know what to say or do. Perhaps you can help us learn.

May God grant you His peace.

 

[strngrnrth]

Abusive people sometimes spend a lot of time cultivating others who will protect them. Those people then betray victims so as to keep their “friendships” with people they don’t want to know are abusers. That happens everywhere, not just in the Church. That’s why victim-blaming is so common. So many are more willing to dismiss an innocent victim’s testimony than to acknowledge that someone who has been cultivating them was never a friend. The sister who blamed you sounds like she was just being emotionally self-serving and avoiding the facts, as so many people do. I’m sorry that happened.
I’ve seen many of the most attention-grabbing people in the old “cool” crowd abuse their wives, girlfriends, roommates and children, and hurt all the people around them one at a time until finally after many years people stop trying to justify them. The allure of being friends with someone “big” in the scene overpowered their sense of right and wrong or even their sense of reality. The victims were avoided or mocked by people who would never think that’s what they were doing, because they rationalized away what happened. They said things like, “She does nag him and he’s under a lot of pressure,” or, “You don’t know what it’s like trying to drag those little kids around. Don’t judge,” or, “She’s sensitive. She shouldn’t hang out if she doesn’t know how to take care of herself,” or, “I had a good time. I don’t know why you didn’t,” or, “Hey, she’s experimenting and I support that. I don’t know how you can be sure it’s bad for the kids. Maybe it teaches them something.” So victims were rarely even heard. I learned that the best thing to do is forget the people who aren’t there for you and find someone to talk to who is. Don’t give up. I believe you.

 

[Mekio]

:hug3: You are definitely welcome at Home, even if it seems that some of our brothers and sisters (including me) have not warmed up to you yet. Thank God that you’re back!

 

[I_AM_1]

This priest did confess to the bishop; The bishop told me himself. There were pictures taken of my during the acts he committed against me that are sitting in the hands of the police. There are motel receipts showing that the rooms were rented by him and the motel headboards in the pictures he took of me (which were found in his residence on the church grounds among his personal items). There is still a million dollar bounty on his head and a warrant out for his arrest. There is a civil suit against him that holds him personally liable for his actions against me. This is not a false accusation…it is true. It’s more than just hearsay - there’s proof.

I realize that everyone is innocent until proven guilty. I see your point. Hence i am not mentioning names this time. There are countless news articles that have his name and he is a registered sex offender, along with being among the long list of priest sex offenders.

A few years ago I was asked if I still wanted to prosecute him for what he did. They know where he is and they are working on an extradition treaty with the Philippines. My heart is and never has been bent on revenge. I don’t want to see him hurt or locked away in prison. I don’t want him to suffer. I do want to meet with him and talk about what happened…why it happened….to tell him I forgive him…and that he can’t hurt me any more. I am at peace. I pray that he hasn’t repeated this offence with another young person. I pray that he is happy and that he has risen about the mistakes he’s made.

It took me a long while to feel comfortable even going to church and seeing a priest. I had an even harder time bringing my girls to church…I felt as if I were bringing my lambs in to slaughter…to sacrifice.

 

[LilyM]

This priest did confess to the bishop; The bishop told me himself. There were pictures taken of my during the acts he committed against me that are sitting in the hands of the police. There are motel receipts showing that the rooms were rented by him and the motel headboards in the pictures he took of me (which were found in his residence on the church grounds among his personal items). There is still a million dollar bounty on his head and a warrant out for his arrest. There is a civil suit against him that holds him personally liable for his actions against me. This is not a false accusation…it is true. It’s more than just hearsay - there’s proof.

I realize that everyone is innocent until proven guilty. I see your point. Hence i am not mentioning names this time. There are countless news articles that have his name and he is a registered sex offender, along with being among the long list of priest sex offenders.

A few years ago I was asked if I still wanted to prosecute him for what he did. They know where he is and they are working on an extradition treaty with the Philippines. My heart is and never has been bent on revenge. I don’t want to see him hurt or locked away in prison. I don’t want him to suffer. I do want to meet with him and talk about what happened…why it happened….to tell him I forgive him…and that he can’t hurt me any more. I am at peace. I pray that he hasn’t repeated this offence with another young person. I pray that he is happy and that he has risen about the mistakes he’s made.

It took me a long while to feel comfortable even going to church and seeing a priest. I had an even harder time bringing my girls to church…I felt as if I were bringing my lambs in to slaughter…to sacrifice.

The Bishop told you that he confessed? Then he committed a grave sin and broke the seal of confession by doing so. See a penitent confesses to Christ and not really to the priest, so the information is between the penitent and God alone, and is no business of anyone else’s to reveal.

No priest, on pain of grave sin, can ever reveal ANYONE’S confession to anyone else. Besides which, it still doesn’t constitute proof of his guilt. It could well be hearsay evidence only.

And how is he a registered sex offender, with no finding of guilt ever having been made against him and no sex offence ever having been proven against him? Sounds fishy and sounds like an abuse of government power. He has a right to have the charges against himself properly prosecuted and tried and his guilt or innocence finally determined before being labelled as a sex offender.

And let me make clear - evidence in a civil case does not constitute proof of guilt - only a finding by judge or jury or a properly obtained and recorded confession in such a case constitutes proof.

I know I sound very critical, and I don’t mean to - but the fact is an improperly substantiated claim of abuse against a potentially innocent man is incredibly harmful to that man, and his reputation has to be respected until the charge against him is properly examined by actual prosecution, even though an unprosecuted incidence of child abuse is at least every bit as harmful.