Athiests can go to heaven?

[thistle]

Not all atheists are unbelievers in the more essential sense of the word, and so not all of them are necessarily abominable in God’s sight because they don’t believe in His existence. Surely, most of them aren’t murderers, whoremongers, and liars because they choose not to believe in the existence of God or explicitly profess faith in Jesus Christ. The truth is that even atheists or “non-believers” can please God and attain eternal life by performing acts of faith by the influence and assistance of divine grace, regardless of whether they acknowledge God’s providential care; although getting to heaven is much harder for anyone without their participation in the sacramental life of the Church and without prayer. St. Paul assures us that everyone who obeys the Mosaic moral law shall be declared righteous and just before God, including those who are unacquainted with the Torah or sacred Scripture. The requirements of the spirit of the law are written in the hearts of all human beings, and thus they are a law unto themselves. Indeed, their conscience bears witness to their moral standing with God. It’s grave voice either defends or condemns our acts from the moment they are contemplated to the time they are completed. So the secret thoughts of many shall be revealed at the final judgment in accord with the Gospel truths (Rom 2:12-16). St. John concurs: “If our hearts do not condemn us, we have boldness before God … because we obey his commandments and do whatever he asks” (1 Jn 3:22-23).

God does in fact speak to all people through their conscience which, therefore, judges whether they are assenting to a divine truth. If in a state of correctness - unimpaired by the errors of human reasoning and rationalizations - conscience acts as a judge besides as a medium of divine truth. This God given faculty which holds the divine law lies at the core of our being. It enjoins us at the appropriate moment to do good and avoid doing evil. As judge, conscience approves of our intentions and acts if they are good and denounces them if they are wicked. Meanwhile it acts as a reliable witness to the authority of truth in light of the Supreme Good towards which all human beings are drawn. Thus when we listen to the voice of our conscience, we do in fact hear God speaking to us. John H Cardinal Newman has said, “Conscience is a messenger of Him, who both in nature and grace speaks to us behind a veil, and teaches and rules us by his representative. Conscience is the aboriginal Vicar of Christ.” Hence, it is by the judgment of their conscience that even atheists may perceive and acknowledge the moral prescriptions of the divine law, making them morally accountable, just as we Christians are, for their deeds. "The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself " (Ezekiel 18:20).

Conscience naturally is the fundamental source of all moral obligation for all human beings in their relations with one another. Atheists as well can assent to a divine truth which is contained in the spirit of the law without having to open the New Testament or be a member of a Christian church. An atheist with a well-formed conscience should know just as much as a well-versed Christian does that we should love our enemies and do good to those who hate us (cf. Mt 5:44). Their conscience would certainly admonish them if they thought about doing something wicked towards their enemies or refused to act charitably towards them at the appropriate opportunity. By obeying the law written in their hearts and choosing good over evil, atheists are in fact acting in faith. Those who choose to do good to those who hate them are indeed collaborating with the Holy Spirit, who inspires and assists them with His grace. In the framework of faith, the material object of their act would be, in this case, the essential meaning and importance of the words of Christ spoken by our Lord in the Gospel in the form of a command, which would naturally thus belong to the law written in their hearts; the formal object is its character of being a divinely revealed truth which must be assented to in order to please God and remain in His grace, without which nobody can be saved. “If anyone loves me, he will keep my word; and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our abode with him” (Jn 14:23). By keeping Christ’s word as it is written in their hearts, atheists really love the Lord despite the fact they aren’t aware of it; at least they do objectively by any act of faith of theirs.

PAX

Atheists do not believe in God and they cannot get to Heaven if they die unrepentant. Anyone who consciously rejects God and dies in that state will go to Hell and most certainly is not covered by invincible ignorance.

 

[Good_Fella]

Atheists do not believe in God and they cannot get to Heaven if they die unrepentant.

Of course, but the same is true for baptized Christians who believe in God, but die unrepentant and in a state of mortal sin.

But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today” so that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have become partners in Christ, if only we hold our first confidence to the end.
Hebrews 3, 13-14

Anyone who consciously rejects God and dies in that state will go to Hell and most certainly is not covered by invincible ignorance.

