Ask about Catholic Charismatic Renewal

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I guess it’s whatever you wanna think. To me this is bogus and not real and definitely not Catholic. This has been going on for at least fifty years and I speak with an apologist daily named Richard Salbato who has done manyinvestigations into false movements within the church as well as investigating alleged apparitions with and for the Vatican. He does not believe in the charismatic renewal and has written many documents over the last thirty years in conjunction with Bishops and Priests who also see this as a invalid movement. His website is unitypublishing.com. Also why would God have people speak in an unknown language or “tongues” as you call it. God is open and I would think that if he was giving a person a special message as though they were like a prophet why would it not be in a language all can understand. Seems to me that Satan would use tongues or unknown languages to push his hidden agenda and create an elitist mentality so that people would begin following the so-called prophets who speak the tongues and not church law and doctrine, same as he did to the jews with there idols in the desert. This whole thing smacks of heresy and fantasy to me and I don’t see why I would need it. I have the mass,rosary, our father’s, eucharist and the sacraments. What else do I need to be in communion with God. The Church is rock solid and is not lacking and your movement contends that it is lacking, which is heresy, so I don’t get it at all.
Dorothy_Vining said:
The phrase “Jesus is Lord” actually means something. Satan
knows very well who Jesus is (Acts 19:15) but certainly does not call him Lord. If Jesus were
Satan’s Lord he would respond “Yes, Master.” His attitude is “I will not serve” (or non serviam, for Latin lovers). That is not the response of a subject to his Lord. In fact, Satan had the nerve to say to Jesus (Matthew 4:9) “All this I will give you, if you will bow down and worship me." No, Satan did not call Jesus Lord! He thinks it better to reign in hell than serve in
heaven.

And, FYI, I was Catholic before you were born-- and still am–a charismatic Catholic!

As God poured out his Spirit on both the Jews and the Gentiles (Acts 10:45) and the Gentiles were recognized as believers because they spoke in tongues, I think he has poured out his Spirit on some people other than Catholics and that may be the way we will all become one eventually.

Come, Holy Spirit, Spouse of the Blessed Virgin!
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fierysword1920 said:
I guess it’s whatever you wanna think. To me this is bogus and not real and definitely not Catholic. This has been going on for at least fifty years and I speak with an apologist daily named Richard Salbato who has done manyinvestigations into false movements within the church as well as investigating alleged apparitions with and for the Vatican. He does not believe in the charismatic renewal and has written many documents over the last thirty years in conjunction with Bishops and Priests who also see this as a invalid movement. His website is unitypublishing.com. Also why would God have people speak in an unknown language or “tongues” as you call it. God is open and I would think that if he was giving a person a special message as though they were like a prophet why would it not be in a language all can understand. Seems to me that Satan would use tongues or unknown languages to push his hidden agenda and create an elitist mentality so that people would begin following the so-called prophets who speak the tongues and not church law and doctrine, same as he did to the jews with there idols in the desert. This whole thing smacks of heresy and fantasy to me and I don’t see why I would need it. I have the mass,rosary, our father’s, eucharist and the sacraments. What else do I need to be in communion with God. The Church is rock solid and is not lacking and your movement contends that it is lacking, which is heresy, so I don’t get it at all.
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I’ve looked at unitypublishing.com and the stuff on Charismatic Renewal is full of innuendoes, smears and outright lies. It is a travesty.

Catholic Charismatic Renewal is a movement of the Holy Spirit and before you imply it is Satanic you should bear in mind what Jesus said:

“Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.” (Mt 12:32)

I might also be worth bearing in mind the words of Gamaleil in Acts 5:38-39:
“if this plan or this undertaking is of human origin, it will fail; but if it is of God, you will not be able to overthrow them—in that case you may even be found fighting against God!”
 
To apply that “…sin against the Holy Spirit…” regarding Charismatic movement is outrageous. That quote is supposed to verify His Presence and suppress all doubts? We are supposed to “test/discern” the spirits…if the movement was valid we would not be having this thread…it would have an accepted phenomena and vital to our salvation.

IT is NOT !

