Are we the lepers of our time?

[Verisimilitude]

What will we do to make a difference in the lives of the victims?

Each victim is different and so are those who violate them. Though the abuser should be forced into the light without exception when known, the abused should not be at any time. Some prefer to remain discrete and make their changes silently.

You must have come to some conclusions and reconciled the differences between guilt from sin and guilt from shame to be where you are emotionally and spiritually. You are to be applauded- congratulations.

Your story is sad and not unfamiliar to many if not exact. The seeming hypocicy of the Church/other authorities and the obvious/repetetive human frailty is hard to rationalize as a young person much less the older and more experienced in life. It’s a hard lesson to learn about self and others.

Just so I am clear, are you speaking about reaching out to other victims like yourself or is it more inclusive to all victims of abuse, and/or the prevention of future abuses? A combination of all?

 

[Cara_Serrano]

Lepers are shunned because they have visible wounds. I imagine that no one would know of your wounds unless you told them. You are courageous in telling your story. I am sorry that some Catholics have shunned you for it.

 

[I_AM_1]

Just so I am clear, are you speaking about reaching out to other victims like yourself or is it more inclusive to all victims of abuse, and/or the prevention of future abuses? A combination of all

In response to the above quote:

I am speaking about a great movement that I feel is on the verge of taking place in the church…the Pope has already begun it by meeting with some survivors of abuse and addressing the issue. I feel I am being called to participate on a great level…to help the victims return to the church and work together with the church on helping stop future abuses of power…I feel I would be traveling and meeting with leaders of the church and using my story to help lead others home as I have come home. Call me crazy or call me filled with the conviction of the holy spirit but I am moved to do such things. My only hope is that the church is just as willing to walk with me on making a difference in the lives of its people.

 

[Pong]

The Bishop told you that he confessed? Then he committed a grave sin and broke the seal of confession by doing so.

Only if the priest in question confessed within the sacrament of reconcilliation. The OP may have been using the phrase “he confessed” in the secular sense. But I’m right with you, LilyM. Something sounds a bit amiss about the way this whole thing is being handled. :ehh:

 

[Trishie]

I am truly sorry you have been harmed by someone whom you had the right to trust. God please preserve the Church from those who would be judas amongst your priests and religious.
I ask the gentle healing of God in all who have been abused or raped by priests or religious. I ask true repentance and apology from those who have offended. And I thank God that there is more accountability in this present day. I would give you the biggest hug if I could…may Jesus embrace you and all who have been hurt like this. GOD BLESS YOU. Trishie

 

[I_AM_1]

I wanted to clarify when I said he confessed, it was not in a confessional. My mother had become aware of what was happening and notified the bishop before she called the police. He then talked with the priest and did not notify the authorities. In that conversation he “confessed” when he was confronted with the allegations about sexual abuse and misconduct with a minor (me). The bishop then let him go. My mother was the first to notify the police, not the bishop and by that time the priest was already back in his homeland – never facing the charges against him. The bishop who talked with him and ultimately let him go later were facing charges of his own of sexual misconduct…maybe he was sympathetic to the priest because of his own personal experience. No matter. The past cannot be changed…

What can we do now? What can we do as a church to help those who have been victimized by priests and keep it from happening again (to the best of our ability)?

I am here to help those who have had a similar experience and have lost their faith; faith in God, the church, and its people. I am here to help heal the church. I feel God is calling me to do this…to lead people back to the church.

Currently, I am becoming part of the third order with the Dominicans. When I was first abused, it was under the pretext that I was being counseled by the priest on my wanting to join a convent – I wanted to devote my life to God fully. I felt a calling. After I was abused and raped, I was quickly pushed out of the church by the very sister who inspired me. The church turned their backs on me, blaming me for what happened. This was worse than the rape.

Maybe we can’t stop all abuse of power, but we can change how we treat the victims and how we deal with those who abuse their positions of power and trust.

Justice and peace…I am seeking to help heal the church. I am looking for direction…anyone who feels they can guide me to where I need to be please speak up. Thank you for your help and support. It is nice to be part of the body of Christ once again; it’s time to do His work.

