Bad Choir Singing

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maherite1977

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Here is my dilemma…

The choir I sing in was singing at 4:00 Mass on Saturday. We normally have a nice blend of voices. But today was a particularly bad instance of being flat as a pancake.

To be frank, the gentleman doing the cantoring couldn’t carry a tune in a bucket. His voice was cracking and extremely flat during the Kyrie and I could see some in the congregation cringe at the sound of his voice. The bad part is…the cantor was the organist’s husband. I have heard some in the congregation say that he shouldn’t be cantoring during Mass because his voice is…well, awful.

Is there a good way to tell him (or the organist) to maybe not let him do some of the Mass parts or is the simple solution just to “offer it up” and bear with it?

Pax Christi!
 
maherite1977 said:
I have heard some in the congregation say that he shouldn’t be cantoring during Mass because his voice is…well, awful.

Is there a good way to tell him (or the organist) to maybe not let him do some of the Mass parts…
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No. Your job as a choir is to glorify God with your music and to facilitate the congregation’s ability to do the same. As such, you must always strive for musical perfection (because God himself is perfect), but even musical perfection is secondary to your witness to Christ’s love that you show each other. Telling or even hinting that someone is a terrible singer, even if he is, is not a good witness. Try to find other ways to deal with the problem. Those who are fine singers ask to be allowed the opportunity to cantor also. Bad singers are placed next to good singers who (God willing) are able to help keep bad singers on key. That sort of thing.
 
I would think the pastor would speak to him gently about this.
 
rr1213 said:
No. Your job as a choir is to glorify God with your music and to facilitate the congregation’s ability to do the same. As such, you must always strive for musical perfection (because God himself is perfect), but even musical perfection is secondary to your witness to Christ’s love that you show each other. Telling or even hinting that someone is a terrible singer, even if he is, is not a good witness. Try to find other ways to deal with the problem. Those who are fine singers ask to be allowed the opportunity to cantor also. Bad singers are placed next to good singers who (God willing) are able to help keep bad singers on key. That sort of thing.
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With respect, I totally disagree with this. If someone is not a good singer, they, themselves, should be honest with themselves and recognize this. If, however, they do not, they must be told this. It is not a good witness to lie by our lack of actions, allowing discord to continue. Singers must be able to sing. If they have inflated ideas of their abilities, the choir leader must tell them - as gently as possible - that they cannot continue in the choir.
 
Joan_M said:
With respect, I totally disagree with this. If someone is not a good singer, they, themselves, should be honest with themselves and recognize this. If, however, they do not, they must be told this. It is not a good witness to lie by our lack of actions, allowing discord to continue. Singers must be able to sing. If they have inflated ideas of their abilities, the choir leader must tell them - as gently as possible - that they cannot continue in the choir.
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…and how many people have left the Church, or at least their Parish, because they have taken offense at being told (gently or course) that they can’t sing? More than any of us would want to admit.
 
rr1213 said:
…and how many people have left the Church, or at least their Parish, because they have taken offense at being told (gently or course) that they can’t sing? More than any of us would want to admit.
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Only the proud and willful take offense at an honest assessment of their ability.

You are likely to lose more people at a particular parish by allowing such disharmony to continue.

I sing for choir as well. Competent choir directors always weed out the less talented and train the rest.

At a bare minimum, charity requires tact, timing and truthfulness.
 
I sympathize with you. The Mass I go to when I’m home has a young girl cantor and she is horrible! It hurts me and my boyfriend especially as he is a musician and I have had 11 years of private voice training. If I was home more often I would love to offer her some training.
 
once when I sang the musical parts of the mass,
soon as I started, the watch cat ran out of the building in a huff, and wouldn’t come back in untill dinnertime.
 
I suppose another question to ask is “how many people have left one parish with a lousy choir to go down the road to another parish with a decent choir?”

Why should anyone put up with it when the beauty of the Mass can be found in the next parish?
 
If the parish has a music director, he or she should be informed as to the cantor’s skills.

The position of cantor is not one where you put someone to develop their singing skills. You need someone who is already a strong singer. If their singing is not able to lead the congregation, then they need to be removed.
 