To apply that “unforgivable sin” to non-believers of the Charis movement is taking upon yourself the interpretation that has nothing to do with calling on thr Holy Spirit so we can speak in unintelligible tongues.

Demonically possessed commonly speak in unintelligible “tongues”. This movement is NOT embraced by the Church and was NOT instituted by Christ. the founder of this Church. You are way overboard on that assessment/application of that Gospel line. Where does some folks get this stuff is beyond comprehension.

To deny, reject or see Charis. as fakery is NO SIN AGAINST THE HOLY SPIRIT. It does NOT mandate that rejection of this movement be confessed.

That is plain outrageous. We who do not believe in this movement do so with guidance from the Holy Spirit. We have been warned that "signs of wonders and false miracles: will lead many astray. Salvation comes from the Eucharist through the Mass and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit comes from the sacrament of Confirmation…we are given a added name during Confirmation. That is a sign of commitment to the Holy Spirit…it is a name given during a SACRAMENT just like Baptism.

No one is going to be intimidated into acceptance of this movement by saying, “…sin against the Holy Spirit…” You should have thought that one over before you posted that untruth.
 
johnstown_johnn said:
To apply that “…sin against the Holy Spirit…” regarding Charismatic movement is outrageous. That quote is supposed to verify His Presence and suppress all doubts? We are supposed to “test/discern” the spirits…if the movement was valid we would not be having this thread…it would have an accepted phenomena and vital to our salvation.

IT is NOT !

To apply that “unforgivable sin” to non-believers of the Charis movement is taking upon yourself the interpretation that has nothing to do with calling on thr Holy Spirit so we can speak in unintelligible tongues.

Demonically possessed commonly speak in unintelligible “tongues”. This movement is NOT embraced by the Church and was NOT instituted by Christ. the founder of this Church. You are way overboard on that assessment/application of that Gospel line. Where does some folks get this stuff is beyond comprehension.

To deny, reject or see Charis. as fakery is NO SIN AGAINST THE HOLY SPIRIT. It does NOT mandate that rejection of this movement be confessed.

That is plain outrageous. We who do not believe in this movement do so with guidance from the Holy Spirit. We have been warned that "signs of wonders and false miracles: will lead many astray. Salvation comes from the Eucharist through the Mass and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit comes from the sacrament of Confirmation…we are given a added name during Confirmation. That is a sign of commitment to the Holy Spirit…it is a name given during a SACRAMENT just like Baptism.

No one is going to be intimidated into acceptance of this movement by saying, “…sin against the Holy Spirit…” You should have thought that one over before you posted that untruth.
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You have way over-reacted. I was suggesting that fierysword bear that quote in mind when implying that CCR was demonically inspired and a tool of Satan. You should read posts more carefully before getting so overexcited.
 
The quote furnished from Acts: “…if this plan or undertaking is of human origin, it will fail…” This is ANOTHER misapplication. The quote in Acts is NOT about the Charismatic movement, it is a non sequitur.
 
fierysword1920

Many people have critised the charismatic movement in the church today. This is not limited to today. In the early 1900s when the penticostal movement began in this country the penticostal people were persecuted for their faith They were beaten tared and feathered mocked lost their jobs and so on. The main persecution came from other christians. Thease people in spite of all this evangelised the would.

The charismatic renewel also has also grown and spread the gospel all over the world. It is one of the fastest growing segments of the church today. By the way it has not been embraced by many of the penticostal churches.

(((Also why would God have people speak in an unknown language or “tongues” as you call it. God is open and I would think that if he was giving a person a special message as though they were like a prophet why would it not be in a language all can understand.)))
Code: 
As to the tongues. I believe that looking at the scriptures can clear up alot of confusion.
 The apostle Paul made an interesting statement while addressing a problem in the church.
I Corinthians 14:18 I thank my God I speak with tongues more then ye all.

Tongues in scripture as the Holy Spirit gives are shown to have differant purposes.

an example of this would be in the gift of tongues where one gives a message in tongues in a service and one interpets the message. Thease are two gifts of the Holy Spirit and are listed in 1 Cor 12:10
This is done to the edifying of the church. I Cor 14:4 It is also a sign to them that do not believe
1Cor 14:21-22 When the Holy Spirit uses a person in this way then there needs to be the gift of intrepation in use as well. If there is not then the person that gave the nmessage can pray that they intrepet If there is no one to intrepet then the person is to just speak them silently to themselves and to God. 1 Cor 14:28 Remember that this is the gift of tongues in operation in the church. There are differant uses that the Holy Spirit has with tongues that If you are interested I will share more later.