Anyone who dies in the state of mortal sin has rejected God. And by that I don’t mean they have refused to believe in His existence. Some people believe in God, but sometimes they ignore Him and His word, just like some atheists might ignore their conscience by hardening their hearts to its voice. There are radical Christians who presume they are already saved, despite their grave sins. And there are atheists who think they are in no need of redemption or simply don’t feel sorry for what they’ve done despite their grave transgressions. Both parties don’t think they have to repent and thereby blaspheme against the Holy Spirit. In any event, I don’t believe that any of us will be judged whether we believed in God’s existence. Meanwhile many atheists are very close to God, although they don’t realize it.

Concerning the possibility of salvation for everyone:

All this holds true not only for Christians, but for all men of good will in whose hearts grace works in an unseen way. For, since Christ died for all men, and since the ultimate vocation of man is in fact one, and divine, we ought to believe that the Holy Spirit in a manner known only to God offers every man the possibility of being associated in the Paschal mystery.
*Guadium Et Spesteaches, 22 *

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[M1Garand]

Francis has been speaking directly from *Lumen Gentium *but Catholics would know this if they bothered to read the document:

Chap 1 sec 16

Nor is God far distant from those who in shadows and images seek the unknown God, for it is He who gives to all men life and breath and all things,(127) and as Saviour wills that all men be saved.(128) Those also can attain to salvation who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, yet sincerely seek God and moved by grace strive by their deeds to do His will as it is known to them through the dictates of conscience.(19*) Nor does Divine Providence deny the helps necessary for salvation to those who, without blame on their part, have not yet arrived at an explicit knowledge of God and with His grace strive to live a good life. Whatever good or truth is found amongst them is looked upon by the Church as a preparation for the Gospel.(20*) She knows that it is given by Him who enlightens all men so that they may finally have life. But often men, deceived by the Evil One, have become vain in their reasonings and have exchanged the truth of God for a lie, serving the creature rather than the Creator.(129) Or some there are who, living and dying in this world without God, are exposed to final despair. Wherefore to promote the glory of God and procure the salvation of all of these, and mindful of the command of the Lord, “Preach the Gospel to every creature”,(130) the Church fosters the missions with care and attention.

 

[Good_Fella]

What makes the pope think that athiests can go to heaven ?

Atheists can perform acts of divine faith by the inspiration and assistance of God’s grace as Christians are able to in their experience of faith; since their will may be moved by divine grace, their intellect can assent to a divine truth. Once a divine truth has presented itself to them from the depths of their hearts in the form of the moral law, it remains intrinsically inevident. In other words, because of its obscurity in the natural light of reason, it fails to appeal to the human intellect. Only by putting their faith in what has been dictated by their conscience could atheists love their enemies and do good to those who hate them. Not unlike Christian believers, atheists are able to assent to a divine truth upon weighing extrinsic evidence, which can only present itself by the supernatural light of faith. “Since, in the wisdom of God, the world in its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe” (1 Cor 1:21). Christians may claim that we should love our enemies and do good to those who hate us because this is a truth revealed to them by God in the deposit of faith. God can neither deceive nor be deceived. What more evidence do they need to be convinced that what they believe to be true is in fact true, although this kind of reasoning alone fails to convince their intellect and determine its assent. Atheists, on the other hand, may assert that they assent to this divine truth because their conscience enjoins them to do so. They know and admit that it’s the right thing to do, and that is reason enough for them to do it despite the pleas of their natural instincts. Their conscience cannot in the least be deceiving them, for they understand that it would be wrong for them to do otherwise. In both cases there is an appeal made to what is believed to be a higher and infallible ruling authority which transcends all natural human comprehension and fails to satisfy the mind by pure reason alone. Only, atheists are unaware that they have been touched by the light of faith, which originates from God, so that they might abide in God as Christians strive to. “If you keep my commandments, you will remain in my love; just as I kept my Father’s commandments and remain in his love” (Jn 15:10).