 

[GraceDK]

I wanted to clarify when I said he confessed, it was not in a confessional. My mother had become aware of what was happening and notified the bishop before she called the police. He then talked with the priest and did not notify the authorities. In that conversation he “confessed” when he was confronted with the allegations about sexual abuse and misconduct with a minor (me). The bishop then let him go. My mother was the first to notify the police, not the bishop and by that time the priest was already back in his homeland – never facing the charges against him. The bishop who talked with him and ultimately let him go later were facing charges of his own of sexual misconduct…maybe he was sympathetic to the priest because of his own personal experience. No matter. The past cannot be changed…

What can we do now? What can we do as a church to help those who have been victimized by priests and keep it from happening again (to the best of our ability)?

I am here to help those who have had a similar experience and have lost their faith; faith in God, the church, and its people. I am here to help heal the church. I feel God is calling me to do this…to lead people back to the church.

Currently, I am becoming part of the third order with the Dominicans. When I was first abused, it was under the pretext that I was being counseled by the priest on my wanting to join a convent – I wanted to devote my life to God fully. I felt a calling. After I was abused and raped, I was quickly pushed out of the church by the very sister who inspired me. The church turned their backs on me, blaming me for what happened. This was worse than the rape.

Maybe we can’t stop all abuse of power, but we can change how we treat the victims and how we deal with those who abuse their positions of power and trust.

Justice and peace…I am seeking to help heal the church. I am looking for direction…anyone who feels they can guide me to where I need to be please speak up. Thank you for your help and support. It is nice to be part of the body of Christ once again; it’s time to do His work.

Dear sister in Jesus.
One advice… I think people like you are needed… But maybe you should get an education in psychology and counselling to prepare you to meet and talk with other victims.

Grace

 

[I_AM_1]

I have an education in Social Science (BA). I am going back for my MA in ESL/ELL. I am bilingual: english and spanish. I will go for my doctorate after my MA in psychology…I am on my way.

 

[TheDoctor]

…There is still a million dollar bounty on his head and a warrant out for his arrest. There is a civil suit against him that holds him personally liable for his actions against me. This is not a false accusation…it is true. It’s more than just hearsay - there’s proof…A few years ago I was asked if I still wanted to prosecute him for what he did. They know where he is and they are working on an extradition treaty with the Philippines…

I read this twice and something did not ring true so I looked it up. The United States has had an extradition treaty with the Philippines since 1996 and covers all offenses (with some standard exceptions like diplomatic immunity) where the accused would face jail time in each country exceeding one year, which seems to be your case.

If there really is a current arrest warrant, you should immediately seek the DA to begin legal extradition. They should not hide behind an allegation of “no treaty”. Unfortunately, I do not belive you can use the treaty to bring him back to face civil proceeding, but it is your right to ask the riding DA what the status of the case is.

manila.usembassy.gov/wwwhoff2.html

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties

 

[I_AM_1]

I read this twice and something did not ring true so I looked it up. The United States has had an extradition treaty with the Philippines since 1996 and covers all offenses (with some standard exceptions like diplomatic immunity) where the accused would face jail time in each country exceeding one year, which seems to be your case.

If there really is a current arrest warrant, you should immediately seek the DA to begin legal extradition. They should not hide behind an allegation of “no treaty”. Unfortunately, I do not belive you can use the treaty to bring him back to face civil proceeding, but it is your right to ask the riding DA what the status of the case is.

manila.usembassy.gov/wwwhoff2.html

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties

Last time the DA ocntacted me was back in 2000 I believe (I was already married andhad kids by then). They had found him but the couldn’t touch him yet because they were still working on the treaty…I don’t know the logistics of it but I know he was still at large…

I am not even sure I would prosecute any longer…the only reason why I would is if he continued to do what he did to me with other underage girls. He might have changed his ways. I have forgiven him and hope he is doing well, serving God.

 

[LilyM]

I read this twice and something did not ring true so I looked it up. The United States has had an extradition treaty with the Philippines since 1996 and covers all offenses (with some standard exceptions like diplomatic immunity) where the accused would face jail time in each country exceeding one year, which seems to be your case.

If there really is a current arrest warrant, you should immediately seek the DA to begin legal extradition. They should not hide behind an allegation of “no treaty”. Unfortunately, I do not belive you can use the treaty to bring him back to face civil proceeding, but it is your right to ask the riding DA what the status of the case is.

manila.usembassy.gov/wwwhoff2.html

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties

The only real issue I would see would be if there was insufficient evidence to prosecute a criminal case against him maybe? Remember the burden of proof is higher for criminal than civil cases.