((( You asked God is open and I would think that if he was giving a person a special message as though they were like a prophet why would it not be in a language all can understand.))))
Code: 
The answer is that He does. The Holy Spirit also uses people to do just that and they do not have to be a prophet but can be just anyone whom he choses to do so with.  There is the gift of prophecy the gift of the word of knowledge and the gift of the word of wisdom and they are listed in 1 Cor 12:8
 I would like to say more but I am out of time.
 
I have no worries whatsoever about blaspheming the Holy Spirit. Pope Benedict has not pushed your movement, nor has Mary or any other Saint appeared urging us to partake in this endeavor. You people are simply in love with a fantastical idea that pentecostalism cooked up, your jsut to prideful to admit it and are not happy with what God has already given his true church. I guess if you think unitypublishing is wrong then I suppose it is obvious that your against church law and doctrine because that is who he works with i.e. the Bishops conference, magisterium and the congregation for the doctrine of faith. None of these church offices goes along with what you preach. It is of no use and simply does not matter. You are wasting your time.
steve99 said:
I’ve looked at unitypublishing.com and the stuff on Charismatic Renewal is full of innuendoes, smears and outright lies. It is a travesty.

Catholic Charismatic Renewal is a movement of the Holy Spirit and before you imply it is Satanic you should bear in mind what Jesus said:

“Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.” (Mt 12:32)

I might also be worth bearing in mind the words of Gamaleil in Acts 5:38-39:
“if this plan or this undertaking is of human origin, it will fail; but if it is of God, you will not be able to overthrow them—in that case you may even be found fighting against God!”
Click to expand...
 
Yeah and don’t you people know one of the basic tenets of our church faith and law… it is that we cannot partake in any kind of praying with other religous groups or adopting them as our own because the Pope is Christ’s spiritual head of his church here on earth and that being said, he has not ruled this movement neccessary or even valid and none of his predecessors did so either. You guys are practicing a heretic movement and trying to push it into being church law. It is wrong, you do not decide what is law and not law, that is the pope and the magisterium and congregation for the doctrine of faith. THEY are in direct contact with the Holy Spirit and they do not speak in tongues. So now tell me why tongues is real or even neccessary for Catholics.
hope_7 said:
fierysword1920

Many people have critised the charismatic movement in the church today. This is not limited to today. In the early 1900s when the penticostal movement began in this country the penticostal people were persecuted for their faith They were beaten tared and feathered mocked lost their jobs and so on. The main persecution came from other christians. Thease people in spite of all this evangelised the would.

The charismatic renewel also has also grown and spread the gospel all over the world. It is one of the fastest growing segments of the church today. By the way it has not been embraced by many of the penticostal churches.

(((Also why would God have people speak in an unknown language or “tongues” as you call it. God is open and I would think that if he was giving a person a special message as though they were like a prophet why would it not be in a language all can understand.)))
Code: 
As to the tongues. I believe that looking at the scriptures can clear up alot of confusion.
 The apostle Paul made an interesting statement while addressing a problem in the church.
I Corinthians 14:18 I thank my God I speak with tongues more then ye all.

Tongues in scripture as the Holy Spirit gives are shown to have differant purposes.

an example of this would be in the gift of tongues where one gives a message in tongues in a service and one interpets the message. Thease are two gifts of the Holy Spirit and are listed in 1 Cor 12:10
This is done to the edifying of the church. I Cor 14:4 It is also a sign to them that do not believe
1Cor 14:21-22 When the Holy Spirit uses a person in this way then there needs to be the gift of intrepation in use as well. If there is not then the person that gave the nmessage can pray that they intrepet If there is no one to intrepet then the person is to just speak them silently to themselves and to God. 1 Cor 14:28 Remember that this is the gift of tongues in operation in the church. There are differant uses that the Holy Spirit has with tongues that If you are interested I will share more later.

