Astral travel?

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Caesar

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In the lobby of my apartment building today somebody pinned up a poster advertising Astral Travel class at a local “Gnostic Center”. Needless to say, when I left the lobby the poster was balled up in the garbage can.

But this lead me to wonder, what exactly is Astral Travel? A thread was here a while ago (no doubt wiped out with the forum crash) asking about the Church’s stance on Astral travel. What is it, and why do so many people believe in it (since when googled 2,430,000 results came up)?
 
If it was you that removed and threw away the poster, I don’t think that was the right thing to do, caesar.:tsktsk:
 
Sailboat said:
If it was you that removed and threw away the poster, I don’t think that was the right thing to do, caesar.:tsktsk:
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Why not? I did it because a) I know that Astral travel is part of this New Age occult stuff, and b) posters and newsletters are not to be in the lobby: they must be placed in the mailroom.
 
Caesar said:
Why not? I did it because a) I know that Astral travel is part of this New Age occult stuff, and b) posters and newsletters are not to be in the lobby: they must be placed in the mailroom.
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If they’re not allowed, that’s one thing, But, it’s not your place to selectively censor free speech, otherwise. If you don’t like astral travel stuff, then don’t participate, but other people have a right.

I remember hearing about this back in the 70’s and it was a big fad. I think it’s probably just people’s vivid imaginations, but harmless fantasy.
 
Sailboat said:
If they’re not allowed, that’s one thing, But, it’s not your place to selectively censor free speech, otherwise. If you don’t like astral travel stuff, then don’t participate, but other people have a right.

I remember hearing about this back in the 70’s and it was a big fad. I think it’s probably just people’s vivid imaginations, but harmless fantasy.
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But what is it?
 
Sailboat said:
If they’re not allowed, that’s one thing, But, it’s not your place to selectively censor free speech, otherwise. If you don’t like astral travel stuff, then don’t participate, but other people have a right.

I remember hearing about this back in the 70’s and it was a big fad. I think it’s probably just people’s vivid imaginations, but harmless fantasy.
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Out of body experiences (astral projection) are not harmless fantasy. Trying to send your soul (or consciousness) out of your body to explore the astral plane is about as much “harmless fun” as conjuring spirits with a ouji board.

As for throwing the poster away, I’d say it was the morally responsible thing to do.
 
Astral travel deals with “Out of Body Experience”, or exiting the body in a different realm, connected to the dream realm (we see people we meet in real life in dreams), and often by a certain silver strand connected somehow to the back of the spirit-body (which for some reason appears as the regular body).

At best, this is overactive imagination and silliness. At worst, this is something supernaturally “gifted” by demonic forces.

Either way, this is serious stuff.

If there were a poster suggesting people go over to the Jones’s for ritual self-mutilation, I’d probably destroy it. This is no less serious, different only in that that damage is spiritual, and so much easier to ignore.

(EDITED TO ADD: A more loving response to the poster, rather than discarding it, would be to set another poster or tract next to this, explaining the truth of such evil acts. This preserves freedom of speech, and also shares the Truth.)
 
Sailboat said:
If they’re not allowed, that’s one thing, But, it’s not your place to selectively censor free speech, otherwise. If you don’t like astral travel stuff, then don’t participate, but other people have a right.

I remember hearing about this back in the 70’s and it was a big fad. I think it’s probably just people’s vivid imaginations, but harmless fantasy.
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I disagree. Removing the poster may have saved someone’s soul. It was the right thing to do.
 
Astral travel is also called astral projection. It is going spiritually to the “astral plane.” The astral plane is where some spirits say they exist. Google that.

My sister did that sometimes (she is a hare krishna) but she stopped because a demon came and beat her up during her experience.

A relative used to hang with people who channeled once had a channeling party where they talked to a well known “spirit” named djwal kul. He said they were spirits on the astral plane, that they used to be angels but they weren’t any more, that God gave them this planet x thousand years ago, that their were different ranks, etc. Google djwal kul.

IMO you did the right thing balling it up and tossing it out.
 
shirleytowers said:
Astral travel is also called astral projection. It is going spiritually to the “astral plane.” The astral plane is where some spirits say they exist. Google that.

My sister did that sometimes (she is a hare krishna) but she stopped because a demon came and beat her up during her experience.

A relative used to hang with people who channeled once had a channeling party where they talked to a well known “spirit” named djwal kul. He said they were spirits on the astral plane, that they used to be angels but they weren’t any more, that God gave them this planet x thousand years ago, that their were different ranks, etc. Google djwal kul.

IMO you did the right thing balling it up and tossing it out.
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Sounds creepy 😦
 
I disagree. I think that if you are going to have a free society with freedom of religion and expression, it only works if people tolerate expression of people with different viewpoints. So, if there is a community bulletin board, I think you have to not disrupt something put up there by someone you disagree with. So, if you see a poster for astral travel, the Baptist church, a Wiccan retreat, or whatever, you have to leave it alone. Otherwise, the whole usefullness of a community bulletin board is totally lost because people are ripping down the posters of other people who they disagree with.

