Automatic Excommunication

[Discerning13]

I have a question. It is said that the support of procedures or ideals that go against the Churches teachings (Abortion,Homosexual ‘Marriage’, Contraception) constitutes mortal sin and brings about an automatic excommunication. My questions is, if a person is fully aware that their support for that certain thing will get them excommunicated automatically.How does one go about having that excommunication lifted?

 

[Hopey]

I have a question. It is said that the support of procedures or ideals that go against the Churches teachings (Abortion,Homosexual ‘Marriage’, Contraception) constitutes mortal sin and brings about an automatic excommunication. My questions is, if a person is fully aware that their support for that certain thing will get them excommunicated automatically.How does one go about having that excommunication lifted?

For automatic excommunication, it is a little more involved than just supporting ideas contrary to what the Church believes. In our growth, we may hold on to some ideas, quite unknowingly, that are what is considered material heresy.

But, let’s look at what it takes to constitute a mortal sin:

1. It has to be considered a grave matter
2. The person has to know it is considered a grave matter (mortal)
3. The person decided to do it anyway

(note, there is something considered invincible ignorance meaning that in the Christian walk of life, you should be ever growing in your life with Christ thus, some things you could no longer be considered as feigning ignorance).

How to remedy those mortal sins? Confession. A complete, contrite confession would remedy those and restore your soul!

The Church attaches automatic excommunication to some serious crimes, one being abortion. If a woman has had an abortion, if a man has cooperated with a woman having an abortion (materially - money; driving her, encouraging her, etc) then this can also be lifted in the confessional. At one time, it was reserved to Bishops being able to lift this, but they see the urgency and also sometimes common place this has become, that they extended the lifting of this horrible crime, murdering of a child, to a priest.

 

[Hopey]

You mentioned homosexual marriage. That wouldn’t be, in my understanding, automatic excommunication. If you tried to marry a person of the same sex, then you would be committing a mortal sin and putting yourself outside of communion with the Church yourself. That can be remedied by separation and confession.

BUT, it is being worked out where supporting homosexual marriage as being material heresy. Material heresy, although very scandalous and harmful, is not the same as formal heresy in that a trial within the church would take place, and excommunication could occur IF you continued to hold onto whatever it was that was considered heresy.

 

[Hopey]

Let me give you an further example.

Suppose I was a Catechist (teacher of the faith) and I not only held on to the ideas that women can be ordained and homosexual marriage, I extend this false teaching into my classroom.

I am completely in error and the priest corrects me. He could say I can no longer hold that position till I can let it go and demonstrate I have let it go because he is in charge of who gets to teach in his parish - protecting the deposit of faith. I can either correct my errors (heresy) and continue OR hold on to my heresies (continue to go to Mass) but not able to hold any positions in the parish.

NOW, some have taken women’s ordination a step further as the Austrian couple who kept having a simulated Mass, done by a woman, in their house. They are part of We Are Church. Now, the Bishop, after trying to correct them, telling them to stop - as it is a serious crime to simulate a Mass in that way - took it further and petitioned for excommunication - which they got. The people should not have been surprised at this and it was very formal.

Does that make sense?

 

[TheDoctor]

I believe you have a mistaken idea of what constitutes"automatic excommunication" and that may be the primary cause of your confusion.

“Automatic Excommunication”, formally called a “latae sententiae excommunication”, means that the person is immediately excommunicated once they perform the act vs. a judicial excommuncation which may be renedered by the Church.

The Code of Canon Law codifies which offenses are to be punished by a latae sententiae excommunicaiton, and for a lay person there are very few:

Apostates, heretics and schismatics (Canon 1364)

Throwing away or using a consecrated host for a sacrilegious purpose (Can. 1367)

Using physical force against the Pope or a Bishop (Canon 1370)

Attempting to celebrate the Mass (Canon 1378)

Procuring an abortion (Canon 1398)
If you are not guilty of these, the sin is mortal or venial. Does that help any maybe?

 

[Elizium23]

You may have also heard of Canon 915, which instructs the ministers to withhold the Eucharist from obstinate sinners:
Code of Canon Law:

Can. 915 Those upon whom the penalty of excommunication or interdict has been imposed or declared, and others who obstinately persist in manifest grave sin, are not to be admitted to holy communion.