((( You asked God is open and I would think that if he was giving a person a special message as though they were like a prophet why would it not be in a language all can understand.))))
Code: 
The answer is that He does. The Holy Spirit also uses people to do just that and they do not have to be a prophet but can be just anyone whom he choses to do so with.  There is the gift of prophecy the gift of the word of knowledge and the gift of the word of wisdom and they are listed in 1 Cor 12:8
 I would like to say more but I am out of time.
Click to expand...
 
fierysword1920 said:
Yeah and don’t you people know one of the basic tenets of our church faith and law… it is that we cannot partake in any kind of praying with other religous groups or adopting them as our own because the Pope is Christ’s spiritual head of his church here on earth and that being said, he has not ruled this movement neccessary or even valid and none of his predecessors did so either. You guys are practicing a heretic movement and trying to push it into being church law. It is wrong, you do not decide what is law and not law, that is the pope and the magisterium and congregation for the doctrine of faith. THEY are in direct contact with the Holy Spirit and they do not speak in
tongues. So now tell me why tongues is real or even neccessary for Catholics.
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DECREE ON THE APOSTOLATE OF THE LAITY
APOSTOLICAM ACTUOSITATEM
SOLEMNLY PROMULGATED BY HIS HOLINESS,
POPE PAUL VI
ON NOVEMBER 18, 1965

CHAPTER I
THE VOCATION OF THE LAITY TO THE APOSTOLATE
#3
For the exercise of this apostolate, the Holy Spirit Who sanctifies the people of God through ministry and the sacraments gives the faithful special gifts also (cf. 1 Cor. 12:7), “allotting them to everyone according as He wills” (1 Cor. 12:11) in order that individuals, administering grace to others just as they have received it, may also be “good stewards of the manifold grace of God” (1 Peter 4:10), to build up the whole body in charity (cf. Eph. 4:16).** From the acceptance of these charisms, including those which are more elementary, there arise for each believer the right and duty to use them in the Church and in the world for the good of men and the building up of the Church, in the freedom of the Holy Spirit who “breathes where He wills” (John 3:8). **This should be done by the laity in communion with their brothers in Christ, especially with their pastors who must make a judgment about the true nature and proper use of these gifts not to extinguish the Spirit but to test all things and hold for what is good (cf. 1 Thess. 5:12,19,21).(4)

vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_decree_19651118_apostolicam-actuositatem_en.html

ADDRESS OF JOHN PAUL II
TO A DELEGATION OF MEMBERS OF THE RENEWAL
IN THE HOLY SPIRIT MOVEMENT

Thursday, 14 March 2002
  1. **Yes! The Renewal in the Spirit can be considered a special gift of the Holy Spirit to the Church in our time. Born in the Church and for the Church, your movement is one in which, following the light of the Gospel, the members experience the living encounter with Jesus, fidelity to God in personal and community prayer, confident listening to his Word and a vital rediscovery of the Sacraments, not to mention courage in trials and hope in hardship. **
    **Love for the Church and submission to her Magisterium, in a process of maturing in the Church supported by a solid permanent formation are relevant signs of your intention to avoid the risk of favouring, unwittingly, a purely emotional experience of the divine, an excessive pursuit of the “extraordinary” and a private withdrawal that may shrink from apostolic outreach. **
3. On this special occasion I desire ideally to bless three projects, which you have launched, that send out groups and communities of the Renewal in the Spirit “from the Upper Room” with generous missionary ardour.

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/speeches/2002/march/documents/hf_jp-ii_spe_20020314_rinnovamento-spirito-santo_en.html

PRAYER VIGIL AND MEETING,
SOLEMNITY OF PENTECOST
MEETING WITH THE ECCLESIAL MOVEMENTS AND NEW COMMUNITIES
HOMILY OF HIS HOLINESS BENEDICT XVI

St. Peter’s Square
Saturday, 3 June 2006

Dear Brothers and Sisters,
A similar meeting that took place in this same Square on 30 May 1998 with beloved Pope John Paul II springs to mind. A great evangelizer of our time, he accompanied and guided you throughout his Pontificate.

