Attachments to another

[cynic]

Is it sinful to be attached to another, let’s say to your husband or wife? The impression I get from these boards is that emotional attachments within marriage are viewed as not much more than the neccessary precursor to reproduction, not an end in intself. Is it ok to marry simply because you want to be with someone (while being open to the possibility of children), or should we view marriage in a more detached manner, something to glorify God etc? Is it ok tio be ‘happy’ while in the company of your spouse or is this a mere ‘worldly attachment’?

 

[Della]

No one ought to love anyone more than we love God, but having said that, it is perfectly natural and proper to have affection/love for one’s spouse, children, friends, etc.

And, loving companionship is one good reason for getting married, but it shouldn’t be the only one. That’s not a good reason, all by itself for anyone to get married, even if we leave faith out of the picture.

Loving another means giving of oneself to another, not simply liking him or desiring to be with him or how another makes us feel. The high divorce rate tells us the foolishness of approaching marriage with such an immature attitude towards the married state.

 

[HailMary]

if by “attached” you mean love, of course we are supposed be attached.

Ephesians 5:31:
“For this cause a man will leave his father and mother, and will be joined to his wife. The two will become** one flesh.**”

 

[Bruised_Reed]

Is it sinful to be attached to another, let’s say to your husband or wife? The impression I get from these boards is that emotional attachments within marriage are viewed as not much more than the neccessary precursor to reproduction, not an end in intself. Is it ok to marry simply because you want to be with someone (while being open to the possibility of children), or should we view marriage in a more detached manner, something to glorify God etc? Is it ok tio be ‘happy’ while in the company of your spouse or is this a mere ‘worldly attachment’?

God is loved before one’s spouse or children; it’s not at their exclusion. Can you give some example of the things that gave you this impression? Because inspite of the various wacky opinions of some, this isn’t church teaching or Catholic practice.

 

[cynic]

Della;:

Loving another means giving of oneself to another, not simply liking him or desiring to be with him or how another makes us feel. The high divorce rate tells us the foolishness of approaching marriage with such an immature attitude towards the married state.

ok common sense would tell someone that it’s not a good idea to marry with that attitude. But that’s not really what was meant.
The attitude to marriage seems to be a little like… you reach an appropriate age, you find someone suitable for marriage - same faith and with the same goals (a family) - and you then choose to love them. Pure love is really loving God through them. Put simply is it good or bad to desire a particular person?

 

[gardenswithkids]

Is it sinful to be attached to another, let’s say to your husband or wife?

Absolutely not sinful whatsoever. Such attachment is fitting in marriage. The love between husband and wife should emulate the love Christ has for His bride, the Church. As St. Paul writes “Husbands love your wives as Christ loves the Church.”

The impression I get from these boards is that emotional attachments within marriage are viewed as not much more than the neccessary precursor to reproduction, not an end in intself.

What a depressing impression you have of us. Spouses shouldn’t merely “use” the other for reproduction. Reproduction should flow from love. Love between husband and wife takes creates their children.

Is it ok to marry simply because you want to be with someone (while being open to the possibility of children), or should we view marriage in a more detached manner, something to glorify God etc? Is it ok tio be ‘happy’ while in the company of your spouse or is this a mere ‘worldly attachment’?

A happy mariage does give glory to God; He is the author of marriage. Yes, it’s okay to want to be with one’s spouse! Not all “worldly attachments” are bad; it is entirely proper for spouses to be “attached” both emotionally (and sometimes even physically. )

 

[trogiah]

After the creation of the world, but before the fall of man, God looked at what he had made and said. “It is not good that the man is alone, I will make a suitable helpmate for him.”

It was pointed out to me once that this is the only time anything regarding creation was not found to be “good” before the fall of man.

In any case, God didn’t say, “It is not good that the man does not have some way to reproduce himself. - I will make someone to help him do that.”

