Atheism - Paradox

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Well g’nite all you princes of Maine, all you kings of New England.
 
humble_in_doubt said:
Let me guess … free will? But still, you believe everything I said is true right? So then god did know Americans would divorce more frequently in the 20th and 21st centuries before he created anything. Sure, we divorce by our own volition, but logically it still must be part of god’s plan!
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Divorce part of God’s plan? No. Result of His permissive will, yes. Once He gave men free will, consequences such as divorce happen as a result of men choosing evil over good. This is why God sent His own Son to redeem us poor pitiful creatures. Jesus came to save us because of His great love for us, to show us the way to inherit eternal life if we desire to inherit eternal life. He forces no one to choose Him. However, there are always consequences for all choices made. We think, we choose, we accept consequences of choice made. All part of the gift of free will.
 
humble_in_doubt said:
especially when the continued survival of the human race would necessarily depend on incest :D:D:D:D
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There’s no need to get all excited about it… 😉
Well g’nite all you princes of Maine, all you kings of New England.
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Definitely a reference I’m not getting.
I said the man wasn’t the father of the child.
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I thought this guy’s job was to save the fetus, not to procreate with him/her after maturity.
 
happilycatholic said:
I said the man wasn’t the father of the child.
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you asked (rhetorically) what if a pregnant woman was the last person on earth … wouldn’t she be responsible for ending the human race if she had an abortion (unless I misunderstood … I think I missed a few posts of your interchange here)? Doesn’t matter who the father was.

First, we have to assume she has a son. Then, in order to ensure the continued survival of our species she has to sleep with her son. Or in the alternative she could have twins, one boy and one girl … you get the picture. Hopefully our survival as a species will never depend on such a scenario :eek:
 
humble_in_doubt said:
where you run into problems is when you start actually looking at the numbers and realize that atheists are by far better behaved and more productive citizens than the average Christian. Please demand that I begin quoting these numbers (I have my own apologetic warehouse too :p)!
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I used hypothetical numbers which Eleve gave. Not to hurt your feelings, but I am not really interested in any “godless” information from your “atheist” apologetic warehouse. 😃 I’d be “apologizing” if I was an atheist, too! 😉 (Yes, I know what apologetics are, so please don’t waste your precious “debating” time enlightening me. :p)

Well, you all continue, but I can’t think of anything else that I want to contribute. Bye all. 👋 Perhaps I’ll “see” you on another thread someday.
 
josie_L said:
:eek:
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I’m over 30 … that’s normal (for a New Yorker anyway). I like to spread the love around equitably and generously (oh yeah … and safely of course) 🙂

What’s life without love? What’s love (between a man and woman who aren’t related of course) without physical affection? I’m just trying to meet public demand (and I think all hot women should have the opportunity of a connection with my greatness).

I’m just kidding … gosh
 
Eleve said:
The unborn child is not the entirety of the human race. The end itself occurs much later than the abortion, at the death of the last surviving human.
Do you expect to change my mind by trapping me into referring to a fetus in terms of an independent person? I said “unborn child” in the last paragraph because I see no sense in using language that upsets you. That choice of words does not indicate my moral principles, except for my moral principle that hurtful language should be avoided under civil circumstances.
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Well ****. I didn’t see this one.

Why? Because again, you are determining the *when. *That makes it subjective. Of course the first part of your comment is what is clouding your judgement, IMHO. But nonetheless…

Seriously, goodnite!
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Hope3 said:
I used hypothetical numbers which Eleve gave. Not to hurt your feelings, but I am not really interested in any “godless” information from your “atheist” apologetic warehouse. 😃 I’d be “apologizing” if I was an atheist, too! 😉 (Yes, I know what apologetics are, so please don’t waste your precious “debating” time enlightening me. :p)

Well, you all continue, but I can’t think of anything else that I want to contribute. Bye all. 👋 Perhaps I’ll “see” you on another thread someday.
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awe shucks 😉
 
Eleve said:
There’s no need to get all excited about it… 😉

Definitely a reference I’m not getting.

I thought this guy’s job was to save the fetus, not to procreate with him/her after maturity.
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How bout we stop refering to the unborn as a fetus.
 
happilycatholic said:
Well ****. I didn’t see this one.

Why? Because again, you are determining the *when. *That makes it subjective. Of course the first part of your comment is what is clouding your judgement, IMHO. But nonetheless…

Seriously, goodnite!
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life begins when I say it does (didn’t you guys get the memo). I say it begins at puberty …

OK I’ll stop trolling now (I guess I’ll go to bed too). Nighty night all …
 
“Cider House Rules”. …the whole abortion back and forth thing. Is it moral, not moral and under what circumstances?

Was that a chick-flick? Well, anyway…
 
happilycatholic said:
Was that a chick-flick? Well, anyway…
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if not it sure sounds like one 😃

My real opinion is ESCR is fine … abortion is undesirable. As far as the government getting involved, almost always a bad idea (with a few exceptions, such as the military). It’s the libertarian in me (who would demolish the federal government, even education and health care spending, if it were up to me). Leave it all to the states (on that basis i.e. federalism, I find Roe v. Wade problematic; although I do also see the wisdom of that decision i.e. right to privacy based on the Fourth Amendment, so I think it’s a close call & at this point it’s too well ingrained to reverse).

If the church would give up on ESCR and take a prevention approach to abortion (rather than appealing to Uncle Sam for more intrusion into our lives) they would bother me less.
 
Eleve said:
The unborn child is not the entirety of the human race. The end itself occurs much later than the abortion, at the death of the last surviving human.

Do you expect to change my mind by trapping me into referring to a fetus in terms of an independent person? I said “unborn child” in the last paragraph because I see no sense in using language that upsets you. That choice of words does not indicate my moral principles, except for my moral principle that hurtful language should be avoided under civil circumstances.

Well, if I were the man, I would be perfectly content to let the mother make her choice. That some other man might not respect her decision does not mean that I myself regard the fetus as a human life.

Note that I do not consider a fetus to be worthless (a judgment that precludes the mother’s right to preserve whatever is inside or part of her body), nor a jumble of cells (a factually incorrect description of testable scientific nature).

I agree that murder is always wrong, although I agree with humble’s assessment that murder is by definition “killing that is wrong.” It’s been established well enough in this thread that God has, at some times and under some circumstances, willingly allowed killing.

I don’t believe in God, so I don’t think that he actually says anything about when human life begins. Why, then, shouldn’t I say that it begins at the emergence of human mental functions?
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The brain of an unborn child is in constant development so what do you mean by emergence of human mental functions?
 
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