Aztec Conquest?

[HabemusFrancis]

OK. This might be a bit of a stretch. Just bear with me if you can.

I believe that it ultimately was a good thing that Hernan Cortez defeated the Aztec Empire and spread the One True Church amongst the Mexican natives.

I normally feel sympathetic toward the plight of indigenous people colonized by Europeans. Not so the Aztecs. Even by the standards of the time they really seemed to revel and delight in cruelty. They sacrificed captives of other tribes by ripping their hearts out with a knife, sometimes burning them alive before ripping their hearts out, skinning captives ( and wearing skins as ceremonial cloaks), and making sure the children of captives cried many tears, so as to please and placate the god of the waters.

Seriously. Ancient Rome and China were kind and gentle compared to the Aztecs.

I realize that the Spaniards committed many injustices ( i.e Sexual assault, pillaging, spreading of infectious diseases, making natives abject serfs/peasents, etc.) But doesn’t it help that the Spanish gave the Aztecs and other tribesmen The Eucharist, Confession, The Bible, and hence “access to heaven” which the natives did not have quite as much access to beforehand?

 

[jmjconder]

OK. This might be a bit of a stretch. Just bear with me if you can.

I believe that it ultimately was a good thing that Hernan Cortez defeated the Aztec Empire and spread the One True Church amongst the Mexican natives.

I normally feel sympathetic toward the plight of indigenous people colonized by Europeans. Not so the Aztecs. Even by the standards of the time they really seemed to revel and delight in cruelty. They sacrificed captives of other tribes by ripping their hearts out with a knife, sometimes burning them alive before ripping their hearts out, skinning captives ( and wearing skins as ceremonial cloaks), and making sure the children of captives cried many tears, so as to please and placate the god of the waters.

Seriously. Ancient Rome and China were kind and gentle compared to the Aztecs.

I realize that the Spaniards committed many injustices ( i.e Sexual assault, pillaging, spreading of infectious diseases, making natives abject serfs/peasents, etc.) But doesn’t it help that the Spanish gave the Aztecs and other tribesmen The Eucharist, Confession, The Bible, and hence “access to heaven” which the natives did not have quite as much access to beforehand?

**You need to read sources that are more accurate. Read sources that are Caholic based - they will tell you that the indigenous people did what thier tradtion taught them - once they learned differently they stopped. Please look up the books in Ignatius Press and Tan to read about Our Lady of Gaudalupe. The Aztecs were only faithful to what they knew until they knew otherwise.

We need to have the same compassion on others.**

 

[CHRISTINE77]

OK. This might be a bit of a stretch. Just bear with me if you can.

I believe that it ultimately was a good thing that Hernan Cortez defeated the Aztec Empire and spread the One True Church amongst the Mexican natives.

I normally feel sympathetic toward the plight of indigenous people colonized by Europeans. Not so the Aztecs. Even by the standards of the time they really seemed to revel and delight in cruelty. They sacrificed captives of other tribes by ripping their hearts out with a knife, sometimes burning them alive before ripping their hearts out, skinning captives ( and wearing skins as ceremonial cloaks), and making sure the children of captives cried many tears, so as to please and placate the god of the waters.

Seriously. Ancient Rome and China were kind and gentle compared to the Aztecs.

I realize that the Spaniards committed many injustices ( i.e Sexual assault, pillaging, spreading of infectious diseases, making natives abject serfs/peasents, etc.) But doesn’t it help that the Spanish gave the Aztecs and other tribesmen The Eucharist, Confession, The Bible, and hence “access to heaven” which the natives did not have quite as much access to beforehand?

I had the same reaction! It was such a bloody culture, there were literally rivers of blood when they performed their sacrifices.

 

[Aelred_Minor]

The uncomfortable fact is that human nature really is fallen and true evil arises in every culture, though more so in some cultures than others just like individuals may be more or less evil.

 

[HabemusFrancis]

Btw, sorry if I was unclear.

By “Aztecs” I mean the rulers and high priests who came up with that sacrifice culture, not the common Aztecs themselves

 

[vames]

But doesn’t it help that the Spanish gave the Aztecs and other tribesmen The Eucharist, Confession, The Bible, and hence “access to heaven” which the natives did not have quite as much access to beforehand?

No, it doesn’t. The Spaniards weren’t moved by compassion towards the victims of Aztec paganism, but by pride and thirst for power and gold, the gold of Moctezuma and then the gold mines of Peru. Perhaps Rome and China were kind and gentle compared to the Aztecs, but not compared to these “Christians”, plunderers and murderers. It wasn’t even a just war or a crusade, since the Americas never belonged to them and the indigenous people never threatened Europe.
“To say that you can kill in the name of God is blasphemy”, says now Pope Francis. But this is exactly what the conquistadors did. And even assuming that they only wanted to evangelize the pagans (yeah), doesn’t the Church say that a good end cannot justify evil means?

 

[LegoGE1947]

Btw, sorry if I was unclear.

By “Aztecs” I mean the rulers and high priests who came up with that sacrifice culture, not the common Aztecs themselves

Also you don’t mean the Pontiac Aztec though it was probably one of the ugliest cars ever built!

 

[colmywaykurtz]

It’s also a fact that the Aztecs were not the only practitioners of human sacrifice in Mesoamerica. There were other civilizations there that practiced it also. The Mixtec, Huaxtec, Totonac, and Tarascan peoples all practiced it, contemporaneously with the Aztecs. So did the Maya, though they were mostly disintegrated as a civilization by that time.

The case of the Tarascans was unique in that they ultimately surrendered to the Spaniard without fighting—seeing what had happened to the Aztecs before them.

 

[bsroufek]

It was Our Lady of Guadalupe through Juan Diego who converted the Aztec, not Cortez. Even the Spaniards who tried to convert the Aztec failed miserably until after Our Lady’s miracle.

 

[colmywaykurtz]

I had the same reaction! It was such a bloody culture, there were literally rivers of blood when they performed their sacrifices.

Yes, but let’s not overlook how the Phoenicians cast infants into ovens. They may have been just as bloody.

And since Carthage was ethnically and culturally an offshoot of the Phoenician civilization, it may well have served a divine purpose when Hannibal and Carthage lost in their wars against Rome. Rome didn’t practice human sacrifice, and its empire made the perfect political framework to facilitate the spread of Christianity when Christ’s evangelists began to spread around the Mediterranean and Europe. Christianity might have had a much more difficult time spreading in a world dominated by Carthage and its civilization, which was based on demon worship and human sacrifice.

 

[Ion]

No, it doesn’t. The Spaniards weren’t moved by compassion towards the victims of Aztec paganism, but by pride and thirst for power and gold, the gold of Moctezuma and then the gold mines of Peru. Perhaps Rome and China were kind and gentle compared to the Aztecs, but not compared to these “Christians”, plunderers and murderers. It wasn’t even a just war or a crusade, since the Americas never belonged to them and the indigenous people never threatened Europe.
“To say that you can kill in the name of God is blasphemy”, says now Pope Francis. But this is exactly what the conquistadors did. And even assuming that they only wanted to evangelize the pagans (yeah), doesn’t the Church say that a good end cannot justify evil means?

Lets say Cortez landed and would have gone to visit the Aztecs with an armful of roses…

 

[LegoGE1947]

Lets say Cortez landed and would have gone to visit the Aztecs with an armful of roses…

In that case let us say maybe some of the Aztecs would have been allergic to roses and anyhow those thorns can hurt!