Ask a FORMER Baptist Pastor

[mark_a]

I think a lot of it comes from the former Catholics that didn’t know the faith, and misrepresent what we believe to the pastors and fellow congregants, who then repeat it.

In Christ,

Ellen

Could be true, but it seems very irresponsible and un-pastoral of leadership who should know better.

 

[jmcrae]

I got some baptist friends of mine to go to mass with me. I’m going to be going to their church some time soon (I know my faith well, so I’m not planning on becoming baptist or anything) They said it’s about two hours and they have a potluck afterward. Is that normal? What else should I expect?

I have a related question.

I once attended an Evangelical Baptist Church service, and I kept on waiting for it to start. The singing, clapping, etc. turned out to be not just the warm-up while they were waiting for the clergyman to come - it was their actual “service of worship.”

When the singing and clapping came to an end, I thought that a clergyman would come, and that there would be prayers and Scripture readings, but nothing like that ever happened - a collection basket was passed around, and then everyone just got up and left. No final blessing, or anything.

Is that normal?

 

[Incomplete]

Not to be uncharitable, but I’ve gotten the feeling when I’ve gone to protestant church services like it’s children playing dress-up, pretending to be adults (especially their symbolically reenacting the Lord’s supper). Is that just me and my being accustomed to Catholic ritual or does that resonate with you? (Some Catholic masses too, sadly, come close to evoking this feeling.)

My daughter has an 18-year-old friend, raised Lutheran (though I use the word “raised” lightly, the family rarely goes to church) and later turned Pentacostal (through an uncle.)

After hanging with my daughter for awhile, he decided to explore Catholicism. He goes to Mass frequently now, and has completed an RCIA course. He will probably take it once more, but looks on the path to becoming Catholic.

He has recently compared both Pentacostal and Lutheran services to the Mass, and has said pretty much what you just posted.

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

My wife was baptized in a small Baptist church in Kentucky.

She started going to Church and every week they would put forth the need to accept Christ and be saved and they’d make an altar call.

Eventually she felt moved to accept that call and a few weeks later was baptized.

Initially she was all fired up, but then she kept coming back and kept hearing how they needed to accept Christ, and she watched others make (sometimes repeat) their altar calls, and she think…OK…I’ve done that…now what…

After a few months she came to the realization that at least in that church there was no next…that was it…and eventually fell back into her pre-“saved” life.

I certainly hope this was an atypical experience.

Chuck

Well–I’ve been in Conservative Baptist, Assembly of God, and Church of Christ. All have pretty much been like that. Get you the membership card and then it’s up to you. Problem was–in the small group–there is no one qualified to spiritually fed you. It’s kind of up for grabs… They were nice people but really nothing there to grab hold of.

 

[JustaServant]

What about a liturgy? I mean I know they don’t like fixed liturgies, but do they have “reading” from the bible, or one verse? Do they jump around in the bible and have you read it with them?

Depends on the church. I have been in Baptist churches that have liturgical readings, prayers and songs. Others are like a cookout on someone’s back porch. Many of the better Baptist churches have Bible readings while standing (out of respect), only the older churches still have responsive readings. The worst of them just have the preacher read one verse of scripture and then he spends the rest of the time preaching, and never opens the Bible again. I was always curious how they could call themselves ‘Bible’ churches, and never read the Bible.

 

[JustaServant]

and she watched others make (sometimes repeat) their altar calls, and she think…OK…I’ve done that…now what

She hit that quagmire pretty early. It takes many a while to get to that ‘now what’ point. Unfortunetly its a question never answered.

 

[JustaServant]

Not to be uncharitable, but I’ve gotten the feeling when I’ve gone to protestant church services like it’s children playing dress-up, pretending to be adults (especially their symbolically reenacting the Lord’s supper). Is that just me and my being accustomed to Catholic ritual or does that resonate with you? (Some Catholic masses too, sadly, come close to evoking this feeling.)

I can’t speak for all Protestant churches, but you hit the nail on the head when it comes to ‘evangelical/fundamentalist’ churches. A former Pentecostal preacher once gave this honest assesment: “We spend all week in a 2+2=4 world. Then Sunday comes and its 2+2=5! For one hour we get to live in Never-neverLand before its back to 2+2=4”.
I’ll let you play around with the psychology of that.

 

[JustaServant]

I know Baptists look at Baptism as only symbolic. Now that I think of it, it’s kind of ironic considering their name. If I’m not mistaken, it’s a personal act of faith - accepting Jesus as their saviour - that is the determining factor of when they are “saved”. My understanding is also that anyone who dies prior to making this profession of faith will go to hell – except for babies.

So now for my question. At what age, after infancy, would this chance of condemnation begin to take effect. Is there a certain age? In other words, say a 10 year old dies and he had not yet asked our Lord to be his Saviour, do they believe he will go to hell?
Or is it something other than age that determines whether or not one is condemned prior to making the profession of faith? If so, what?

The ‘age of accountabilty’ is debated in many Baptist circles. They don’t seem to know what to do with the children. They evangelize them until they ‘pray the sinner’s prayer’ in sunday school, youth group, or Vacation Bible School.
BTW, if you send your Baptized Catholic child to the local evangelical VBS, they WILL be prompted to do this, guarenteed.