He described your Associations and Communities on many occasions as “providential”, especially because the Sanctifying Spirit makes use of them to reawaken faith in so many Christian hearts and to reveal to them the vocation they have received with Baptism. He also helps them to be witnesses of hope filled with that fire of love which is bestowed upon us precisely by the Holy Spirit.

nsc-chariscenter.org/pentecostHomily_Benedict.htm

See also:
Father Cantalamessa: Baptism in the Spirit is not a human invention; it is a divine invention. It is a renewal of baptism and of the whole of Christian life, of all the sacraments.

Why has the Lord decided to act at this time in such a strong way? We don’t know. It is the grace of a new Pentecost.

zenit.org/article-8271?l=english
 
cont.

ADDRESS OF HIS HOLINESS BENEDICT XVI
TO THE MEMBERS OF COMMUNION AND LIBERATION MOVEMENT
ON THE 25th ANNIVERSARY OF ITS PONTIFICAL RECOGNITION

St Peter’s Square
Saturday, 24 March 2007

Dear Brothers and Sisters,

Dear Friends, your Movement is thus inserted into that vast flowering of associations, movements and new ecclesial realities providentially raised up by the Holy Spirit in the Church after the Second Vatican Council. Every gift of the Spirit is found originally and necessarily at the service of the edification of the Body of Christ, offering a witness of the immense charity of God for the life of each person. The reality of ecclesial movements, therefore, is a sign of the fecundity of the Lord’s Spirit, because it manifests in the world the victory of the Risen Christ and it accomplishes the missionary mandate entrusted to the whole Church. **In the Message to the World Congress of Ecclesial Movements, 27 May 1998, the Servant of God John Paul II had this to say: that there is no conflict or opposition in the Church between the institutional and the charismatic dimensions, of which the Movements are a significant expression. Both are co-essential to the divine constitution of the People of God. In the Church the essential institutions are also charismatic and indeed the charisms must, in one way or another, be institutionalized to have coherency and continuity. **Hence, both dimensions originate from the same Holy Spirit for the same Body of Christ, and together they concur to make present the mystery and the salvific work of Christ in the world.
This explains the attention with which the Pope and the Pastors look upon the richness of the charismatic gifts in the contemporary age. In regard to this, during a recent meeting with the clergy and the parish priests of Rome, recalling the invitation that St Paul addressed in the First Letter to the Thessalonians not to extinguish the charisms, I said that if the Lord gives us new gifts, we must be grateful, even if sometimes they may be uncomfortable. At the same time, since the Church is one, if the Movements are really gifts of the Holy Spirit, they must, naturally, be inserted into the Ecclesial Community and serve it so that, in patient dialogue with the Pastors, they can be elements in the construction of the Church of today and tomorrow.

vatican.mondosearch.com/cgi-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=61816&query=charismatic%20renewal&SCOPE=EnglishUI&hiword=charismatic%20renewal%20
 
also there are three things we can do ecumenically-- learn what other religions teach to help them return to the fullness of truth; acts of social mercy and community service; and PRAYER. So yes we CAN pray with groups that are heretical or schismatic. We cannot compromise truth, but we can pray for common Christian goals.
 
😉 Praise God for you all you wonderful Charismatics, and also all of you loving and accepting Christians and Catholics. Jesus wants us all to be one in the fullness of His Truth, but some people are very closed to anything out of the ordinary. God the Father indeed did not leave us orphans, and anyone open to the Spirit and His workings can experience that in a very real way! I think we are being prepared with this generous outpouring of the Holy Spirit at this point in our time, for some reason the Father has not yet revealed. We need to pray for those whose minds and hearts are closed to this wonderful gift. God gave us the Holy Spirit for a reason and we need to accept Him fully and be open to God’s plan for our lives. It is only then that the fullness of His truth can be known.
 
fierysword1920 said:
I have no worries whatsoever about blaspheming the Holy Spirit. Pope Benedict has not pushed your movement, nor has Mary or any other Saint appeared urging us to partake in this endeavor. You people are simply in love with a fantastical idea that pentecostalism cooked up, your jsut to prideful to admit it and are not happy with what God has already given his true church. I guess if you think unitypublishing is wrong then I suppose it is obvious that your against church law and doctrine because that is who he works with i.e. the Bishops conference, magisterium and the congregation for the doctrine of faith. None of these church offices goes along with what you preach. It is of no use and simply does not matter. You are wasting your time.
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As Mary Ann R has shown, Pope Benedict does approve of CCR

