Association with Orthodoxy

[Michaelssword]

I have quick question.

I was born and raised Catholic and received all the initiation sacraments. I fell away from the faith in my teens and wound up attending eastern orthodox services for a little over a year. When the priest wanted me to convert i backed out and didn’t go back, but I did consider it somewhat. Thankfully I wound up coming back full force into Catholicism and found a beautiful tridentine mass to attend every Sunday. I confessed this betrayal of the true faith to a priest and confessed it again to another priest to make sure it was ok and both priests absolved me. I’m just making sure I’m good to go and a member of the church and wasnt automatically excommunicated for apostasy or heresy and have to take additional steps to re-enter full communion. I may be over thinking this but I’m slightly concerned.

Thanks for the help.

 

[1ke]

If you needed to do anything else, the priest would have told you so.

Put your mind at ease, you are fine.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Going to an Orthodox Church is not apostasy or heresy. In fact, the Catholic Church herself acknowledged that the Orthodox faith is nearly identical with the Catholic faith, with only a few issues that bar us from achieving full communion.

Apostasy is to completely deny Christian faith. So if you become Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, or any other faith that does not believe in Jesus Christ, that is Apostasy.

And there is nothing heretical in Orthodox belief. We just do not agree on the position of the Bishop of Rome.

 

[Michaelssword]

Going to an Orthodox Church is not apostasy or heresy. In fact, the Catholic Church herself acknowledged that the Orthodox faith is nearly identical with the Catholic faith, with only a few issues that bar us from achieving full communion.

Apostasy is to completely deny Christian faith. So if you become Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, or any other faith that does not believe in Jesus Christ, that is Apostasy.

And there is nothing heretical in Orthodox belief. We just do not agree on the position of the Bishop of Rome.

I know of the similarities but the Catholic church is THE Christian faith which is why I worried I committed apostasy by considering leaving the church. I never formally left though which is why I wasn’t sure when apostasy is actually committed. I backed out as soon as the pressure was put on and I came back home.

 

[ConstantineTG]

I know of the similarities but the Catholic church is THE Christian faith which is why I worried I committed apostasy by considering leaving the church. I never formally left though which is why I wasn’t sure when apostasy is actually committed. I backed out as soon as the pressure was put on and I came back home.

The Orthodox Church is a true Church. Becoming Orthodox is not apostasy. In fact, even if you become Protestant it is not apostasy.

 

[Michaelssword]

The Orthodox Church is a true Church. Becoming Orthodox is not apostasy. In fact, even if you become Protestant it is not apostasy.

They deny things such as the immaculate conception and papal infallibility therefore they are not part of the one true church. They are a church which is similar to us in many aspects but they are not the church. They are guilty of schism at least which is also worthy of excommunication. I did not enter their church so I’m not worried about schism just apostasy and heresy. Although i personally never denied those things which they do, i almost entered a state where i would have. God got to me just in time i think. I’m just worried i might have excommunicated myself and would have to have that lifted.

 

[ConstantineTG]

They deny things such as the immaculate conception and papal infallibility therefore they are not part of the one true church. They are a church which is similar to us in many aspects but they are not the church. They are guilty of schism at least which is also worthy of excommunication. I did not enter their church so I’m not worried about schism just apostasy and heresy. Although i personally never denied those things which they do, i almost entered a state where i would have. God got to me just in time i think. I’m just worried i might have excommunicated myself and would have to have that lifted.

Michael, Eastern Catholics like myself believe in EVERYTHING the Orthodox believe in except that we are in communion with the Pope. How can we bear the orthodox faith and yet be Catholic? Its a lengthy discussion when I will try to explain to you about the Immaculate Conception. But in a nutshell, the Orthodox do believe that Mary is immaculate and pure and sinless from conception until dormition.

 

[Michaelssword]

Michael, Eastern Catholics like myself believe in EVERYTHING the Orthodox believe in except that we are in communion with the Pope. How can we bear the orthodox faith and yet be Catholic? Its a lengthy discussion when I will try to explain to you about the Immaculate Conception. But in a nutshell, the Orthodox do believe that Mary is immaculate and pure and sinless from conception until dormition.

I understand the differences between eastern orthodoxy and eastern Catholicism, I would have no problem attending a divine liturgy in an eastern rite church because they are submitted to the pope. The orthodox church is in schism with Rome because they don’t submit to Rome or the papacy. Its not a faith issue as much of an obedience one.

 

[ConstantineTG]

I understand the differences between eastern orthodoxy and eastern Catholicism, I would have no problem attending a divine liturgy in an eastern rite church because they are submitted to the pope. The orthodox church is in schism with Rome because they don’t submit to Rome or the papacy. Its not a faith issue as much of an obedience one.