That we must love our enemies and do good to those who hate us is a supernatural truth. “For if you love only those who love you, what reward is there in that? Even corrupt tax collectors do that much” (Mt 5:46). All human beings need the light of faith in order to assent to this truth. Thus God gives all people who come into the world this guiding light of Christ, so that they may believe and be restored to friendship with God. “The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world” (Jn 1:9). This light enables everyone to see the divine truth and thereby assent to it, which the natural light of reason is unable to do for lack of intrinsic evidence. The light of faith isn’t an intellectual conviction, but rather a supernatural virtue, which by the inspiration and assistance of divine grace enables even atheists to believe that the material object of their belief is indubitably true, having come from a source which transcends the human mind. Now the divine proposition that we love our enemies and do good to those who hate us does not in itself compel anyone’s assent for the fact it remains intrinsically inevident to the human intellect and fails to satisfy it by reason alone. But only on condition of our assent through the grace of God can we all find what we sense our souls or inner being is yearning for; that essential extrinsic piece of evidence which eludes the intellect if left unattended by the will: the possession of God or the Supreme Good, and consequently peace within ourselves. “You will keep in perfect peace him whose mind is steadfast, because he trusts in you” (Isa 26:3). I doubt that there are atheists who have no confidence in what they perceive to be unquestionably good and the right thing to do, especially if the thought of willing something evil upon someone instead should trouble their hearts.

In Catholic theology, the act of faith is the assent of the intellect to a supernatural divine truth moved by the will. We cling to our beliefs as ardently as we do because of our will. No argument in their favour could possibly satisfy the intellect and determine its assent if left to itself, as a conclusive argument or demonstration in empirical science could. Remember human wisdom and natural instinct have their own sets of obscure arguments to present to the human mind when a moral choice is presented to us. Thus when we ask ourselves whether we should give our assent to any divine statement, and that includes those fundamental tenets of the Faith which we profess to believe in when we recite the Nicene Creed at Holy Mass, we sense that we cannot do so unless there be credible extrinsic evidence in its favour which allows our will to determine the intellect’s assent to a truth which is beyond its grasp in the natural light of reason. Without the light of faith, then, which enables us to see the divine truth, none of us can ever hope to give our assent and possess God or the Supreme Good and enjoy His peace. In the words of St. Thomas Aquinas: “The disposition of the believer is that of one who accepts another’s word for some statement, because it seems fitting and useful to do so.”

PAX

 

[Jon_S_1]

Atheists can perform acts of divine faith by the inspiration and assistance of God’s grace as Christians are able to in their experience of faith; since their will may be moved by divine grace, their intellect can assent to a divine truth. Once a divine truth has presented itself to them from the depths of their hearts in the form of the moral law, it remains intrinsically inevident. In other words, because of its obscurity in the natural light of reason, it fails to appeal to the human intellect. Only by putting their faith in what has been dictated by their conscience could atheists love their enemies and do good to those who hate them. Not unlike Christian believers, atheists are able to assent to a divine truth upon weighing extrinsic evidence, which can only present itself by the supernatural light of faith. “Since, in the wisdom of God, the world in its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe” (1 Cor 1:21). Christians may claim that we should love our enemies and do good to those who hate us because this is a truth revealed to them by God in the deposit of faith. God can neither deceive nor be deceived. What more evidence do they need to be convinced that what they believe to be true is in fact true, although this kind of reasoning alone fails to convince their intellect and determine its assent. Atheists, on the other hand, may assert that they assent to this divine truth because their conscience enjoins them to do so. They know and admit that it’s the right thing to do, and that is reason enough for them to do it despite the pleas of their natural instincts. Their conscience cannot in the least be deceiving them, for they understand that it would be wrong for them to do otherwise. In both cases there is an appeal made to what is believed to be a higher and infallible ruling authority which transcends all natural human comprehension and fails to satisfy the mind by pure reason alone. Only, atheists are unaware that they have been touched by the light of faith, which originates from God, so that they might abide in God as Christians strive to. “If you keep my commandments, you will remain in my love; just as I kept my Father’s commandments and remain in his love” (Jn 15:10).