Please also consider the following:

GoodNews magazine No. 190 (July/August 2007)

Michelle Moran, the Chairperson of the English NSC, has just been elected the new president of ICCRS. She succeeds Allan Panozza from Australia who has been president since 2000 and, of course, before that Charles Whitehead was president. ICCRS began in 1978, when Cardinal Suenens was named by Pope Paul VI as his Episcopal advisor to the Charismatic Renewal on the international level. The Council was formed from leaders around the world and an office was established, this was initially in Brussels and eventually moved to the Vatican.”

So Paul VI appointed Cardinal Suenens as the official Episcopal Advisor on Charismatic Renewal, and ICCRS has its offices in the Vatican. Sounds approving to me. But there is more

Today, ICCRS has official Vatican statutes and works in communion with the Holy See. It acts as a link or bridge between the worldwide Renewal and the institutional Church. Due to the spontaneous, Spirit led, nature of the Renewal ICCRS acts as a channel of communication, and service rather than as a governing body. ICCRS runs events and produces resources that offer encouragement, teaching and training. They are also available to offer pastoral advice and are willing to be of service in any way to the worldwide Renewal. ICCRS relates to the Vatican through the Pontifical Council of the Laity (PCL).

And more

At the recent Council meeting Arch- bishop Rylko, the President of the PCL complemented ICCRS on a number of its recent initiatives. These included the Formation Institute held in Rome for three weeks in June, the work of the ICCRS Theological Commission which has recently produced some guidelines on the healing ministry, and the 2008 Colloquium on the Charisms where practitioners in the Renewal will meet with Vatican officials and explore together the place and use of the Charisms in the Church today. All these initiatives comply with the request of John Paul II that all the movements should engage in the process of growing in Ecclesial Maturity.

ICCRS – International Catholic Charismatic Renewal Services
 
Pope Benedict approves of CCR, as did Pope John Paul II and Pope Paul VI

From What is Charismatic Renewal by Ian Petit OSB & Tom Forrest CSsR
On December 11th 1979, the international council of the Catholic charismatic renewal, with Cardinal Leo Joseph Suenens, met in Rome with Pope John Paul II. …… The Pope was warm, keenly interested in all that was said, and encouraging……Near the close of the meeting with the international leaders the Pope said this:
“Ths is my first meeting with you. I am convinced that this movement is a sign of his (God’s) action. ……So I am convinced that this movement is a very important component of this entire renewal of the church this spiritual renewal of the church.”

From The Catholic Charismatic Renewal by Benedict Heron OSB
Speaking to the leaders of the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, Pope John Paul II said on May 7th 1981 “Pope Paul described the movement in the Spirit as ‘a chance for the Church and for the world’, and the six tears since that Conference have born out the hope that inspired his vision.” Later in the same speech the Pope asked priests to welcome this renewal saying; “The priest, for his part, cannot exercise his service on behalf of the renewal unless he adopts a welcoming attitude towards it based on the desire he shares with every Christian by baptsm to grow in the gifts of the Holy Spirit.”

This last quote of the Pope was, according to another source, printed in Ossertvatore Romano 9th May 1981
 
I read what it said and he did not approve of your heretical movements and speaking in tongues. We all have charisms that God bestows upon us which are virtues that are strengths and we also are given weaknesses to humble our spirits and make them right to be in reverance of God. This has absolutely nothing to do with speaking in strange tongues and falling over because supposedly the Holy Spirit baptizes somebody. That is Benny Hinn and other frauds out here the same as him, thats there stuff, not catholics. Like I say I read your posts and they are true in there proper context but not the way your movement has twisted it. The CCR is doctrinally unsound and unproven in need, it sereves no purpose and it scandalizes the wonderful things that the Church has already given us in our battle against evil and also our quest for salvation. This very movement I find smacks of evil because of it’s nature to overturn and usurp the authoruty of past church fathers who have given us law and doctrine as did the apostles before us. This CCR movement should not be grafted into the faith, it is simply useless.
steve99 said:
As Mary Ann R has shown, Pope Benedict does approve of CCR

