Are wealthy countries in anyway responsible to lift poor countries out of poverty?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Rozellelily
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I’m guessing this is sarcasm.
The rich individually always have a responsibility to help the poor (as agreed upon by Catholic doctrine) but with my question I’m referring more to wealthy countries as opposed to wealthy individuals.
 
Nah… wealthy countries where people buy Mercedes and BMWs should never freely donate to starving children in Africa… instead, they should donate to dog pounds… bill gates has it all wrong by helping the poor in Africa
 
I know the bible says to,but realistically how can people give if they are in poverty themselves?
Eg:they already might be under great stress how they will feed their kids and pay the rent and bills and giving to the chiurch or charity might take away from this even more and cause more stress.
 
Why not do both? Do we have to hate dogs in order to really love staving children?
 
Sadly,there already are some people who would rather donate to dog pounds rather than poor humans in Africa or other poor countries.

I’m all for animal welfare,but some people have taken it “next level” where they seem to almost hold animals as higher than people.
 
Rozellelily said:
I know the bible says to,but realistically how can people give if they are in poverty themselves?
Eg:they already might be under great stress how they will feed their kids and pay the rent and bills and giving to the chiurch or charity might take away from this even more and cause more stress.
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There are only a few places the bible where the Lord gives permission to ‘try HIm’…these involve tithing and money, and HIs promise is for abundance in return. What is it that you don’t trust? Have you ever been failed?
 
If you want to lift poor countries out of poverty >

Teach math.

And reading & writing.

In some poor countries, poor parents pay for tutors to teach computer programming to their children to allow their next generation to “become Bill Gates”. [And as an investment for the parents in THEIR senior years.]

I worked in these places for decades … and the resistance to learning anything different is mind-blowing.

Or even to see what works in other countries.

Someone just now got a couple of African countries to try using peanuts as peanut butter.

I posted it on another thread.
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Plumpy'Nut: The lifesaver that costs... well, peanuts World News
NOW … here’s a source of food whose harvesting would likely not discomfit anyone: The location was in or near Hong Kong. Harvest these feral hogs. Cook well to avoid trichinosis.
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It was resisted for many decades.

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/arachide


Peanuts grow well in southern Mali and adjacent regions of the Ivory Coast, Burkina Faso, Ghana, Nigeria, and Senegal; peanuts are similar in both agricultural and culinary qualities to the Bambara groundnut native to the region, and West Africans have adopted the crop as a staple. Peanut sauce, prepared with onions, garlic, peanut butter/paste, and vegetables such as carrots, cabbage, and cauliflower, can be vegetarian (the peanuts supplying ample protein) or prepared with meat, usually chicken.

Peanuts are used in the Malian meat stew maafe . In Ghana, peanut butter is used for peanut butter soup nkate nkwan .[37] Crushed peanuts may also be used for peanut candies nkate cake and kuli-kuli , as well as other local foods such as oto .[37] Peanut butter is an ingredient in Nigeria’s “African salad”. Peanut powder is an important ingredient in the spicy coating for kebabs in Nigeria and Ghana.
 
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Rozellelily said:
Sadly,there already are some people who would rather donate to dog pounds rather than poor humans in Africa or other poor countries.

I’m all for animal welfare,but some people have taken it “next level” where they seem to almost hold animals as higher than people.
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Yes … some people regard animals as their “children”.
 

It was dubbed the wonder product that “may just be the most important advance ever” when it comes to battling acute child hunger. Now the life-saving peanut paste, first trialled during a famine in Niger eight years ago, is reaching two million of the world’s most severely malnourished children a year.

The beauty of Plumpy’Nut, which was once said to be as important as the discovery of penicillin, is in its simplicity. The high-energy peanut-based paste, invented by a crusading French paediatrician, includes skimmed milk powder, sugar, vegetable fat and vitamins and minerals. It does not need clean water to swallow; it does not need to be cooked or refrigerated, and it stays fresh after opening. It can also be given to any child in the most advanced stage of malnutrition, anywhere, by anyone.

Experts say the paste has “radically” changed the care of severely malnourished children in developing countries. Importantly, it has allowed them to be treated in their homes, rather than in hospitals, and it has “drastically” reduced their mortality rates. Now, with increased supply in the developing world, experts suggest that Plumpy’Nut, alongside generic versions of the product, could become Africa’s “home-grown” cure for severe acute malnutrition. It could even, they add, be used to prevent it. This is no small feat: malnutrition is a major killer of children under five, accounting for around one million deaths annually, but affecting an estimated 20 million children worldwide.
 
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RCIAGraduate said:
Yes but isn’t much of the world basically living on substance level; that doesn’t seem to conducive to self actualization and the fulfillment of human potential. I can concede that the US probably can’t solve all the world’s problems but if we had the political will (as well as possibly focus since one can only be stretched so thin), I believe we can make a substantial dent. I know this is a fantastical dreaming but imagine if NGOs and the like were treated similarly to our Department of Defense? I do think considering the many peoples benefiting from USAID (thanks in part due to generous exchange rates), our foreign aid dollars do provide a bang for our buck.
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Self actualizing the third world is not our goal, nor is it viable. We can’t actualize our own citizens.

Yes, USAID resources have greatly helping in increasing Ag production and sharing knowledge to improve basic healthcare. Such support is low cost and high return.
 
Honestly ,yes I’ve been failed.
I’ve also witnessed Christians from other denominations who were told that God blesses those who give abundantly so they sold what little they had or gave what little money they had and then ended up in great poverty without God “blessing” them (financially) in the end.
 