That we must love our enemies and do good to those who hate us is a supernatural truth. “For if you love only those who love you, what reward is there in that? Even corrupt tax collectors do that much” (Mt 5:46). All human beings need the light of faith in order to assent to this truth. Thus God gives all people who come into the world this guiding light of Christ, so that they may believe and be restored to friendship with God. “The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world” (Jn 1:9). This light enables everyone to see the divine truth and thereby assent to it, which the natural light of reason is unable to do for lack of intrinsic evidence. The light of faith isn’t an intellectual conviction, but rather a supernatural virtue, which by the inspiration and assistance of divine grace enables even atheists to believe that the material object of their belief is indubitably true, having come from a source which transcends the human mind. Now the divine proposition that we love our enemies and do good to those who hate us does not in itself compel anyone’s assent for the fact it remains intrinsically inevident to the human intellect and fails to satisfy it by reason alone. But only on condition of our assent through the grace of God can we all find what we sense our souls or inner being is yearning for; that essential extrinsic piece of evidence which eludes the intellect if left unattended by the will: the possession of God or the Supreme Good, and consequently peace within ourselves. “You will keep in perfect peace him whose mind is steadfast, because he trusts in you” (Isa 26:3). I doubt that there are atheists who have no confidence in what they perceive to be unquestionably good and the right thing to do, especially if the thought of willing something evil upon someone instead should trouble their hearts.

In Catholic theology, the act of faith is the assent of the intellect to a supernatural divine truth moved by the will. We cling to our beliefs as ardently as we do because of our will. No argument in their favour could possibly satisfy the intellect and determine its assent if left to itself, as a conclusive argument or demonstration in empirical science could. Remember human wisdom and natural instinct have their own sets of obscure arguments to present to the human mind when a moral choice is presented to us. Thus when we ask ourselves whether we should give our assent to any divine statement, and that includes those fundamental tenets of the Faith which we profess to believe in when we recite the Nicene Creed at Holy Mass, we sense that we cannot do so unless there be credible extrinsic evidence in its favour which allows our will to determine the intellect’s assent to a truth which is beyond its grasp in the natural light of reason. Without the light of faith, then, which enables us to see the divine truth, none of us can ever hope to give our assent and possess God or the Supreme Good and enjoy His peace. In the words of St. Thomas Aquinas: “The disposition of the believer is that of one who accepts another’s word for some statement, because it seems fitting and useful to do so.”

PAX

So what your saying basically is, “if your a good person you go to heaven by merit of your good works since your good works came from God”

And Jesus died why?

 

[Good_Fella]

What makes the pope think that athiests can go to heaven?

Just as the human intellect needs the divine light of faith to assent to a spiritual truth by the movement of the will, so too our will depends on divine grace to be directed towards that supernatural good that is eternal life. And just as the light of faith is a divine gift from God supernaturally bestowed on the human mind, so too is that divine grace which moves the will a supernatural gift from God. Neither gift is the result of diligent study or human exposure; neither can either of these gifts be the product of human endeavour. St. Paul teaches us that “when the Gentiles. who do not possess the law, do instinctively what the law requires, these though not having the law are a law to themselves. They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, to which their own conscience bears witness” (Rom 2:14-15). It is through the light of faith that all of us come to know what is supernaturally true and understand what is the righteous thing to do strictly for the sake of goodness and right. Our conscience could never be stirred if it weren’t for this divine light. Indeed, we wouldn’t even have a moral conscience if God didn’t exist. There is no natural reason for us to love our enemies and do good to those who hate us unless we may procure some material gain or advantage over our enemies out of selfish interest - like a corrupt tax collector might. True charity is a virtue infused into our souls by the grace of God. All people who do good to those who hate them for their sake do what the moral law of freedom written on their hearts requires by the grace of God. Merit before God is due where grace has been given and faithfully received. “God will repay each person according to what they have done…There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil; first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. For God does not show favoritism” (Rom 2:6-11).