Please also consider the following:

GoodNews magazine No. 190 (July/August 2007)

Michelle Moran, the Chairperson of the English NSC, has just been elected the new president of ICCRS. She succeeds Allan Panozza from Australia who has been president since 2000 and, of course, before that Charles Whitehead was president. ICCRS began in 1978, when Cardinal Suenens was named by Pope Paul VI as his Episcopal advisor to the Charismatic Renewal on the international level. The Council was formed from leaders around the world and an office was established, this was initially in Brussels and eventually moved to the Vatican.”

So Paul VI appointed Cardinal Suenens as the official Episcopal Advisor on Charismatic Renewal, and ICCRS has its offices in the Vatican. Sounds approving to me. But there is more

Today, ICCRS has official Vatican statutes and works in communion with the Holy See. It acts as a link or bridge between the worldwide Renewal and the institutional Church. Due to the spontaneous, Spirit led, nature of the Renewal ICCRS acts as a channel of communication, and service rather than as a governing body. ICCRS runs events and produces resources that offer encouragement, teaching and training. They are also available to offer pastoral advice and are willing to be of service in any way to the worldwide Renewal. ICCRS relates to the Vatican through the Pontifical Council of the Laity (PCL).

And more

At the recent Council meeting Arch- bishop Rylko, the President of the PCL complemented ICCRS on a number of its recent initiatives. These included the Formation Institute held in Rome for three weeks in June, the work of the ICCRS Theological Commission which has recently produced some guidelines on the healing ministry, and the 2008 Colloquium on the Charisms where practitioners in the Renewal will meet with Vatican officials and explore together the place and use of the Charisms in the Church today. All these initiatives comply with the request of John Paul II that all the movements should engage in the process of growing in Ecclesial Maturity.

ICCRS – International Catholic Charismatic Renewal Services
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fierysword1920 said:
I read what it said and he did not approve of your heretical movements and speaking in tongues. We all have charisms that God bestows upon us which are virtues that are strengths and we also are given weaknesses to humble our spirits and make them right to be in reverance of God. This has absolutely nothing to do with speaking in strange tongues and falling over because supposedly the Holy Spirit baptizes somebody. That is Benny Hinn and other frauds out here the same as him, thats there stuff, not catholics. Like I say I read your posts and they are true in there proper context but not the way your movement has twisted it. The CCR is doctrinally unsound and unproven in need, it sereves no purpose and it scandalizes the wonderful things that the Church has already given us in our battle against evil and also our quest for salvation. This very movement I find smacks of evil because of it’s nature to overturn and usurp the authoruty of past church fathers who have given us law and doctrine as did the apostles before us. This CCR movement should not be grafted into the faith, it is simply useless.
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You say it is doctrinally unsound, but the evidence I (and others) have given is that it is approved by the magisterium.

If it is so doctrinally unsound why has it not been condemned by Popes & the CDF? Why is ICCRS given an office in the Vatican? Why does it have statues that have been approved by the Vatican?

If is heretical where is the condemnation of the heresy?

You seem to be pitting yourself against the magisterium here.
 
Maybe reading this book would help, by the preacher to the Papal Household

**Sober intoxication of the Spirit
**http://www.cantalamessa.org/img/libri/Sober2EN.jpg This book is a collection of teachings and meditations given at national and international meetings of the Catholic Charismatic Renewal. The only exception is the last chapter (“We Were All Made to Drink of One Spirit”) which was a meditation delivered to Pope John Paul II’s Pontifical Household and the Roman Curia.

The chapters relate to different phases of the Catholic Charismatic Renewal from its beginnings to the present, which explains the varying tones and some unavoidable repetitions of the same theme.