I feel certain that the best thing a person can do for their spouse is to be good company - someone to share life with and to give and receive encouragement for getting through life. It seems that a certain measure of “attachment” is unavoidable and not at all contrary to God’s plan. So long as that attachment doesn’t take one away from God.

peace

Jim

 

[cynic]

trying to put it another way…

Worldly view of marriage:
“I love you, therefore I choose to marry you”

Catholic view :
“I have chosen to marry you, and because of that, I love you”

 

[HailMary]

trying to put it another way…

Worldly view of marriage:
“I love you, therefore I choose to marry you”

Catholic view :
“I have chosen to marry you, and because of that, I love you”

I would not reduce the Catholic view of marriage to that. Love can precede in Sacramental Marriage before the the “I do”. But this is not true in all cases, in arranged marriages, the love matures but the choice came first.

 

[gardenswithkids]

trying to put it another way…

Worldly view of marriage:
“I love you, therefore I choose to marry you”

Catholic view :
“I have chosen to marry you, and because of that, I love you”

Or perhaps another way:
Worldy view of marriage: “I once loved you and therefore chose to marry you thinking you’d make me happy: you didn’t make me happy, I no longer love you, therefore I now choose to divorce you.”

Catholic view of marriage: "My love for you grows and matures each day through the committment we made to each other in marriage. I find happiness in living out our covenant together, in good times and in bad, in sickness and in health, until death parts us. "

 

[carol_marie]

Or perhaps another way:
Worldy view of marriage: “I once loved you and therefore chose to marry you thinking you’d make me happy: you didn’t make me happy, I no longer love you, therefore I now choose to divorce you.”

Catholic view of marriage: "My love for you grows and matures each day through the committment we made to each other in marriage. I find happiness in living out our covenant together, in good times and in bad, in sickness and in health, until death parts us. "

Excellent!

 

[cynic]

Catholic view of marriage: "My love for you grows and matures each day through the committment we made to each other in marriage. I find happiness in living out our covenant together, in good times and in bad, in sickness and in health, until death parts us. "

so…

“I am living out a moral and spiritual committment to the ideal of marriage, and you are the one I’m marrried to”

World: committment should come from love
Catholicism/Christianity: Love should come from committment

Correct?

 

[Bruised_Reed]

so…

“I am living out a moral and spiritual committment to the ideal of marriage, and you are the one I’m marrried to”

World: committment should come from love
Catholicism/Christianity: Love should come from committment

Correct?

I think I have a problem with the word “should”. In either sentance.

“Love should come from committment” sounds like attitude regarding arranged marriages which is contrary to Catholic teaching. The Catholic view is both, in a full circle kind of way. Committment is an act of free will and maturity.

I think the world sees love as a feeling and not an action and if you don’t feel that feeling anymore you can move on even if things get tough. What gardenswithkids offered is a fuller view of love; iron sharpening iron, becoming stronger, deeper and perfected.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

Cynic, I’m not sure if this will help but this link discusses the four levels of love.You suggested the attachment between husband and wife in the first post but I didn’t interpret that as the only relationship to consider. It doesn’t speak to “attachment” specifically, but with semantics and all I’m not sure what you are ultimately searching out.

 

[BlestOne]

Or perhaps another way:
Worldy view of marriage: “I once loved you and therefore chose to marry you thinking you’d make me happy: you didn’t make me happy, I no longer love you, therefore I now choose to divorce you.”

Catholic view of marriage: "My love for you grows and matures each day through the committment we made to each other in marriage. I find happiness in living out our covenant together, in good times and in bad, in sickness and in health, until death parts us. "

Awesome!!! I love your answer!

 

[cynic]

Cynic, I’m not sure if this will help but this link discusses the four levels of love.You suggested the attachment between husband and wife in the first post but I didn’t interpret that as the only relationship to consider. It doesn’t speak to “attachment” specifically, but with semantics and all I’m not sure what you are ultimately searching out.

it seems like Catholics believe there are two types of love : 1.the selfish kind where one person feels affection for another, likes/admires them personally 2. or the pure kind where one person decides to show love based on a command to love.