 

[LilyM]

Last time the DA ocntacted me was back in 2000 I believe (I was already married andhad kids by then). They had found him but the couldn’t touch him yet because they were still working on the treaty…I don’t know the logistics of it but I know he was still at large…

I am not even sure I would prosecute any longer…the only reason why I would is if he continued to do what he did to me with other underage girls. He might have changed his ways. I have forgiven him and hope he is doing well, serving God.

You have a duty to protect those other children with whom he comes in contact. It’s unlikely in the extreme that he’s stopped his behaviour - seems to me he has had no reason to. Facing charges would provide such a reason.

For their sake you must press for a prosecution.

 

[I_AM_1]

My Mother tried to protect me when she notified the authorities…the church let him get away. They gave him ample time to escape and failed to contact authorities after they found out about the abuse from his own mouth. Shouldn’t the church help me bring him to justice? Wouldn’t that be a step in the right direction? I realize that it’s civil law that he will be judged by and that the DA will have to do the extradition process, but why isn’t the church helping to bring him to justice? For all I know he is still serving as a priest in the Philippines, his home country. Why can’t they help the DA find him?

If the church supported the victims and showed support of bringing abusers to justice (not just talked and apologized but actually did something), this would show a significant change for the better within the church in dealing with cases of priest abuse. This would actually be a way that they could take a stand and finally do the right thing, instead of moving them from parish to parish to abuse again or hiding them so they don’t face punishment or bring shame or scandal to the church on a grand scale. Having the church stand next to me and help me bring him in would show whose side they are on and would help other victims return to the church…maybe this is what I’m supposed to be a part of…a shake down of the church; cleansing of the blood, purification of the body of Christ; Finally seeking treatment for the cancer that is eating away at the body after so many years of denial and cover-up.

Anyone who can help within the church, please contact me…I am here to help heal from within. I can see how this can make a dramatic impact - a positive impact and statement for our church and the reputation that has been so badly damaged because of priest abuse and cover-ups. You’re right…I should bring him to justice…we the church should do that together. How about it?

 

[Michael_Neal]

This is one of the biggest problems I have had with the Church for a long time. I simply do not understand why they covered for these people for so long. It makes me wonder how many pedophiles are in leadership positions in the Church.

I don’t understand why Pope John Paul II did nothing, while I think he was a wonderful man, this is one area where his leadership was seriously lacking. It should not have taken this long for the Vatican to recognize the victims.

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

Quote from I_AM
Can we understand why they did it? Can we prevent others from not falling into the same pattern of dysfunction?

The thing that has to be remembered, in my own opinion, is that priests are men. They are human. Those that have the tendency toward pedophilia because of a childhood or adolescent evil done to them should be honest about it. Wouldn’t that help them, and any chance of any future victims, stay safe? Wouldn’t that help them to get all of the help that they need in order to change the evil tendencies? Yes, it would. It would also cause them to be shunned by society. And that is not fair if they have only been victimized but have not victimized any one else. But, at some point, the victims need to stop thinking as victims in order for them to keep from becoming perpetrators. Which means that they are called to a MIRACULOUS courage, and admit how they are truly feeling inside, how their tendencies are leading them to be perpetrators of the same evil that made them victims to begin with.
I believe that there should be priests that are specially trained to deal with this sort of thing, and they can counsel victims and those who feel the tendencies to victimize others through the Sacrament of Penance. BUT…BUT…BUT there should be a signed contract between said priest and those that he counsels that says that if the counselor/priest believes that the person is in danger of hurting or victimizing anyone, something more serious should be done. That cannot happen, because what is said between the priest and the penitent in the Sacrament of Penance is, without exception, private. And I agree with that!! So maybe the priests could offer just counseling outside of the Confessional.
That might help us to understand them, and maybe help them to heal.
Should those with evil tendencies toward pedophilia become priests? That question has been asked. I think that, because all priests are called to be celibate and pure and chaste, the answer would be yes. But special circumstances must be made. They should not be a priest in a parish. They should join a monastary where they will not have a chance to fall into that particular sin, as it brings about such horrible consequences. It is not worth taking any chances.
The priest who molested you, he is still molesting young boys unless he has been forced by death or a higher authority in government or the Church to stop. He has not stopped on his own. That is the nature of a pedophile. He victimizes boys or girls of a certain age…probably the age he himself was when he was victimized. But children and adolescents grow up. What the perpetrator feels is not love, simply by the nature in which, when the child or adolescent passes a certain point in maturity, they drop the person and look for someone in the phase of maturity that they are attracted to. That they continue to have to look for more victims is one of the most evil things about this. It is a serial crime, and its base is sexual…the strongest drive in our human nature. It is a crime that is generational and will not be stopped by one’s own strength.
Let me say this right now: Not all those who are victimized become perpetrators!!! What makes the difference between those who become perpetrators, and those who do not? To me, that is the mystery to finding out how to help them. I think that it is more than just a personal decision not to become a perpetrator. I mean, not all victims will feel the tendencies. So, as I asked, what makes the difference?
I am so filled with joy that Pope Benedict XVI sat and spoke with victims, and showed that their suffering at the hands of Church representatitives is important. That they, as individuals, as victims, as humans, as children of God, as those loved by Jesus are very important…all the way up to the Vicar of Christ’s Church. It shows the love of Christ.
I hope it helps bring them back into the fold. I am truly offended that you all have been ostracized, but it doesn’t suprise me. Unfortunatly, that is the tendencies of humans…even Christian humans…though not those who are looking to follow exactly Christ Jesus’ example. Those who should have loved you all the more were the ones who rejected you. I, too, express sorrow for your pain…mostly at the hands of Christians who were not Christians in their manner and love. It seems that as for the abuse you suffered by the priest, it has been forgiven…which is divine. And I praise You, Jesus, that You have given this person the graces to forgive.
What we are called to do, all of us, very much is to pray for our priests so that they do not fall into sin…especially serious sin.
God bless you and yours,
Cherie