If it’s against the rules to post something, that’s a whole other issue, but if it’s allowed, then you have to allow it for everyone, as long as it’s decent. Anyways, as far as astal travel, I think people are fooling themselves.
 
Sailboat said:
I disagree. I think that if you are going to have a free society with freedom of religion and expression, it only works if people tolerate expression of people with different viewpoints. So, if there is a community bulletin board, I think you have to not disrupt something put up there by someone you disagree with. So, if you see a poster for astral travel, the Baptist church, a Wiccan retreat, or whatever, you have to leave it alone. Otherwise, the whole usefullness of a community bulletin board is totally lost because people are ripping down the posters of other people who they disagree with.

If it’s against the rules to post something, that’s a whole other issue, but if it’s allowed, then you have to allow it for everyone, as long as it’s decent. Anyways, as far as astal travel, I think people are fooling themselves.
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What would Jesus have done? Would He have left it there? No, I don’t think so.
 
paramedicgirl said:
What would Jesus have done? Would He have left it there? No, I don’t think so.
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Jesus never barred anyone from going to worship the state gods in Rome, as far as I recall. And I think Paul talked about not causing scandal - he gave the example of, if there is food offered to some deity, sure there would be no real moral reason for you not to eat the food. However, if doing so would disrupt those people’s lives, you’re better off not doing it.

Whether or not astral projection is ‘real’, I don’t think tearing down th poster is the answer. Even if you don’t believe it’s wrong to do so, ask yourself - is it really the best way to handle it?

But I sympathize with the concern.
 
FYI, these people that are into astral projection use OOB for “out of body.” I thought I’d let you know that just in case you see it. I read a book about it once and found it VERY CREEPY indeed. Even reading this and remembering the book makes me feel creepy.

It wasn’t a public bulletin board, and I don’t think it was wrong to ball it up and throw it away. The poster was placed in the wrong area and thank God for THAT! 😉
 
Sailboat said:
I disagree. I think that if you are going to have a free society with freedom of religion and expression, it only works if people tolerate expression of people with different viewpoints. So, if there is a community bulletin board, I think you have to not disrupt something put up there by someone you disagree with. So, if you see a poster for astral travel, the Baptist church, a Wiccan retreat, or whatever, you have to leave it alone. Otherwise, the whole usefullness of a community bulletin board is totally lost because people are ripping down the posters of other people who they disagree with.

If it’s against the rules to post something, that’s a whole other issue, but if it’s allowed, then you have to allow it for everyone, as long as it’s decent. Anyways, as far as astal travel, I think people are fooling themselves.
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We are not debating the constitutional issue of the poster. We are debating the moral issue of the poster. The law of God supercedes the law of man. If removing the poster could possibly prevent a person from getting sucked into the occult, I would do it.
 
I’m really surprised that you folks would rip an astral travel poster down from a community bulletin board and think it’s all right. I don’t have any problem with caesar taking it down where it isn’t allowed to be posted. But, to think it’s okay to disrupt someone else’s freedom of religious expression, and then pat yourself on the back that you are saving them from the fires of Hell, is just too much.

The Vatican has been very clear that it values religious freedom, which means for EVERYONE! The whole idea of individual freedon just doesn’t work if it only applies to a certain group over another.

As far as Jesus, I think he only expressed outrage at improper things that went on in the Temples and Synogogues. As far as the rest of the world, he said to shake the dust from your feet, he said to turn the other cheek, he said to do unto others as you want them to do unto you.

Would you like it if someone ripped down a poster for a Catholic event?
 
Sailboat said:
Otherwise, the whole usefullness of a community bulletin board is totally lost because people are ripping down the posters of other people who they disagree with.
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That’s why I edited my post. I thought of that myself. Even with skinheads suggesting to slaughter someone by the name of…

Even then, it is not your responsibility to remove the sign as much as it is to call the police. It is not the place of the average citizen to regulate free speech.

The alternative (that is naturally the best possible alternative, because I came up with it…):
Post something that you want to say on a board containing things you disagree with. The Truth will shine past the lies.

… and no… I do not think Jesus would necessarily tear down the poster. I think he’d probably go and talk with the people who showed up about His Message.
 
TimOliv said:
We are not debating the constitutional issue of the poster. We are debating the moral issue of the poster. The law of God supercedes the law of man. If removing the poster could possibly prevent a person from getting sucked into the occult, I would do it.
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A fair point, but what if someone says that about the Catholic poster you put up, that they ripped down?

Even though they are wrong, from the standpoint of they American legal system, you have acted no better than they have. Change the rules for one group, and you change them for all groups.

Scary.
 
Saul.Tentmaker said:
A fair point, but what if someone says that about the Catholic poster you put up, that they ripped down?

Even though they are wrong, from the standpoint of they American legal system, you have acted no better than they have. Change the rules for one group, and you change them for all groups.

Scary.
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That’s right, Saul. There are some people who think Catholics are going to Hell and that we are a big cult. There are also even more people who hate the Church because it condemns Homosexual behavior, fornication, birth control, won’t let women be priests, etc. How do we like it when they rip down our posters, or try and shut us up?
 
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