Bad Friend?

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I need advice on how to respond to a question.

My friend’s good friend Mary goes to quite a few parties where drinking, and other bad things (concidering they’re not even 18) take place. My friend tries to help her out an provides a good example by her actions, however, knows she cannot protect Mary from everything and her friend may have to figure a few things out on her own. My friend now questions weather she is being a bad friend by not attending some of these parties (here Mary asks her to attend because for example Mary will be the only girl there with a bunch of guys) with Mary inorder to protect her in a way.

I do not believe this in any way makes her a bad friend, but do not know how to explain this to her. Could you help me out.
 
pio_s said:
I need advice on how to respond to a question.

My friend’s good friend Mary goes to quite a few parties where drinking, and other bad things (concidering they’re not even 18) take place. My friend tries to help her out an provides a good example by her actions, however, knows she cannot protect Mary from everything and her friend may have to figure a few things out on her own. My friend now questions weather she is being a bad friend by not attending some of these parties (here Mary asks her to attend because for example Mary will be the only girl there with a bunch of guys) with Mary inorder to protect her in a way.

I do not believe this in any way makes her a bad friend, but do not know how to explain this to her. Could you help me out.
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Being a good friend does not mean putting yourself in a dangerous or bad situation.

A good friend would call her parents and let them know she is drinking at a party with mostly boys.

If her parents don’t care or arent’ there, a good friend will call the police.

Mary could be raped, attacked, crash in a car due to drunk driving, die from alcohol poisoning, fall and get hurt, be kidnapped and who knows what else.

A good friend knows that she is not strong enough to fight off ten drunk boys and will only be raped or attacked as well.
 
hasikelee said:
Being a good friend does not mean putting yourself in a dangerous or bad situation.

A good friend would call her parents and let them know she is drinking at a party with mostly boys.

If her parents don’t care or arent’ there, a good friend will call the police.

Mary could be raped, attacked, crash in a car due to drunk driving, die from alcohol poisoning, fall and get hurt, be kidnapped and who knows what else.

A good friend knows that she is not strong enough to fight off ten drunk boys and will only be raped or attacked as well.
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I completely agree. That doesn’t sound like a party, it sounds like a recipe for a potential gang-rape.
 
Your friend is not a bad friend. It is Mary that is the bad friend. Your friend also is not even an adult and has to realize that she can not be responsible for all that Mary does. It is beyond her ability to save Mary. The best thing that your friend can do is talk to her parents and let them know about this problem. Maybe they can talk to Mary’s parents or Mary’s counselor at school.
 
hasikelee said:
Being a good friend does not mean putting yourself in a dangerous or bad situation.

A good friend would call her parents and let them know she is drinking at a party with mostly boys.

If her parents don’t care or arent’ there, a good friend will call the police.

Mary could be raped, attacked, crash in a car due to drunk driving, die from alcohol poisoning, fall and get hurt, be kidnapped and who knows what else.

A good friend knows that she is not strong enough to fight off ten drunk boys and will only be raped or attacked as well.
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Without calling the police on her or her parents what should she do or is that the only response. Also if she does not believe any thing such as “gang rape” will happen, but still other harmfull things.

I know that may be the best thing to do, but if it were my friend i know i would have a very hard time doing this. Does your suggestion also mean that people should call the cops/ the peoples parents of all people doing wrong. I can accept this, just i am not sure if i could do this.

Basically, what other things can be done.
 
Basically the most important thing that your friend can do for Mary is to not do anything that protects her from the consequences of her destructive behavior. The sooner Mary experiences the negative consequences of her decisions, the more likely she will be able to avoid serious and lasting consequences. If she is really Mary’s friend she will not lie for her, will not make excuses for her, and will detatch from her to some degree. This is the only way that she can support her friend and not enable her bad decisions.
 
dulcissima said:
Basically the most important thing that your friend can do for Mary is to not do anything that protects her from the consequences of her destructive behavior. The sooner Mary experiences the negative consequences of her decisions, the more likely she will be able to avoid serious and lasting consequences. If she is really Mary’s friend she will not lie for her, will not make excuses for her, and will detatch from her to some degree. This is the only way that she can support her friend and not enable her bad decisions.
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Thanks for your reply, this seems doable to me.

I see the relevence of turning her into the police/parents, however i do not know weather this is possible. If you dissagree with the course of action in this quote please respond, i do not want to advise a diluted solution/proper response.
 
pio_s said:
Thanks for your reply, this seems doable to me.

I see the relevence of turning her into the police/parents, however i do not know weather this is possible. If you dissagree with the course of action in this quote please respond, i do not want to advise a diluted solution/proper response.
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To be honest with you, I’ve just gone through this with one of my daughter’s friends. Unless you have specific information about a specific incident presenting a danger to anyone, I don’t think calling the police is the way to go. With my daughter’s friend, her mom is already aware of the problem. Her friend is welcome to come over here if she wants to follow the rules of my home, but my daughter is not going to go anywhere or doing anything with her friend because she can’t be trusted not to drag her into any trouble. My daughter agreed with me on this. Some of her friends thought that was too drastic, but now one of those friends got arrested just by being with this girl when she tried to shoplift some vodka. Now that friend wishes she had listened to my daughter because she is completely grounded for 6 months. I’m just glad my daughter came to me when she first became aware of the problem, so that we could talk about the best way to handle it.
 