Trident59 said:
I suppose another question to ask is “how many people have left one parish with a lousy choir to go down the road to another parish with a decent choir?”

Why should anyone put up with it when the beauty of the Mass can be found in the next parish?
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A good music director will know how to deal with, and overcome, the problem of inept singers without kicking them out of the choir or alienating them. I’ve seen it done correctly.
 
If someone is so poor to the point of being a distraction during mass, then that has to stop. The music director should handle this situation, but it has to be brought to their attention first. If the organist IS the music director then go to the pastor and explain the situation. I’m sure if the guy is as bad as you say, Father has noticed at some point.

Poor singing is as bad as having a cell phone going off in the pews - it is distracting - and there should be no distractions from what we are there to do.

~Liza
 
I might follow different strategies if someone were just not the best cantor as opposed to an actual distraction, but seeing as he is a distraction he is actually interfering with the entire congregation’s ability to pray during Mass, so something needs to be done, as charitably as possible. One person’s potentially fragile ego should not be allowed to pull down the spiritual life of the entire community; even if we do need to be sensitive to the weak among us, this includes the weak who will be harmed by horrible liturgical music.
 
The psalmist enjoins us to “make a joyful noise unto the Lord.”
He evidently knew that not all voices are equal and figured that God wasn’t offended by what He had made. God wants to hear us sing.
In the Father’s love,
Matthew
 
drafdog said:
The psalmist enjoins us to “make a joyful noise unto the Lord.”
He evidently knew that not all voices are equal and figured that God wasn’t offended by what He had made. God wants to hear us sing.
In the Father’s love,
Matthew
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And I personally find it extremely difficult to sing if the cantor is horrible. It is a distraction, and all I can think about is how embarrassed I am for the person.

Singing in public just because you are someone’s spouse, is not an acceptable reason to be allowed in this role. Sorry - but not everyone has the talent to be in front of a microphone, and we don’t need to fall into a state of political correctness and be so worried about wounding them, that we allow them to disrupt the worship of others.

There are other ways those who can not sing may serve.

~Liza
 
drafdog said:
The psalmist enjoins us to “make a joyful noise unto the Lord.”
He evidently knew that not all voices are equal and figured that God wasn’t offended by what He had made. God wants to hear us sing.
In the Father’s love,
Matthew
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Matthew, that was a very nice way to put it. I used to cantor, but I was so tense about it my legs would actually shake. I had to stop because I dreaded it so much, the fear was overshadowing the rest of my participation in the Mass.

But I can’t stand to think that someone would leave their parish because of bad singing. Go to a different Mass. If the 9am cantor annoys you, go at 11. Or on Saturday. Choir member, volunteer to cantor. Our choir director sends around a sign up sheet every month for cantors to choose for the next month. Maybe the other cantors can be so zealous, you sort of squeeze him out most of the month.

If only the birds with beautiful voices sing, many forests would be silent. God created whatever voice one has, and it can’t be offensive to Him.
 
daeve said:
God created whatever voice one has, and it can’t be offensive to Him.
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Or, as someone once said (and I’ve quoted many times), “God gave me my voice; He’s the one who has to listen to it!”
 
rr1213 said:
No. Your job as a choir is to glorify God with your music and to facilitate the congregation’s ability to do the same. As such, you must always strive for musical perfection (because God himself is perfect), but even musical perfection is secondary to your witness to Christ’s love that you show each other. Telling or even hinting that someone is a terrible singer, even if he is, is not a good witness. Try to find other ways to deal with the problem. Those who are fine singers ask to be allowed the opportunity to cantor also. Bad singers are placed next to good singers who (God willing) are able to help keep bad singers on key. That sort of thing.
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It is hard to give a gift to God when you don’t have the gift. You don’t have to be a conservatory-trained opera singer to be a cantor, but you should be able to carry a tune, make the words understandable, and not sound like you’re stepping on a cat’s tail.

A bad singer can do fine in a choir if he can find the pitch and not sing too loud. (Also, if someone is struggling, just a few months of voice lessons once a week can make all the difference in the world if the person is dedicated- I speak from experience as both a student and a teacher).
 
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