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

Only if the priest in question confessed within the sacrament of reconcilliation. The OP may have been using the phrase “he confessed” in the secular sense. But I’m right with you, LilyM. Something sounds a bit amiss about the way this whole thing is being handled. :ehh:

What about it sounds fishy or amiss. She went to the bishop, the priest admitted to being guilty and apologized. Then the bishop sent him to the Phillipines to get him out of the area…as was done so many numerous amounts of times by bishops with molesters. The authorities were notified, and, because of the physical evidence found proving this priests guilt, there is a warrant sworn out for his arrest. There is a bounty on his head for his return and face the charges. And he is probably named on the lists of many perpetrators who run from prosecution, but are still guilty, or accused with much evidence against them of child molestation. What is fishy about this story? I don’t understand. That he has not been found guilty in a court of law because he has run away and was faster than the authorities were does not make him innocent until proven guilty. That he stands accused with so much concrete evidence against him, and that he ran, proves that he is guilty…trial or no trial. And I, for one, would love that to see the list of the sexual perpetrators that are priests for two purposes: one, to pray for each one individually; and two, to protect my children from them. But that is neither here nor there, because that is not nearly important. I must pray for all priests, and I must be vigilent in protecting my children from all people.

May God bless you and yours,
Cherie

 

[LilyM]

What about it sounds fishy or amiss. She went to the bishop, the priest admitted to being guilty and apologized. Then the bishop sent him to the Phillipines to get him out of the area…as was done so many numerous amounts of times by bishops with molesters. The authorities were notified, and, because of the physical evidence found proving this priests guilt, there is a warrant sworn out for his arrest. There is a bounty on his head for his return and face the charges. And he is probably named on the lists of many perpetrators who run from prosecution, but are still guilty, or accused with much evidence against them of child molestation. What is fishy about this story? I don’t understand. That he has not been found guilty in a court of law because he has run away and was faster than the authorities were does not make him innocent until proven guilty. That he stands accused with so much concrete evidence against him, and that he ran, proves that he is guilty…trial or no trial. And I, for one, would love that to see the list of the sexual perpetrators that are priests for two purposes: one, to pray for each one individually; and two, to protect my children from them. But that is neither here nor there, because that is not nearly important. I must pray for all priests, and I must be vigilent in protecting my children from all people.

May God bless you and yours,
Cherie

Because when it boils down to it evidence can be manufactured and allegations made up, and people wrongly accused and charged. That’s why we have a trial process in the first place, because evidence and allegations- and even charges - need to be PROVEN and sifted before a person can be pronounced guilty.

Yes he fled, people tend to flee from difficult things that they wish not to go through, like trials in general, and not just crimes of which they are guilty. Lord knows I’ve gone through some drastic measures in my time to avoid much less horrible things than a trial! Fleeing is NOT evidence of guilt.

As for putting him on the registered sex offender list - would you REALLY want your name to be there - your life destroyed, which such listing surely does - merely because you were accused of being a sex offender with no trial and no actual finding of guilt against you? Surely not.