1 is considered and added extra, the icing on the cake of marriage but ultimately unimportant, while 2 is considered the foundation of marriage. My question was how good is it to be personally attached to someone if the foundation of marriage is (or should be) something entirely impersonal?

 

[Polaris]

I do not know if attachment is a sin but Catholics as a culture definately do not approve of strong attachments of loved ones, especially dead ones, and they definately place the importance of reproducing above love. Ask any widow or widower, who really loved there spouse and they will tell you how many of there Catholic friends tell you to move on, so you can have kids. I know I for one am sick of that. Also this is the one thing I find odd when they talk about attachment seperates us from God. The love of my wife brought me closer to God, and she still does Its the ones who tell me that I do not have a relationship with her or should not have any attachments to her anymore, that drives me more away from the love of God then anything else.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

it seems like Catholics believe there are two types of love : 1.the selfish kind where one person feels affection for another, likes/admires them personally 2. or the pure kind where one person decides to show love based on a command to love.

1 is considered and added extra, the icing on the cake of marriage but ultimately unimportant, while 2 is considered the foundation of marriage. My question was how good is it to be personally attached to someone if the foundation of marriage is (or should be) something entirely impersonal?

You know, I think you picked one of the most complex subjects ever: Love.

Now I’m not sure how you mean attachment. Affection, like snuggling a baby or a passionate kiss between a husband and wife? Not wanting to or not being able to imagine ever being without that person?

I think you may be trying to keep two things separate when they are complementary. Many other religions are “either/or” and Catholicism is “both”, i.e. faith/works, free will/predestination, and others I can’t think of now. Try seeing that they are both a part of the ebb and flow of a relationship. I also think you are stuck thinking of Catholicism’s version of love as, to use your word, impersonal. And I think love is always personal.

I’m doing this on the fly so bear with my imprecision, but the Greeks recognized 4 types of love: agape, erotic, philial and storge. I was was asked (in a group) which kind of love was needed for marriage. Most answered agape. I answered, “all tof them” which ended up being the correct answer (so briliant am I). I think when it comes down to it we are to love as God loves and I think he loves us each way, perfectly. Pope JPII’s Theology of the Body discusses how marriage is a glimpse into how God loves us. That maybe something you could delve into to get a deeper answer. Love is pretty big to try to cover in an Internet forum. I would suggest reading or listening to good Catholic resources on the subject if you really want an answer. I don’t think you can get a simple answer to your question.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

I do not know if attachment is a sin but Catholics as a culture definately do not approve of strong attachments of loved ones, especially dead ones, and they definately place the importance of reproducing above love. Ask any widow or widower, who really loved there spouse and they will tell you how many of there Catholic friends tell you to move on, so you can have kids. I know I for one am sick of that. Also this is the one thing I find odd when they talk about attachment seperates us from God. The love of my wife brought me closer to God, and she still does Its the ones who tell me that I do not have a relationship with her or should not have any attachments to her anymore, that drives me more away from the love of God then anything else.

I have never heard this nor can I imagine any thoughtful Catholic saying this (in bold). The whole concept of moving on is not one held by Catholics but by people who don’t know what to say to a greiving person. Having grieved the loss of someone I hoped to marry I can attest to the insensitive and thoughless things that were said but they had no Catholic context. There may be individual Catholics who hold to the attitudes to mentioned above but they could be held by a person of any faith or no faith at all.

 

[cynic]

Not wanting to or not being able to imagine ever being without that person?

.

that is what I meant by it.
The link provided paints a pretty bleak picture. Love can either be about selfish pleasure (to ‘love’ someone because they are pretty to look at) or entirely about loving God (ie nothing to do with the individuality of the person you’re married to, they are special because they happen to be your spouse and you have a duty towards them), which is kind of the answer I expected. So considering this, it’s hard to see how
“not being able to imagine ever being without that person” could be looked on as a proper motivation for marriage.