Obedience to what? The Church doesn’t forbid us from going to an Orthodox parish. The only thing the Church says is that we cannot fulfill our Sunday and Holiday obligation in a non-Catholic Liturgy. So you can go to an Orthodox parish everyday if you want, and it is not a sin. In fact, many Eastern Catholics move between Orthodox and Eastern Catholic parishes all the time. It is not apostasy. Its the same faith. As long as you fulfill your Sunday obligation in a Catholic Liturgy, you can go to an Orthodox prayer service all you want and not commit a sin.

 

[Michaelssword]

Obedience to what? The Church doesn’t forbid us from going to an Orthodox parish. The only thing the Church says is that we cannot fulfill our Sunday and Holiday obligation in a non-Catholic Liturgy. So you can go to an Orthodox parish everyday if you want, and it is not a sin. In fact, many Eastern Catholics move between Orthodox and Eastern Catholic parishes all the time. It is not apostasy. Its the same faith. As long as you fulfill your Sunday obligation in a Catholic Liturgy, you can go to an Orthodox prayer service all you want and not commit a sin.

If it were entirely the same thing, there would be no separation. Its the same liturgy and spirituality. But they are not obedient to the papacy and are in schism. If i were to leave the church i would be in schism. I didn’t do this but i considered it I’m just worried that that was an act of schism or heresy.

 

[ConstantineTG]

If it were entirely the same thing, there would be no separation. Its the same liturgy and spirituality. But they are not obedient to the papacy and are in schism. If i were to leave the church i would be in schism. I didn’t do this but i considered it I’m just worried that that was an act of schism or heresy.

And I’m telling you it is not. Its not heresy, its not apostasy. It can only considered schism if you actually professed being part of the Orthodox Church. Merely going to Orthodox Liturgy is not an act of schism. In fact it is encouraged…

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_letters/documents/hf_jp-ii_apl_02051995_orientale-lumen_en.html

 

[thistle]

If it were entirely the same thing, there would be no separation. Its the same liturgy and spirituality. But they are not obedient to the papacy and are in schism. If i were to leave the church i would be in schism. I didn’t do this but i considered it I’m just worried that that was an act of schism or heresy.

Some extracts from Unitatis Redintegratio:

“Similarly it must not be forgotten that from the beginning the Churches of the East have had a treasury from which the Western Church has drawn extensively-in liturgical practice, spiritual tradition, and law. Nor must we undervalue the fact that it was the ecumenical councils held in the East that defined the basic dogmas of the Christian faith, on the Trinity, on the Word of God Who took flesh of the Virgin Mary. To preserve this faith these Churches have suffered and still suffer much.”

" Everyone also knows with what great love the Christians of the East celebrate the sacred liturgy, especially the eucharistic celebration, source of the Church’s life and pledge of future glory, in which the faithful, united with their bishop, have access to God the Father through the Son, the Word made flesh, Who suffered and has been glorified, and so, in the outpouring of the Holy Spirit, they enter into communion with the most holy Trinity, being made “sharers of the divine nature”. Hence, through the celebration of the Holy Eucharist in each of these churches, the Church of God is built up and grows in stature and through concelebration, their communion with one another is made manifest."

"These Churches, although separated from us, yet possess true sacraments and above all, by apostolic succession, the priesthood and the Eucharist, whereby they are linked with us in closest intimacy. **Therefore some worship in common (communicatio in sacris), given suitable circumstances and the approval of Church authority, is not only possible but to be encouraged. **

 

[Monica4316]

But we can’t go to Orthodox services if we didn’t fulfill our Sunday obligation in a Catholic church. We only fulfill our Sunday obligation in parishes in communion with Rome. And since it can be confusing, it’s perhaps safer to just attend a Catholic church only.

 

[Monica4316]

I have quick question.

I was born and raised Catholic and received all the initiation sacraments. I fell away from the faith in my teens and wound up attending eastern orthodox services for a little over a year. When the priest wanted me to convert i backed out and didn’t go back, but I did consider it somewhat. Thankfully I wound up coming back full force into Catholicism and found a beautiful tridentine mass to attend every Sunday. I confessed this betrayal of the true faith to a priest and confessed it again to another priest to make sure it was ok and both priests absolved me. I’m just making sure I’m good to go and a member of the church and wasnt automatically excommunicated for apostasy or heresy and have to take additional steps to re-enter full communion. I may be over thinking this but I’m slightly concerned.

Thanks for the help.