 

[I_AM_1]

Just to let you know, if it hasn’t come to your attention already, I am a woman, not a man. Often times we associate Priest Abuse with boys and not girls. Maybe this is another issue we need to address.

Also, the priest who abused me did have problems with keeping his celibacy vows as he had had an affair with a woman at another parish before he molested and raped me. This information comes from church records of the incident; their answer to addressing the issue as to move him around to another parish…then he came to mine.

Could it have been stopped if they had dealt with him differently? Yes. I believe it could have. We will never know for sure.

I’m not here to rant on what could or should have been done to protect me; I want to focus on the now. What can we do now to protect our flock from wolves that are hiding among us in sheep’s clothing?

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

Because when it boils down to it evidence can be manufactured and allegations made up, and people wrongly accused and charged. That’s why we have a trial process in the first place, because evidence and allegations- and even charges - need to be PROVEN and sifted before a person can be pronounced guilty.

Yes he fled, people tend to flee from difficult things that they wish not to go through, like trials in general, and not just crimes of which they are guilty. Lord knows I’ve gone through some drastic measures in my time to avoid much less horrible things than a trial! Fleeing is NOT evidence of guilt.

As for putting him on the registered sex offender list - would you REALLY want your name to be there - your life destroyed, which such listing surely does - merely because you were accused of being a sex offender with no trial and no actual finding of guilt against you? Surely not.

Ya know, looking back over my post, maybe I sounded harsh. It’s just that you all were calling I_AM’s words “fishy”, as if they were unbelievable. I understand the concept “guilty until proven innocent”, but she was not asking us to try the priest in question or to determine his guilt or innocence. She is trying to find a way for healing, not only for herself and other victims, but for the priests who are perpetrators. She feels called to use her past pain and hurt, caused by a priest and a nun, to help others. She has felt ostracized by those who should have loved her, but she is still trying to do good things among them, for that is what she feels called by Christ to do.
My heart was just hurting for her because her story was being called “fishy”. I have someone very close to me who was molested, though not by a priest. I know for a fact that it happened, but even after he admitted his guilt, there were people who were trying to find holes in the victim’s story. The reason for this…they felt horribly lost thinking that someone that they felt such strong love for, who seemed to be so vehemently against this crime, actually became a perpetrator himself. As I said, I know that he is guilty, and not just because of his admission of guilt. So I have heard people use the word “fishy” to try to tear apart the world of a 7 year old little girl. Her story wasn’t fishy, and she is the most couragous person I will probably ever know to come out and tell the truth…knowing that the man that she loved so very much would be locked in a cage for a long time when she told. I thank God for giving her such courage. And I thank God that the people who, for their own comfort, called her story “fishy” were not the ones who had the responsibility of finding him guilty…as he is guilty.
People must remember that, when it comes to something which violates a human soul so very horribly, we must look to the victim first.

 

[GraceDK]

Ya know, looking back over my post, maybe I sounded harsh. It’s just that you all were calling I_AM’s words “fishy”, as if they were unbelievable. I understand the concept “guilty until proven innocent”, but she was not asking us to try the priest in question or to determine his guilt or innocence. (…)of his admission of guilt. So I have heard people use the word “fishy” to try to tear apart the world of a 7 year old little girl. Her story wasn’t fishy, and she is the most couragous person I will probably ever know to come out and tell the truth…knowing that the man that she loved so very much would be locked in a cage for a long time when she told. I thank God for giving her such courage. And I thank God that the people who, for their own comfort, called her story “fishy” were not the ones who had the responsibility of finding him guilty…as he is guilty.
People must remember that, when it comes to something which violates a human soul so very horribly, we must look to the victim first.

Amen and Amen again.

When a person comes and tells us she has been molested then it can be highly destructive to tell her: “We would rather not believe you… you are talking about a priest etc…” This is the last respons the victim needs to hear from the Church… we are the church.
In these fora we believe what people say about their experiences in so many areas… why not this one? We know thousands of children have been molested and that behind each molestation there is a child who was crying who was not heard at the time of the abuse.

These priests should be put to justice and be prohibited to serve as priests anymore.
And sadly, we as lay people have to keep an open eye at all times…

Many of you say the Church is not to blame. I find that problematic. At other times we will choose to say: “the Church is where the bishop is”. When a bishop covers pedofiles then the Church as a whole has a gigantic problem.