Being denied Holy Communion is not necessarily indicative of the penalty of excommunication. Divorced people who have attempted remarriage are not excommunicated by this attempt, but they are still not eligible to receive Holy Communion, not only under Canon 915 but also under Canon 916, which we are all fairly familiar with:
Code of Canon Law:

Can. 916 Anyone who is conscious of grave sin may not celebrate Mass or receive the Body of the Lord without previously having been to sacramental confession, unless there is a grave reason and there is no opportunity to confess; in this case the person is to remember the obligation to make an act of perfect contrition, which includes the resolve to go to confession as soon as possible.

 

[Vico]

I have a question. It is said that the support of procedures or ideals that go against the Churches teachings (Abortion,Homosexual ‘Marriage’, Contraception) constitutes mortal sin and brings about an automatic excommunication. My questions is, if a person is fully aware that their support for that certain thing will get them excommunicated automatically.How does one go about having that excommunication lifted?

Confession (Latin Canon Law - CIC). Ordinary means bishop:Can. 1355 §1. Provided that the penalty has not been reserved to the Apostolic See, the following can remit an imposed or declared penalty established by law:

1/ the ordinary who initiated the trial to impose or declare a penalty or who personally or through another imposed or declared it by decree;

2/ the ordinary of the place where the offender is present, after the ordinary mentioned under n. 1 has been consulted unless this is impossible because of extraordinary circumstances.
§2. If the penalty has not been reserved to the Apostolic See, an ordinary can remit a latae sententiae penalty established by law but not yet declared for his subjects and those who are present in his territory or who committed the offense there; any bishop can also do this in the act of sacramental confession.
​

 

[Brendan]

You mentioned homosexual marriage. That wouldn’t be, in my understanding, automatic excommunication. If you tried to marry a person of the same sex, then you would be committing a mortal sin and putting yourself outside of communion with the Church yourself. That can be remedied by separation and confession.

That would depend. If the person considered it to be a marriage Sacramental in nature, that could be considered to be a simulation of a Sacrament, which IS an excommuncatable offense.

If the person recognized it as simply a legal action, but with no religious meaning, there would be no excommunication.

 

[Irishgal49]

I believe you have a mistaken idea of what constitutes"automatic excommunication" and that may be the primary cause of your confusion.

“Automatic Excommunication”, formally called a “latae sententiae excommunication”, means that the person is immediately excommunicated once they perform the act vs. a judicial excommuncation which may be renedered by the Church.

The Code of Canon Law codifies which offenses are to be punished by a latae sententiae excommunicaiton, and for a lay person there are very few:

Apostates, heretics and schismatics (Canon 1364)
​

Does that include people who do not agree with a teaching or two of the Catholic Church? I’m not asking to argue, just clarification. Also, are they excommunicated automatically (by their action/inaction) or would it be something that they would have to have done at a trial? Are there any trials nowadays? I have never heard of any.​

 

[Hopey]

That would depend. If the person considered it to be a marriage Sacramental in nature, that could be considered to be a simulation of a Sacrament, which IS an excommuncatable offense.

If the person recognized it as simply a legal action, but with no religious meaning, there would be no excommunication.

Wouldn’t it only be a simulation of the sacrament if it occurred in Catholic Church with a priest? For a sacrament to be valid doesn’t depend if the person thinks of that way or not, right? That’s an interesting question.

 

[TheDoctor]

Does that include people who do not agree with a teaching or two of the Catholic Church? I’m not asking to argue, just clarification. Also, are they excommunicated automatically (by their action/inaction) or would it be something that they would have to have done at a trial? Are there any trials nowadays? I have never heard of any.

Lets tackle the easy one first. If an excommunication is latae sententiate then it is the act itself that does it. For example, having the abortion or assaulting the Pope automatically excommunicates you.

For other excommunicatable offenses the appropriate authority must issue a declaration of excommunication. What may help is to remember that excommunication is not punishment - it is meant as a stiff “wake up” call to the excommunicated to repair their relationship with God. That being the case, it is imperative that the excommunicated person know they have been excommunicated so they can repent.

The issue of not agreeing with Church teaching is a sticky one. In the majority of cases, I believe the person disagreeing does so not because they do not believe what the Church says they must believe but because they do not understand why it is that the Church teaches.

It is more applicable to those who fully understand what the Church teaches and who consciously and obstinately refuse to follow what she teaches. An example in my mind are Catholic politicians who have been clearly told by their Bishop that continuing to vote in favor of abortion is a violation of Church teaching but who continue to do so.

This area can be very complex and again, the Church is always looking to bring the faithful back into full communion with Christ, so iI would think it is best discussed with your confessor.