As a former cradle Catholic, I have found many Protestant churches much more welcomin

[Future_Prodigy]

I hate to say it but you have let protestantism seep into your catholic faith. Catholicism has always understood itself to be set within the idea of a communal setting. You are speaking like it is you, the Mass and Christ… thats all that matters, nothing else!

 

[Future_Prodigy]

I may not know Anglicanism inside and out, .

well at least you admit your own ignorance… thats a start. So before you start your triumphalism BS maybe you should learn about other traditions before claiming your own as the ABSOLUTE TRUTH, for how can you claim it without knowing the oposition!

 

[Freshman88]

Ok, Freshman, breathe…breathe.

How will we ever reunite with our separated brethren if we refuse to associate with them?

I’ve taken my breath and I apologize for a lack of charity.
But I stand by my point.

I think ecumenicism is good. It is a scandal that we are not united. But ecumenicism can only go as far as common prayer, explaining each others faiths and engaging in charitable projects together that aim at bettering humanity. It’s when we begin to “worship” together that I have problems. I have a problem when ecumenicism seems to have the suggestion in certain circles, that we should be willing to sacrifice some of our faith or Tradition for the sake of ecumenicism. The Truth is too important to give it up for anything. I know Unitatis Redintegratio allows for common worship, but it also warns that this is to be used sparingly and not indiscriminately.

I won’t even respond to that baseless claim made earlier that “hard-core” Catholics should practice what they preach.

 

[Freshman88]

well at least you admit your own ignorance… thats a start. So before you start your triumphalism BS maybe you should learn about other traditions before claiming your own as the ABSOLUTE TRUTH, for how can you claim it without knowing the oposition!

Ok, calm down there buddy. I take this very personally. Please refrain from calling the very thing I have decided to devout my entire life to, as “bs”. It’s hard not to make an attack like that as anything less then personal.

Now moving on. I don’t say anything. The CHURCH says it. You think this is me talking? This is what our faith preaches. She says She holds the Fullness of the Truth. period.

Now why should I learn the other faiths before holding to my own? That makes no sense. If one finds the love of his life, does he say “oh I’m not too sure you’re the one honey, I haven’t really given that other girl full due”.

 

[Freshman88]

I hate to say it but you have let protestantism seep into your catholic faith. Catholicism has always understood itself to be set within the idea of a communal setting. You are speaking like it is you, the Mass and Christ… thats all that matters, nothing else!

It is in a communal setting. I have not said anything less. In fact if you read my post, I suggested that it was an important thing.

But it is just me and Christ. And it is the mass that unities hence “communion”. My salvation is dependent on me, and on Christ. There is a communal setting, it is important, but it is secondary to me and Christ.

The only way Protestantism could seep in is by reversing that order.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

Ok, calm down there buddy. I take this very personally. Please refrain from calling the very thing I have decided to devout my entire life to, as “bs”. It’s hard not to make an attack like that as anything less then personal.

Fair enough, i did not mean it as a personal attack but the same is extended to you… please refrain from calling me buddy, i do not know you and the term ‘buddy’ where i come from is acutally used to reference someones homosexual partner and i am not gay!

My point about protestantism seeping in is your insistence on you and christ. Protestanism is very indidividualistic and that is what i meant. You seem to only believe that you are united at mass? That is a faulty beleif concerning the body of christ. The catechism and bible both espouse a high importantce of community which seems to be lackin in your desert father mentality, just me and Him.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

Now why should I learn the other faiths before holding to my own? That makes no sense. If one finds the love of his life, does he say “oh I’m not too sure you’re the one honey, I haven’t really given that other girl full due”.

And as for this ignorant comment i will not even touch… but have you ever wondered how you know Truth? You only know something to be true by testing it over and agasint something else. How can you even fully appreciate your own faith without knowing that of another (not talkin christian denomination here but ANOTHER RELIGIOUS HERITAGE!)

 

[Future_Prodigy]

I re read my post and no where did i even attack you… do you even know what triumphalism is?! Cause your post was saturated with it!

 

[Freshman88]

My point about protestantism seeping in is your insistence on you and christ. Protestanism is very indidividualistic and that is what i meant. You seem to only believe that you are united at mass? That is a faulty beleif concerning the body of christ. The catechism and bible both espouse a high importantce of community which seems to be lackin in your desert father mentality, just me and Him.

We grow in union with Christ in many ways. The Eucharist is one of the most important ways we do this. By taking the Eucharist he abides in us, and us in Him. Notice the word “us”. I also become united with all my Christian brethern when I partake in Eucharist.

Again, Again, and again. Community is important.I have not said anything less. I think this the third time I have used this phrase or similar.

It is in a communal setting. I have not said anything less. In fact if you read my post, I suggested that it was an important thing.

Community is good, and it should be sought after

3x.

Now that you hopefully understand that I think community is important, let’s see what my arguement is.

I to side with the OP, RC is centered around the mass in most parishes and that is horrible

“Centered around the mass”
The mass is centered around the Eucharist. Without the Eucharist it would not be a mass. Now we centre ourselves around the mass because this all so important. It unites with Christ. Yes, there are other ways to seek union, but this such a direct way of doing it.

Secondly, the Desert Fathers were very blessed men, I thank you for your compliment.

But moving on, as my posts keep trying to explain there is a priority list here. First - me and Christ. Second - community. The Parish should represent this reality. For we cannot love our neighbour until we love Christ and Ourselves. It is out of this that all love stems. We can never love our fellow man, if we do not truly love God. Priorties. That’s all I’m saying, because that is what you did when you attacked the mass. The mass is about His Sacrifice, it is about communion, it is about loving and worshipping God. By doing this, we will love and serve our fellow man. But to focus on making people feel “welcome” or “building a sense of community” is to lose focus on what really matters, our love of God because as I said, it is from our love of God that our love of man comes from.