I just read the article about Plumpy Nut,thanks.
It sounds like a great product and it is extremely sad to hear the manufacturing company has applied for a patent so that only they can create malnutritional paste foods and even prevented other companies from sending their own products to Africa.
Surely in a situation like this,a moral company would not put profits before lifesaving treating, and why didn’t the Government who they applied for the patent make an exemption that products like this should remain unpatentable so that other companies could also manufacture and supply similar products?
 
Even if it’s a case that the figures are overblown,there are still children that are dying or sick due to malnutrition.
Interestingly,even in countries like Australia there are some people who are forced to be “vegetarian not by choice” due to not being able to afford meat (particularly red meats) on a regular basis and having to choose between paying their rent or buying meats.
 
Rozellelily said:
Even if it’s a case that the figures are overblown,there are still children that are dying or sick due to malnutrition.
Interestingly,even in countries like Australia there are some people who are forced to be “vegetarian not by choice” due to not being able to afford meat (particularly red meats) on a regular basis and having to choose between paying their rent or buying meats.
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Sorry but I believe in Subsidiarity. Australia is more than capable of caring for their people, they don’t need my money. If you took the time to read the article I supplied, you’ll see the BBC concurred that where there is a problem, it tends to be in countries that are stable and more than economically capable of feeding their people.

If you think we need to fund Public Service Announcements in these countries, reminding them to care for their neighbor, I’m on board. But that’s it. My own time and money is focused on people that need help near me.
 
I’m definitely not suggesting that people should donate to Australia/s (!),I was just using that as an example that if people can sometimes find the cost of living unmanageable even in the “first world”,to imagine then the realities of people in third world countries.

The Plumpy Nut product is distributed in countries like Kenya and Uganda.Would you not consider those countries relatively unstable?

Even in countries that are stable such as India or Bulgaria there can be lack of jobs due to corruption,Government money mismanagement,and lack of industry creation.
The only thing the poor citizens can really do is protest and try to change the government,but until then they are stuck in poverty.

Charity is good on an individual level but it doesn’t solve the problem on a wide scale level,so isn’t it better if wealthier countries tried to create industry and infrastructure in those poorer countries to provide jobs for them?
To me it seems like a win win solution because jobs are created and also the wealthier country benefits from the sales.
For example China is investing in the Pacific and African countries.
Clearly this is self serving motivation,but regardless,doesn’t it boost those poorer countries economies too?
 
No.

Peanuts / groundnuts grow “everywhere”.

For hundreds of years.

3,000 years …


But locals in Africa have refused to grind them up to make peanut butter.

They believe or used to believe it needed refrigeration.

They believed it was impossible.

VEHEMENTLY opposed.

I had a big “discussion” with them [Minister of Agriculture] 40 years ago.

They just dug in their heels.

No amount of persuasion.

Local culture.

The first peanut-based RUTF, Plumpy’Nut, was developed jointly in 1996 by the French Institute of Research for Development and the manufacturer Nutriset. Clocking in at 500 calories per packet, the high-energy paste consisted of peanuts, oil, sugar, milk powder, and vitamin and mineral supplements, providing all the nutrients required for recovery from severe acute malnutrition. Most importantly however, it was formulated to have a long shelf life and didn’t need to be mixed with clean water. Another key innovation: it could be eaten straight from the packet, no cooking required.

Nothing to do with patents.

“Cultural refusal”.

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgur...hUKEwi05__g69_cAhXRV98KHYK3BxUQ_B0wE3oECAkQCQ

Call it a “paste” instead of “butter” perhaps.


click here google youtube peanut paste

Australia: https://australianfoodtimeline.com.au/peanut-butter-ban/

There was a photo of some locals who actually made it themselves by pounding the nuts in a “pestle”.

similar to this, as with yams.


click here google you tube pestle

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=peanut+paste

Very quick and easy.


https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/ornamental/vines/groundnut-vine/how-to-grow-groundnuts.htm


Getting people to accept a strange new food … even though locally grown … is a major cultural battle … peanut butter! for goodness sake!
 
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Rozellelily said:
Honestly ,yes I’ve been failed.
I’ve also witnessed Christians from other denominations who were told that God blesses those who give abundantly so they sold what little they had or gave what little money they had and then ended up in great poverty without God “blessing” them (financially) in the end.
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The greatest blessings I’ve had have never been financial. True, I’m not rich but have never been hungry…or have not had a place to lay my head. I’ve also been the richer for reading JPII on topics such as consumerism and D. Day entering ‘into’ the poverty of Christ!~ as I type on computer keyboards there are others that do not have clean water this morning to drink. Reverting to my first sentence, the prosperity Gospel that is preached is faulty in so many ways. Regarding this topic Christianity spreads when people can look at what was said in the first century after Christ, and apply it to today…“See how they love one another”
 
Sorry,I should have posted the link regarding the patent issue.
There are or were patent issues but that doesn’t neglect the reality that there may also be cultural barrIers to acceptance because,as you mentioned,Africans could grow peanuts themselves and turn them into paste .
Unfortunately,sometimes certain ‘ignorant’ mentalities come with poverty and these mentalities can be hard to challenge.
For example I can tell my own mother it’s not good to eat fatty foods as it can clog the arteries and cause heart disease but she will not fully believe me or will down play it.

Sometimes the “attitudal factors” can be just a great a challenge as the actual poverty.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8610427.stm
 
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