I dedicate this book first and foremost to my brothers and sisters in the Catholic Charismatic Renewal because much of it was born of their prayer and their inspiring love for the Word of God. “The charismatic renewal,” or, as we say in Italy, “the renewal in the Spirit,” describes the special grace diffused in the Catholic Church after the Second Vatican Council. More significantly, it also describes the path of salvation presented in Scripture to the whole Church and to every believer: “He saved us, not because of any works of righteousness that we had done, but according to his mercy, through the water of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit” (Titus 3:5).

cantalamessa.org/en/libriView.php?id=344
 
Mary_ann_R said:
DECREE ON THE APOSTOLATE OF THE LAITY
APOSTOLICAM ACTUOSITATEM
SOLEMNLY PROMULGATED BY HIS HOLINESS,
POPE PAUL VI
ON NOVEMBER 18, 1965

CHAPTER I
THE VOCATION OF THE LAITY TO THE APOSTOLATE
#3
For the exercise of this apostolate, the Holy Spirit Who sanctifies the people of God through ministry and the sacraments gives the faithful special gifts also (cf. 1 Cor. 12:7), “allotting them to everyone according as He wills” (1 Cor. 12:11) in order that individuals, administering grace to others just as they have received it, may also be “good stewards of the manifold grace of God” (1 Peter 4:10), to build up the whole body in charity (cf. Eph. 4:16).** From the acceptance of these charisms, including those which are more elementary, there arise for each believer the right and duty to use them in the Church and in the world for the good of men and the building up of the Church, in the freedom of the Holy Spirit who “breathes where He wills” (John 3:8). **This should be done by the laity in communion with their brothers in Christ, especially with their pastors who must make a judgment about the true nature and proper use of these gifts not to extinguish the Spirit but to test all things and hold for what is good (cf. 1 Thess. 5:12,19,21).(4)

vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_decree_19651118_apostolicam-actuositatem_en.html

ADDRESS OF JOHN PAUL II
TO A DELEGATION OF MEMBERS OF THE RENEWAL
IN THE HOLY SPIRIT MOVEMENT

Thursday, 14 March 2002
  1. **Yes! The Renewal in the Spirit can be considered a special gift of the Holy Spirit to the Church in our time. Born in the Church and for the Church, your movement is one in which, following the light of the Gospel, the members experience the living encounter with Jesus, fidelity to God in personal and community prayer, confident listening to his Word and a vital rediscovery of the Sacraments, not to mention courage in trials and hope in hardship. **
    **Love for the Church and submission to her Magisterium, in a process of maturing in the Church supported by a solid permanent formation are relevant signs of your intention to avoid the risk of favouring, unwittingly, a purely emotional experience of the divine, an excessive pursuit of the “extraordinary” and a private withdrawal that may shrink from apostolic outreach. **
3. On this special occasion I desire ideally to bless three projects, which you have launched, that send out groups and communities of the Renewal in the Spirit “from the Upper Room” with generous missionary ardour.

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/speeches/2002/march/documents/hf_jp-ii_spe_20020314_rinnovamento-spirito-santo_en.html

PRAYER VIGIL AND MEETING,
SOLEMNITY OF PENTECOST
MEETING WITH THE ECCLESIAL MOVEMENTS AND NEW COMMUNITIES
HOMILY OF HIS HOLINESS BENEDICT XVI

St. Peter’s Square
Saturday, 3 June 2006

Dear Brothers and Sisters,
A similar meeting that took place in this same Square on 30 May 1998 with beloved Pope John Paul II springs to mind. A great evangelizer of our time, he accompanied and guided you throughout his Pontificate.

He described your Associations and Communities on many occasions as “providential”, especially because the Sanctifying Spirit makes use of them to reawaken faith in so many Christian hearts and to reveal to them the vocation they have received with Baptism. He also helps them to be witnesses of hope filled with that fire of love which is bestowed upon us precisely by the Holy Spirit.

nsc-chariscenter.org/pentecostHomily_Benedict.htm

See also:
Father Cantalamessa: Baptism in the Spirit is not a human invention; it is a divine invention. It is a renewal of baptism and of the whole of Christian life, of all the sacraments.

Why has the Lord decided to act at this time in such a strong way? We don’t know. It is the grace of a new Pentecost.

zenit.org/article-8271?l=english
Click to expand...
There is absolutely NO endorsement of the Charismatic movement in any of the extracts above.

Can anyone underscore an “endorement” from the above ? Please?
 
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