Authority and Eastern Catholicism

[Annie77]

Do Eastern Catholics adhere to the Catechism of the Catholic Church? I’ve read threads here that suggest they are permitted to stay within their own theological heritage. What happens when their own theological traditions, which are the fruit of their particular liturgies, diverges from the Latin formulation of theology present in the catechism?

I’m also curious about initiation. If a non-Catholic is confirmed as a adult in a Latin church, she affirms belief in everything that the church teaches as having been revealed by God. What is a non-Catholic coming into an Eastern rite asked to affirm? The same?

I’m asking these things because my own beliefs–and I have studied the history of Christian theology extensively–fall somewhere between East and West. Orthodoxy is not an option. Roman Catholicism is not an option because I dissent from specific doctrines that I think are part of Latin theology but are not necessary to an Eastern theology–like the specific formulation of the Immaculate Conception, which seems unnecessary given an Eastern understanding of original sin.

Latin Rite Catholics continue to tell me to submit to Rome, that my problem is the sin of pride and rebellion against Rome’s authority. Orthodox folk tell me to renounce my Western heresies and fully embrace the East. I continue to feel like I stand somewhere in between.

 

[Aramis]

The dogmas are the same. Some doctrines are not actively taught in the ECCs, but yes, the CCC is “universal.”

 

[laura_kathleen]

First thing, if you are having trouble submitting to Rome then you should know that the Eastern Catholic Churches recognize the primacy of the Pope and therefore they do not offer you a safe haven away from him. I can relate in being too rebellious to submit to Rome, especially the current occupant, but in that respect I think it is something to pray about and to realize that in end he doesnt affect your life that much. The Eastern Churches have much more in common with the Orthodox Churches when it comes to the way that they view theology than they do with the Roman Catholic Church, I would suggest discerning over how much of the Catholic belief you agree with, especially the big deal things, like real presence in the Eucharist, the sacraments, grace, etc. As far as an adult being baptized into the Eastern Rite they baptized, Eucharize, and Confirm all at the same time no matter what age the person is so it would not be hard to be initiated. I also think that if you have grown up in the West that you will have a tough time truly embracing the way that the East believes, and that is really the biggest difference, the way that they believe not what they believe. As far as the Catechism goes, all it is is a collection of the theology of the Church, there is no new information in it, it is an easy go to book if you are too lazy to look up where the theoogy actually comes from, and no the Eastern Rites do not follow our Catechism.

 

[Annie77]

I would suggest discerning over how much of the Catholic belief you agree with, especially the big deal things, like real presence in the Eucharist, the sacraments, grace, etc.

I agree with everything except a handful of dogmas that I think are too narrowly defined to be useful.

As far as an adult being baptized into the Eastern Rite they baptized, Eucharize, and Confirm all at the same time no matter what age the person is so it would not be hard to be initiated.

I’m already baptized. I think rebaptism is an affront to the Holy Spirit.

I also think that if you have grown up in the West that you will have a tough time truly embracing the way that the East believes, and that is really the biggest difference, the way that they believe not what they believe. As far as the Catechism goes, all it is is a collection of the theology of the Church, there is no new information in it, it is an easy go to book if you are too lazy to look up where the theoogy actually comes from, and no the Eastern Rites do not follow our Catechism.

This is good advice, but I do have two advanced degrees in Theology.

And that’s where I come back to that the issue isn’t rebellion per se. It’s a question of identity and integrity for me. I’m already far more in line with official teaching than most Catholics I know because I know it better. But there are specific points at which I am more convinced by Eastern theologies. That isn’t to say I think the West in heretical. I don’t and it’s a key reason I can’t be Orthodox. I just want to understand how Eastern Catholics navigate the catechism and maintain their identity.

 

[Annie77]

I feel like I should clarify, I don’t actually mean I’m more in line with Catholic teaching than most Catholics. I really do mean most Catholics I know. I happen to know a lot of Catholics who either don’t know the content very well or who are loyal dissenters from official teaching.

 

[5Loaves]

Glory to Jesus Christ!
Welcome Annie77-

An important shift that occurred during the Second Vatican Council was the clarity of the need to preserve and encourage the Eastern Catholic Churches, a move that has continued firmly with His Holiness JP2 and now with His Holiness Benedict 16th.

When the new Code of Canon Law of the Latin Church was published in 1983 the understanding was a Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches would follow and finally did 1990. That CCEO is only partly “universal” for the ECC. It frequently refers within a given canon to the additional need to follow whatever are the norms for a particular sui iuris church.

There was an expectation that Eastern Churches would produce catechisms as well. Thus far we expect publication of the “worldwide catechism for the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church” due out this year.