You didn’t actually leave the Church, and if you had, I think you’d be admitted back simply through Confession and Communion. I don’t know enough about this topic, but… I think if the priest didn’t say anything more, you’re fine if you’re really worried, talk to your priest again about this.

God bless

 

[ConstantineTG]

But we can’t go to Orthodox services if we didn’t fulfill our Sunday obligation in a Catholic church. We only fulfill our Sunday obligation in parishes in communion with Rome. And since it can be confusing, it’s perhaps safer to just attend a Catholic church only.

There is no such law in the Church that says we need to fulfill our Sunday obligation first before going to an Orthodox Liturgy. We can go to a Divine Liturgy in an Orthodox parish in the morning, then go to a Catholic Liturgy in the afternoon or evening.

The law only states that we can only fulfill our obligation in a Catholic Liturgy of any Rite. It didn’t say where you have to go first or what.

 

[Monica4316]

There is no such law in the Church that says we need to fulfill our Sunday obligation first before going to an Orthodox Liturgy. We can go to a Divine Liturgy in an Orthodox parish in the morning, then go to a Catholic Liturgy in the afternoon or evening.

The law only states that we can only fulfill our obligation in a Catholic Liturgy of any Rite. It didn’t say where you have to go first or what.

Sorry I must have just phrased it wrong, I didn’t mean to imply anything about timing

I just meant that …we need to fulfull our Sunday obligation in a Catholic Church.

As far as visiting an Orthodox church, that is really something to discuss with a priest about. It’s safer to just only attend Catholic churches, and if a person is interested in the Eastern liturgy, there’s the Eastern Catholic churches, that have the same liturgy as the Orthodox.

 

[Ken_Taki]

It is technically the same Liturgy, but little details here and there that Orthodox Liturgies don’t scrimp on make a difference. Not to mention, Orthodox parishes actually look typically like Orthodox churches, as opposed to a modern building with an Iconostasis put in and a principal Icon. In all likelyness that will be all that there is, no other Icons to be found, no painted icons on the walls. No place to light candles. People probably wont follow the deacon around when he incenses the church(theyll just look straight ahead) as well as during the processions. If ya take out the Iconostasis and stuff in the Sanctuary of course… it might just look like a protestant church.

The spirit of VII has effected Byzantine Catholic Churches as well, just not so dramatically as Latin Parishes. There is a neutered spirituality even in the Eastern Catholic churches, at least in the states. Not every parish comes remotely close to St. Elias in Toronto. Hell some Orthodox parishes arent as strict as they are, but if they arent the spirituality is still there.

I dont say this to be smug. I say this with confusion and sadness. Perhaps its a case of being neither hot nor cold…

 

[StrawberryJam]

I have quick question.

I was born and raised Catholic and received all the initiation sacraments. I fell away from the faith in my teens and wound up attending eastern orthodox services for a little over a year. When the priest wanted me to convert i backed out and didn’t go back, but I did consider it somewhat. Thankfully I wound up coming back full force into Catholicism and found a beautiful tridentine mass to attend every Sunday. I confessed this betrayal of the true faith to a priest and confessed it again to another priest to make sure it was ok and both priests absolved me. I’m just making sure I’m good to go and a member of the church and wasnt automatically excommunicated for apostasy or heresy and have to take additional steps to re-enter full communion. I may be over thinking this but I’m slightly concerned.

Thanks for the help.

Is confessing the same sins to two priests okay? After being absovled I assume?
This raises the question. Did you sin by asking for absolution when you were given absolution prior to asking a second time?

 

[Michaelssword]

Is confessing the same sins to two priests okay? After being absovled I assume?
This raises the question. Did you sin by asking for absolution when you were given absolution prior to asking a second time?

You can confess past sins as far as I know.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Sorry I must have just phrased it wrong, I didn’t mean to imply anything about timing

I just meant that …we need to fulfull our Sunday obligation in a Catholic Church.

As far as visiting an Orthodox church, that is really something to discuss with a priest about. It’s safer to just only attend Catholic churches, and if a person is interested in the Eastern liturgy, there’s the Eastern Catholic churches, that have the same liturgy as the Orthodox.

Well, Eastern Catholic parishes aren’t always available. In the Philippines for example, there are Orthodox parishes but no Eastern Catholics. There is a Syro-Malankara mission, but thats about it. If one wants a taste of Eastern Spirituality, then in such instances Orthodox is the only way to go.

I do not understand why you need to ask a priest about it. Unless you really need spiritual direction. But Blessed Pope John Paul II wrote in Orientale Lumen that he encourages Latin Rite Catholics to learn and experience the traditions of the East. So if you’re thinking about just getting permission from your priest, you don’t need it. There’s your permission right there.