 

[Freshman88]

And as for this ignorant comment i will not even touch… but have you ever wondered how you know Truth? You only know something to be true by testing it over and agasint something else. How can you even fully appreciate your own faith without knowing that of another (not talkin christian denomination here but ANOTHER RELIGIOUS HERITAGE!)

I find completion in my faith. My faith tells me it holds the fullness of the Truth. Simple as that.

Religious heritage? I have study Hinduism before I can become a Christian? Where in Tradition is this said? Where in the Bible is this said? When did Christ ever say this? What if I grew up in medieval Christendom, what could have I studied then? Was there faith false because they couldn’t study Sikhism?

Or is this just your opinion?

(and this is all based on the fact that I do not know anything about any other religious heritages. My Mother’s family is Orthodox? Not good enough? I’m studying for a minor in compartive religions, still not good enough? What would be good enough? But I don’t even like saying this, because it suggests that I needed to do this before I came to my faith. That’s just silly.

 

[Vanessa]

Protestants believe that the Holy Spirit lives within each believer. So, to a protestant, Christ already lives within them.

Catholics believe this also, did you know that? I ask because I’m concerned that you are learning more Protestant slants and will soon be anti-Catholic.

Are you sure that your Baptist friends are accepting of you or are they trying to convert you? Here’s a test. Do you talk about the Catholic postion? Do you mention that you go to daily mass? Do you talk about your absolute contentment with the Catholic Church. I bet not. I bet if they thought there was no converting you that you would not be welcome into their circles. I bet that you keep mainly quiet about what the Catholic Church teaches.

I hope I’m wrong, and I apologize if so. But I’ve experienced it and had friends experience it. And I’ve found that Baptists generally consider Catholics to not be Christians.

 

[Freshman88]

I re read my post and no where did i even attack you… do you even know what triumphalism is?! Cause your post was saturated with it!

triumphalism BS - If I have to find the necessary quotes in the Catechism and Church documents I will. But she asserts she has the fullness of the Truth. I believe in the Church, I have faith in the Church, and the faith says she has the fullness of the Truth.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

You also can not love God without loving your neighbour… for how can you love God whom you dont see yet dont love your neighbour whom you do see!..

p.s. i do aggre with a lot of what you said in your last post!!! But realistically there is more need for something than the Mass… much more is needed!!! Ppl are spirtual sponges and the mass is just not the only tool that should be used!

 

[Future_Prodigy]

then maybe you should look up the parts on other denominations and other faiths! and be more charitable and christian like!

 

[guanophore]

Do you know ANYTHING about anglicanism AT ALL!? I am a high anglican thinking of converting to RC and these stupid, ignorant, and arrogant response to nothing to nourishing ecumenism let alone anything CHRISTIAN.

I to side with the OP, RC is centered around the mass in most parishes and that is horrible. No wonder the church is losing so many young people these days to other protestant churches.

I know enough to be offended as well, and on behalf of the poster, as well as all “stupid, ignorant, and arrogant” Catholics so sincerely apologize. I hope that your charism will bring the nourishment that is so badly lacking.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

I hope I’m wrong, and I apologize if so. But I’ve experienced it and had friends experience it. And I’ve found that Baptists generally consider Catholics to not be Christians.

and on this board i have found the same just vice versa… the penduluum swings both ways. CHristians have got to get rid of this triumphalist agenda and be more compassionate, loving and caring. plain and simple

 

[Freshman88]

You also can not love God without loving your neighbour… for how can you love God whom you dont see yet dont love your neighbour whom you do see!..

p.s. i do aggre with a lot of what you said in your last post!!! But realistically there is more need for something than the Mass… much more is needed!!! Ppl are spirtual sponges and the mass is just not the only tool that should be used!

Right, one of the ways I love God is by loving my neighbour. But that extends from God! Everything is dependent on God. Existence its self is dependent on the Almighty. It is from loving God, that I love my fellow man, not the other way around.

I suggest you study the Eucharist more. You greatly understimate it’s power. It is Christ’s Sacrifice. His flesh and blood!

We should seek community, sure, but is it required? That is why it is secondary.

 

[Freshman88]

and on this board i have found the same just vice versa… the penduluum swings both ways. CHristians have got to get rid of this triumphalist agenda and be more compassionate, loving and caring. plain and simple

If one believes in Christ, he is a Christian. So I hope that wasn’t directed at me.

then maybe you should look up the parts on other denominations and other faiths! and be more charitable and christian like!

Again, I’ve grown up in two different Christian traditions.

As for being charitable? I do my best, but sometimes the Truth hurts. And it is very Christian like to have a zeal for the Truth.

 

[Freshman88]

If one believes in Christ, he is a Christian. So I hope that wasn’t directed at me.

then maybe you should look up the parts on other denominations and other faiths! and be more charitable and christian like!

Again, I’ve grown up in two different Christian traditions.

As for being charitable? I do my best, but sometimes the Truth hurts. And it is very Christian like to have a zeal for the Truth.

 

[Future_Prodigy]

I know the Eucharist, as i said i am a high anglican who is thinking of converting to RC… maybe if you KNEW what that meant you wouldnt make judgements!

THat is what i am agruing though that community is important. I do understand where you are coming from and i doubt you are liek what i have in my head… a hermit type mystic who believes nothign else is important but his relationship with God.

Look at the stats of parishs… they are dwindling!!! WHy because of the lack of outreach!

Whoever said above that just look at the numbers is horribly mistaken. Pentecoastalism is the fastets growin religion in both the USA and Brazil. Catholicism has got to learn and apply what these other denominations are doing