We’ve had the three part Light for Life Eastern Catholic Catechism series commissioned by U.S. Eastern Catholic Bishops.

Even thought the CCC addresses many issues where the East is different from the West overall the CCC is quite obviously a very Latin approach. I love the CCC and use it often for catechesis in the Latin Church. But it would not be used in my ECC. Like the Latin Church in daily life and in litrugy, it uses a different “language” than is used in at least my experience of Byzantine Catholic and Orthodox churches. In addition to the Light for Life EC catechism we more likely use some Orthodox sources, one being the two volume Living God catechism put out by St, Vlad’s, or something like Bread & Water, Wine & Oil.

I don’t see the CCC as a tool for teaching and understand the Eastern Churches. I’ve said to the head of our diocesan Dept of Evangelization and Catechesis when the topic comes up about the CCC as universal that the CCC is not a universal catechism. The teacher I have currently for Advanced Mysteries in the program for Master Catechists for our Diocese said the same thing at our last class.

Again, I love the CCC and work with it often but for Latin Catholics. The whole way it’s laid out, which is splendid for what it is, is so different from an Eastern approach. Of course these are 22 sui iuris churches, Eastern and Oriental and I in no way would want to speak for anything other than what I have experienced. I’ve always found Fr Maximos and Fr. Abbot Nicholas articulate the challenges in these areas for Eastern Catholics much better than I can, in their interviews on YourWordFromTheWise’.

From what I have heard for an adult becoming Catholic in an Eastern Church the ordinary catechist is the priest, and perhaps also the deacon.

 

[5Loaves]

I’m already baptized. I think rebaptism is an affront to the Holy Spirit.

Anyone who was validly baptized is never “rebaptized”. Valid baptism is any baptism done with the proper form and matter. Proper form is trinitarian, and proper matter is with real water, and the water must actually touch the person either by immersion, by pouring or by sprinkling, and with right intention, so in an emergency the canon law allows that even a non Christian may perform a valid baptism if they have the intention of doing so and use proper form and matter, Can. 861 §2.

Can. 845 §1. Since the sacraments of baptism, confirmation, and orders imprint a character, they cannot be repeated.
Can. 861 §1. The ordinary minister of baptism is a bishop, a presbyter, or a deacon, without prejudice to the prescript of ⇒ can. 530, n. 1.
§2. When an ordinary minister is absent or impeded, a catechist or another person designated for this function by the local ordinary, or in a case of necessity any person with the right intention, confers baptism licitly. Pastors of souls, especially the pastor of a parish, are to be concerned that the Christian faithful are taught the correct way to baptize.

 

[awatkins69]

I noticed that you are “Anglo-Catholic”. You may be interested in the fact that many Anglican parishes are coming into the Catholic Church and will retain their own liturgical and spiritual heritage. I’m just not sure if you had heard of that, and whether you are interested in that or are more interested in the East.

Anyways, as someone said, if you cannot recognize the Supreme Pontiff and his office then the Eastern Catholic Churches are not for you. I go to a Melkite Catholic Church often, and I have even heard the priest refer to himself as “Papist” before when talking to a Coptic Orthodox priest. They recognize every doctrine of the Catholic Church. They have a different approach to theology than the Latin Church, but they definitely do not deny anything the Latin Church has to say. In fact, some Ukrainian Catholic Churches are named after the Immaculate Conception. While you may not usually hear a sermon about the Immaculate Conception in an Eastern Church, you will definitely not hear anybody saying it’s wrong. You are not allowed to oppose any defined doctrines of the Universal Church, be you Ukrainian, Latin, Melkite, or Copt.

While the approaches to theology are slightly different, the differences are mainly found in spirituality and spiritual approach. With that said, that they all accept all doctrines of the Church, even within the East they all have different emphases. In fact, you’d be surprised, but to clump everybody who is not Latin into “Eastern” is a big mistake. To the Antiochene Rite Churches the Byzantines look like westerners. To the Byzantines the Latins look like westerners. There is more diversity in the East than you think. But I cannot emphasize this enough - they all share the same Faith. They are all Catholic. “One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism.” (Eph 4:5) God bless.

 

[Annie77]

Thank you! This is very informative. I would be very interested in the content of an Eastern catechism. Thank you for the links. I agree that the CCC is very Latin in how it is arranged and in the way things are argued.

I’m also aware that the Eastern Catholic churches recognize the primacy of the pope. That is a key thing that sets them apart from Orthodoxy. And while I have questions about certain dogmas, my resistance isn’t to authority per se. I have a true preference for an Eastern approach to theology and for Eastern ways of formulating certain ideas. I find myself thinking I believe there is a truth to which this dogma refers, but I don’t think the particular formulation is very satisfactory. If that makes sense…

To respond to another commenter, I’m aware that Anglican churches are coming to Rome. I’ve read Anglicanorum coetibus. The issues there are primarily liturgical. The Anglican church is Western. There is no distinct theological patrimony. Thus, the new Anglican structure is not a sui iurus church.