Hence, the act of faith is the assent of the intellect to a supernatural truth which eludes its comprehension, but which it does accept by the movement of the will under the influence of divine grace. Reason alone cannot convince the mind that what seems credibly true is in fact true. As an infused virtue, faith is a supernatural habit by which we can firmly believe those things which God has revealed to us, whether through the Church as the Rule of Faith or our conscience. The perfection of faith, therefore, depends on how effectively the intellect and the will perform their given tasks. Atheists may love their enemies and do good to those who hate them as well as any Christian might. It is sufficient for them that their conscience has spoken to them despite any objections raised by their natural instincts and any arguments which disapprove and are presented to the intellect. They also may act in a way that seems morally proper, although there is no natural reason for it; they simply choose to do what they believe is the right thing to do. In fact, they know how they should act towards their enemies through the voice of conscience. That supernatural light which illuminates the human mind and prompts the will to respond by the inspiration and assistance of divine grace enables even atheists to act on principles which remain obscure in the natural light of reason and alien to the wisdom of this world. “Faith is the conviction of things unseen” (Heb 11:1). Since faith is the substance of what remains intrinsically inevident, it serves to grant us not a conception or demonstrative proof, but rather an inspired appreciation for the divine truth because of its appeal to our souls. Such appreciation can only be stirred by the activity of the Holy Spirit, since the formal object of our faith is divine, having originated from God.

This habitual promptitude or constancy of the will to tend towards God or the Supreme Good and move the intellect to assent to a divine supernatural truth, revealed to us by the light of faith, is precisely what gives this assent its virtuous and meritorious quality. What pleases God is that we love our enemies and do good to those who hate us out of sincere charity. For St. Augustine, believing in God essentially meant loving him by believing, and going to Him by believing this way. And unless we love our neighbour, we cannot rightly claim that we love God and possess a steadfastness of love for Him, which faith essentially means in the Hebrew OT. Atheists of good will may show true faith in God by believing in the Supreme Good because they love what is good; only their adoration of the Divine Essence rests in a form of preconscious state. A person might not notice that they are doing something in particular unless it is pointed out to them. It is the wicked and unfaithful who loathe what is righteous, as they choose to walk in darkness because of their inordinate pride. The Doctor and Father of the Church adds: “This then is the faith God demands of us; and he finds not what he may demand except where he has given what he may find.” Thus atheists may be unfamiliar with many divine moral truths which have been revealed to us in sacred Scripture. But God does speak to them through the voice of conscience and allows them to see through the light of faith how they should conduct their lives in a manner which pleases Him. And he may inspire and assist them with the help of his grace. Those who obstinately refuse to listen to what God has implanted in them so that they should know better, and spurn His charity and grace shall have no excuse on the Day of Judgment. Faith that saves is a living faith. Faith that merely hears and knows, but is uninformed by charity and untranslated into acts of love, is a dead faith which cannot benefit any human soul.

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[Good_Fella]

So what your saying basically is, “if your a good person you go to heaven by merit of your good works since your good works came from God”

And Jesus died why?

Not that I seek the gift, but I seek the fruit that increases to your credit.
Philippians 4, 17

Jesus died and rose from the dead to merit for us justifying and sanctifying grace, without which we cannot be saved. The merits we gain upon the initial grace of forgiveness by no preceding merit of ours grant us further graces as we bear fruit through the dispensation of divine grace which increases our justification and sanctification simultaneously for the attainment of salvation. All graces we receive from God proceed from His mercy. God does not owe us anything, for without God we can do nothing which pleases Him. Good works performed in charity and grace are necessary for our salvation, but salvation isn’t earned as something God owes us like a just wage. We can never possibly place God in our debt. But our salvation is what God rewards us with in His merciful love for the fruit we have borne through the inspiration and assistance of His grace. Salvation is something we are called to “work out” in fear and trembling (Phil 2:12), not “work for” under any confident assumption. All this has been made possible by the passion and death of our Lord.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not by works so that no one can boast. For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
Ephesians 2, 8-10

Jesus has freed us from the curse of the works of the law (Acts 13:19; Gal 3:13; 4:4-5), meaning that we can never hope to reconcile ourselves with God by placing him in our debt for having observed the law perfectly without the help of his grace. So we have no cause to boast before Him. Indeed, works of the law only remind us just how imperfect and sinful we naturally are (Gal 3:19). But God has given us grace in His mercy, through the merits of Jesus Christ, to do good works in charity and grace in order to please Him and receive our gratuitous reward despite our failings. Thus it’s necessary that we do good works in a humble and contrite manner because of our sins. Our acts of faith must be those of a repentant faith (Ps 51:17). Our relationship with God the Father is a familial one, on which we helplessly rely on Him with childlike trust, not a legal one as it became for many of the scribes and Pharisees. (Rom 8:14-17; Heb 12:5-11; Lk 18:9-14).