 

[JustaServant]

Hello JustaServant,

I’ve really enjoyed all the insight in your posts over the past few years.

My question is: Why do so many Baptists presume to know so much about Catholic teaching when they really don’t?

My guess is that they are hearing lies about the Catholic Church in their Baptist churches.

What do you think?

Old saying: Wanna know all about the Catholic faith? Ask a non-Catholic.
Yes, they are hearing lies. But how deep those lies are penetrated depends on if they have any interaction with flesh and blood Catholics in their lives. They soon discover what the preacher says does not match up with what they experience.

 

[JustaServant]

What did your congregation think of your conversion?

Viva Cristo Rey!!

Catholic Deacon

Heh…never asked them.
I converted after I left the ministry.

 

[JustaServant]

I have a related question.

I once attended an Evangelical Baptist Church service, and I kept on waiting for it to start. The singing, clapping, etc. turned out to be not just the warm-up while they were waiting for the clergyman to come - it was their actual “service of worship.”

When the singing and clapping came to an end, I thought that a clergyman would come, and that there would be prayers and Scripture readings, but nothing like that ever happened - a collection basket was passed around, and then everyone just got up and left. No final blessing, or anything.

Is that normal?

Actually no.
It may have been a ‘praise and worship’ service or something equivelant to it.

 

[MarcoPolo]

Actually no.
It may have been a ‘praise and worship’ service or something equivelant to it.

Let’s say you try to explain John 6 or the Last Supper or Paul on the Eucharist to a Protestant. You show them “This is my body,” “Unless you eat my flesh,” or “The bread is discerned as His body.” The Protestant explains these passages back by saying, "What is meant there is “This is a symbol of my body,” “Unless you eat my flesh symbolically” and “The bread is discerned as a symbol of His body.” At that point, would you agree it’s futile to argue from Scripture to this person because he/she sees hallucinations of additional words in the text?

 

[FCEGM]

I actually started it as a kind of ‘spoof thread’ in response to the ‘Ask a Baptist Pastor’ thread. I honestly didn’t expect the responses I got.

Although that was your intent, I think we’re all glad it has morphed into something more.

How prevalent is the thinking of “The Trail of Blood” within the various Baptist branches and as a minister did you ever address this sort of thinking among other Baptist ministers?

 

[JustaServant]

Let’s say you try to explain John 6 or the Last Supper or Paul on the Eucharist to a Protestant. You show them “This is my body,” “Unless you eat my flesh,” or “The bread is discerned as His body.” The Protestant explains these passages back by saying, "What is meant there is “This is a symbol of my body,” “Unless you eat my flesh symbolically” and “The bread is discerned as a symbol of His body.” At that point, would you agree it’s futile to argue from Scripture to this person because he/she sees hallucinations of additional words in the text?

I know in my case I simply ignored the passage. That is what a lot of Baptist preachers do. If you can show them that the Catholic interpretation dates back to the first century after Christ, then you might break through.
The problem is thier view of Sola Scriptura blinds them to any other explaination beyond that,

 

[JustaServant]

Although that was your intent, I think we’re all glad it has morphed into something more.

How prevalent is the thinking of “The Trail of Blood” within the various Baptist branches and as a minister did you ever address this sort of thinking among other Baptist ministers?

TOB is only used by extreme fundamentalist Baptists. Most mainline Baptists reject it.
Many reformed use Fox’s Book of Martyrs for the same purpose.
Did I encounter it? You betcha. In one church I preached in I mentioned the fallacies in the book and you would have thought I denied the Trinity.

 

[MarcoPolo]

I know in my case I simply ignored the passage. That is what a lot of Baptist preachers do. If you can show them that the Catholic interpretation dates back to the first century after Christ, then you might break through.
The problem is thier view of Sola Scriptura blinds them to any other explaination beyond that,

I encountered a Baptist who did address the passage but basically said that really means ‘a symbol of My Body.’ You see the futility of dealing with a person like that who simply adds words to the text as his defense?

 

[JustaServant]

I encountered a Baptist who did address the passage but basically said that really means ‘a symbol of My Body.’ You see the futility of dealing with a person like that who simply adds words to the text as his defense?

You can’t do anything with a guy like that until his spiritual eyes are opened.
Human beings will go to extrodinary lengths to remain ‘in the familiar’, anything beyond that creates fear. So they have to rationalize because the other possibility is simply too frightening to accept.

 

[MarcoPolo]

You can’t do anything with a guy like that until his spiritual eyes are opened.

Yeah, I had to just bow out of that conversation. Wasn’t anything else I could do.

 

[JustaServant]

Yeah, I had to just bow out of that conversation. Wasn’t anything else I could do.

Keep in mind, to even toy with the idea of Catholic doctrine being correct is equivalent to questioning your Christian faith. It’s an internal struggle that the person seldom talks about out loud. To do so, means people will question your Christianity.
Do you know how many of my former ‘friends’ today consider me an apostate headed for Hell? They are simply unable to process the information.
Why? Well, I have my own ideas on that, but I will not say it on a public forum.

 

[Betterave]

Yeah, I had to just bow out of that conversation. Wasn’t anything else I could do.

My understanding is that “eat my body,” if intended metaphorically, would be equivalent to something like “persecute me” - have you heard that one? It kind makes the symbolic interpretation fall flat!