I’m also aware that there is diversity in Eastern Catholicism. I’ve visited a Byzantine Catholic church many years ago. More recently, we visited a Ruthenian Catholic Church. Neither was the right place for me. The last two weeks, however, I’ve been to Divine Liturgy at a Maronite parish and I feel quite at home there.

I mentioned my graduate work in theology. I have read Greek, Latin, and Syriac patristics. I love Augustine but I feel a stronger resonance with Athanasius and after him, with Theodore of Mopsuestia and Ephrem. It makes sense that a Syriac church should feel comfortable.

And what I’m really interested in is the patrimony. Anglo-Catholics tend to appeal to the tradition of the undivided church before 1054. The draw of Eastern Catholicism in general and the Maronite Church in particular is precisely that specific and ancient patrimony.

 

[5Loaves]

Thank you! This is very informative. I would be very interested in the content of an Eastern catechism. Thank you for the links.

We in the East are pretty much all looking forward to seeing the worldwide catechism for the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church.

Here are some other Adult Catechetical Books and “An Eastern Christian Introduction to the Mysteries of Christian Initiation”, materials from the Ukrainian Eparchy of Parma, OH. Eastern Christian Publications has a lot of good materials. Their Orientale Lumen teleVision also has loads of great video you can watch.

I know other Eparchies and even parishes have put together their own catechetical materials to bridge the need for Eastern and Oriental materials. I think the wonderful quality of the CCC has been a real inspiration to all of us.

 

[Mariamkutty]

I agree with everything except a handful of dogmas that I think are too narrowly defined to be useful.

I’m already baptized. I think rebaptism is an affront to the Holy Spirit.

This is good advice, but I do have two advanced degrees in Theology.

And that’s where I come back to that the issue isn’t rebellion per se. It’s a question of identity and integrity for me. I’m already far more in line with official teaching than most Catholics I know because I know it better. But there are specific points at which I am more convinced by Eastern theologies. That isn’t to say I think the West in heretical. I don’t and it’s a key reason I can’t be Orthodox. I just want to understand how Eastern Catholics navigate the catechism and maintain their identity.

On the Malabar Coast (Kerala since 1956), India, the ancient Christians of St Thomas came in full communion with Roman Catholic Church in 1599 at Synod of Diamper (Ref Archbishop Alexio de Menezes OSA and Fr Antonio de Gouveia OSA, Coimbra 1606). They were assigned a separate See, See of Cranganore, under Archdiocese of Goa under Jesuit bishops. Thus they had a Latin Rite bishop while retaining their Syriac Liturgy and their own churches.

It is possible that all Latin Rite dogmas were accepted officially by the See of Cranganaore, by Christians of St Thomas, and no change was made when they became a separate sui iuris Syro Malabar Catholic church in 1887.

The dogmas of the Roman Catholic church plays very little role in the life of an average Syro Malabar Catholic. It is important only to the clergy to study them.

If the Roman Catholic Mass can be accepted, that is all that really matters to the ordinary believer. Other things belong to the area of private devotions. Auricular confession is the biggest shift (the ancient Christians of St Thomas didn’t have it) for lay Catholics in communion with Rome. The Syriac Liturgy known as Qurbana (which was celebrated in Syriac until Second Vatican Council) of the Syro Malabar Catholics is what gives them connection to their ancient heritage.

 

[KyivAndrew]

Do Eastern Catholics adhere to the Catechism of the Catholic Church? I’ve read threads here that suggest they are permitted to stay within their own theological heritage. What happens when their own theological traditions, which are the fruit of their particular liturgies, diverges from the Latin formulation of theology present in the catechism?

Well, the CCC has been translated into Ukrainian as here:
catechismus.org.ua/
for the use of the Catholics of Ukraine, Eastern and Latin.

On top of this, as has been mentioned, a Ukrainian Catholic Catechism is going through a final revision right now! A historic document. Once it is complete you will be able to see some different emphases it may give to some issues, though the Faith is obviously the same. It will all be there. With footnotes to the works of the late great Ukrainian churchmen Metropolitan Andrei Sheptytsky and Patriarch Yosyp Slipyj, and from a millennium ago from Metropolitan Ilarion of Kyiv, along with the Early Church fathers, it will be a truly Ukrainian Catholic work for a “pomisna” or particular Eastern Catholic Church.

In any event I shouldn’t really talk about it’s possible contents until a Final Version is accepted by the Church and comes out.

God Bless.