"Truly, I tell you. unless you change and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever becomes humble like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven."
Matthew 18, 3-4

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[HardRockGTR]

That passage in the OP is honestly offensive, putting unbelievers in the same league as “whoremongers” and “liars” and “murderers”. If there’s a passage in the bible that inspires anybody to become a Catholic, it certainly is not that one.

 

[Jon_S_1]

That passage in the OP is honestly offensive, putting unbelievers in the same league as “whoremongers” and “liars” and “murderers”. If there’s a passage in the bible that inspires anybody to become a Catholic, it certainly is not that one.

I get why you might feel that way.

If people ascribe to a works based salvation then sure it’s offensive. I mean you may be doing lots of good works and why should you be lumped on with evil doers.

Christianity is not a works based salvation though.

This passage describes people that do not put faith in God. People that do not believe in God. So from that perspective perhaps you can better understand the grouping.

God loves you, he desires for you to accept his gracious gifts and be saved from ourselves.

Peace

 

[HardRockGTR]

Belief is not a choice though. And if it were, then works are ultimately what matters, if “believing” is considered a work.

Also, it’s not fair that a non-believer who dedicates his life to philanthropy and does his best to do the right thing ultimately gets infinite punishment, when Tomas de Torquemada is considered a martyr of Catholicism.

 

[Good_Fella]

Belief is not a choice though. And if it were, then works are ultimately what matters, if “believing” is considered a work.

If belief isn’t a choice, then what is it?
Anyway, there is no opposition between faith and works. They are two sides of the same coin.

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[HardRockGTR]

If belief isn’t a choice, then what is it?

PAX

Belief is a belief. That’s really all it is. It’s what knowledge, logic, and experience ultimately amounts to. If my knowledge doesn’t permit me to believe, then I cannot believe. Asking me to* choose* to believe is like asking me to choose to fly.

 

[Good_Fella]

Belief is a belief. That’s really all it is. It’s what knowledge, logic, and experience ultimately amounts to. If my knowledge doesn’t permit me to believe, then I cannot believe. Asking me to* choose* to believe is like asking me to choose to fly.

But faith is the substance of what isn’t intrinsically evident to the human mind. People do choose to believe in God despite the fact His existence cannot be empirically demonstrated and proven like a geometric theorem. They could only know with intellectual certainty that God exists if He appeared to them and completely satisfied their finite ability to fully comprehend His being, which they couldn’t possibly do in their present natural state even if He did. Even in scientific enquiries people choose to place their faith in arguments which they believe sound more credible than others before a decisive conclusion is ever reached. It’'s a question of weighing probabilities. Espousing a theory is a matter of faith that rests upon extrinsic evidence. Thus the will moves the assent of their intellect as long as conclusive empirical evidence is lacking but there are strong arguments in their favour which warrant their beliefs. So many scientists and differing schools of scientific thought continue to pursue their theories to prove each other wrong. Only sure knowledge that God doesn’t exist won’t permit people to believe in God. But as long as their intellects cannot be satisfied by the intrinsic evidence it needs, some will choose to believe in His existence on motives of credibility.

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[HardRockGTR]

Other problems arise from that however. Which God (or gods) do I put my faith in? And once I do, which branch of the religion that worships that God do I join?

 

[Good_Fella]

Other problems arise from that however. Which God (or gods) do I put my faith in? And once I do, which branch of the religion that worships that God do I join?

A priest once asked a group of us during a spiritual retreat why we believed in God? All the answers were based on arguments which we felt warranted our beliefs and implied what the priest had in mind and told us: “We believe in God because we want to?” Unless we wanted to freely accept as being true that which cannot be empirically demonstrated and proven, we couldn’t possibly have made an appeal to arguments which we felt favoured our belief and affected our will to move the intellect’s assent. The same goes for espousing a particular religious persuasion. Some people choose to become or stay Catholic, Protestant, Muslim, or Hindu because they want to for a variety of appealing reasons. Meanwhile none of them can actually ever know with certainty that their religion is the true one. Deductive reasoning and logic has its limits. The formal object of their beliefs holds no place in natural science as theories do. So only their will to believe can determine the assent of their intellect after they weigh opposing arguments through reasoning, while the truth which is sought remains beyond the grasp of the intellect. If we ask a theist why they believe in God, they might say something like “Because He probably exists.” And if we ask the inductive question, “What makes you think He exists?” they might reply “The sun will set at the same time today as it did last year and will next year.” (The argument from cosmic order).An atheist, on the other hand, may say, “I don’t believe in God because of all the suffering in the world.” (The problem of evil). What motivates both parties to give their assent to what appears to be true, but remains uncertain, are credible objects of thought which rely on a measure of probability.

Unlike obtained and certain knowledge, belief is something essentially subjective. I like to define belief as knowing something to be objectively true or real through what I have experientially perceived of that object which escapes my mind’s grasp. In this sense, faith is not blind. Unless we are taught by an astro-physicist, having put our trust in their authority, how it is that the sun will set at the same time of day next year as it has this year, we must rely solely on the authority of our experience of sunsets. Knowledge and belief are two different things as are the intellect and the will. We can never will to fly like a bird because we are in no position to learn how to fly like one. The most we can do is flap our arms or mimic a chirp. But as long as we are able to learn or discover something obtainable by ourselves through a natural capacity, our will may determine the intellect’s assent regardless of whether the intellect can grasp the formal object of thought upon obtaining intrinsic evidence. Our intellect’s assent to the fact that the sun will set at the same time next year as it has this year and had set last year is determined by our will, since our minds must rely on extrinsic evidence presented through experience and our faith in modern science before we might comprehend the formal principles of physics by ourselves. The same applies to our Catholic faith. We may appeal to our spiritual experiences and the divine teaching authority of the Church when we explain to someone why we believe in God. However, faith in this sense isn’t a virtue because it relies solely on natural reasoning and motives of credibility apart from the infusion of God’s grace and the light which only He can provide us with, since the formal object presented to our mind is itself supernatural and Divine. We have no natural capacity to know with absolute certainty that God exists. The infused virtue of faith is the substance of what appears not to the intellect.

Viewers might be interested in seeing the list of 20 Arguments for the Existence of God, presented by Peter Kreeft.

peterkreft.com//topics-more/20_arguments-god’s-existence.htm

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[HardRockGTR]

Thank you for the post. I still rationalize and study the universe as well as philosophy and theology, if not mostly out of curiosity. However, I often feel like I’m in the middle of a spiritual or intellectual tug-of-war between different ideologies.

 

[Good_Fella]

Thank you for the post. I still rationalize and study the universe as well as philosophy and theology, if not mostly out of curiosity. However, I often feel like I’m in the middle of a spiritual or intellectual tug-of-war between different ideologies.

My pleasure. I suppose theologians continue to study and rationalize God’s revelation to humankind. Perhaps they have chosen their field of study not only out of interest, but also because of curiosity and getting to what they sense is out there. Like all of us, they have a human nature. Tugs of war have played a central part in the development of Church dogma through the centuries with different schools of thought presenting their particular and opposing views on what has rudimentarily been revealed in sacred Scripture and transmitted more explicitly through the course of sacred Tradition.

PAX

 

[M1Garand]

But faith is the substance of what isn’t intrinsically evident to the human mind. People do choose to believe in God despite the fact His existence cannot be empirically demonstrated and proven like a geometric theorem. They could only know with intellectual certainty that God exists if He appeared to them and completely satisfied their finite ability to fully comprehend His being, which they couldn’t possibly do in their present natural state even if He did. Even in scientific enquiries people choose to place their faith in arguments which they believe sound more credible than others before a decisive conclusion is ever reached. It’'s a question of weighing probabilities. Espousing a theory is a matter of faith that rests upon extrinsic evidence. Thus the will moves the assent of their intellect as long as conclusive empirical evidence is lacking but there are strong arguments in their favour which warrant their beliefs. So many scientists and differing schools of scientific thought continue to pursue their theories to prove each other wrong. Only sure knowledge that God doesn’t exist won’t permit people to believe in God. But as long as their intellects cannot be satisfied by the intrinsic evidence it needs, some will choose to believe in His existence on motives of credibility.

PAX

fantastic post!