Mary’s parents know about the problem already and are very harsh (possibly too harsh). I think its ok for my friend to do things with Mary when there will be no instance for her harm, but it is just not rational to place herself in the same situation she does not want her friend to be in, even if she would not be doing bad things or allowing her friend to so.
 
This kind of sitution happened to my niece. Her friend was wild, but my sister would not allow her daughter to go to the parties, etc, with the friend.

The friend at age 16 or 17 was at a party, got drunk, and was gang-raped. Hello! This in a nice area of San Francisco and the girl’s parents are both teachers, who should have known better, but they are “liberal” parents and think they have to just trust the child’s judgement.

Well, teenagers don’t have good judgment! The human brain is in adolescence from age 12 - 24. Age 24! Not 18, not 17. Until then the person can have great intellect, be creative, productive, and seem adult, but adolescents lack mature judgement. Brain studies show that the parts of the brain that allow us to make good reasoned judgements do not mature until about age 24. Google it.

So teens and young adults cannot make really good decisions much of the time, which is why young people are limited in their driving, drinking, and so many ways. It is wisdom to do so. Young people should rely on older adults who love them to assist them in making many kinds of decisions or be under the control of such adults. Unfortunately many young people do not have such adults in their lives.

My 17 year old goes to parties, but only after I have dropped her off, talked to the parent in charge, scoped out the digs and the other party-goers, whom I mostly know already, and arranged to pick her up at a set time. And these are parties where they snack, watch parent-approved movies, play video games, and other kinds of normal activities. My child chooses her friends wisely, but only through much guidance in years past. This is appropriate parenting. Your friend’s friend’s parents are either nuts or absent. Of course, many parents are.
 
pio_s said:
I think its ok for my friend to do things with Mary when there will be no instance for her harm
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This is true. If Mary wants to go to the movies with your friend, that’s one thing. If Mary wants your friend to go to one of these parties with her, it is her duty to refuse. If Mary feels unsafe going to these parties alone, she probably shouldn’t go at all.

There is no way for her to know if there will be no harm done. Consumption of alcohol by minors is in the first place illegal, and in the second place harmful to teen brain development, so if your friend drinks at this party, there is danger there already.

Secondly, even if she doesn’t drink alcohol, there is no gaurantee these boys won’t slip something into her non-alcoholic drink. And don’t tell me she trusts them. Most girls and women who are raped at parties are raped by men they trust.

Thirdly, if someone else calls the police during this party, she could still get in trouble for even being present for the underage drinking.

And, if your friend knows of a specific party where underage drinking is going on, she has a duty to call the police herself. To know a crime is being committed and to not report it is almost as bad as doing it yourself.
 
I didn’t really answer the question, above, I see, so I will try again.

The “let her reap the consequences of her actions” school of thought–tough love–has some merit, but I think that before that, I think some action is called for. The consequences of her action could be death, life-long disability, AIDS…this is not a situation for tough love right off the bat.

You and your sensible friends should get some sensible adults–not “too harsh”–to talk to Mary. They should warn her. They can inform her of her error and maybe even talk to her parents about the issue and get them to work with her and find answers that both she and her parents can accept. Counseling is seriously needed, at the least.

Maybe Mary is mentally ill. Many mental illnesses come on in the teen years. Maybe her parents are abusive or mentally ill or addicts. SOMETHING is seriously wrong here. Before you just throw her to the wolves, you should try to help. If help is refused, then you will have done all you can do. I don’t think I could stand by without some effort to save her from herself, but it must be realized that this may not be possible.
 
Many times, teens and young adults feel that they know all the answers. Their parents can sometimes be mean or refuse to listen to them. Usually the parents know little by this time anyways, so the parents can’t be of much help.

If someone wanted to be a good friend, they would learn more about what could happen to their friend Mary. Here are some true statistics from docts and police officers in America:

Teenage Rape
  • 38% of women who have been raped were 14-17 years old at the time of the attack
  • Nearly all female teenage victims know their attacker
  • 56% of teenage girls who are raped are raped by a date
  • 30% of teenage girls who are raped are raped by a friend
  • 11% of teenage girls who are raped are raped by a boyfriend
  • 78% of teenage victims do not tell their parents about the incident
  • 71% of teenage victims tell a friend that they were raped
  • 6% of teenage rape victims report the assault to the police
  • 75% of acquaintance rapes involve alcohol
  • 3.3 million Americans aged 14-17 are considered problem drinkers
    *** The risk of rape is four times higher for women aged 16-24 than for any other age group.**
    Alcohol facts:
  • 90% of acquaintance rapes involve alcohol
  • Alcohol is a factor in 100% of gang rapes
    Diseases, pregnancy, etc.:
  • Three in 1000 college students are HIV-positive
  • Every year, one million teenage girls get pregnant
psu.edu/ouic/orientation100/T10/sexassult.html
 
I ask this in all seriousness, is your friend a martial arts practioner? If not, then how does her presence serve to protect Mary from boys who are probably bigger and stronger then either of them?

Your friend could be endangering herself by going to such events with Mary. The type of men that gravitate toward a young, drunken woman are not going to act gentlemanly toward her sober friend.
 
shirleytowers said:
Maybe Mary is mentally ill. Many mental illnesses come on in the teen years. Maybe her parents are abusive or mentally ill or addicts. SOMETHING is seriously wrong here. Before you just throw her to the wolves, you should try to help. If help is refused, then you will have done all you can do. I don’t think I could stand by without some effort to save her from herself, but it must be realized that this may not be possible.
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I too had a friend that is similar to Mary. My friend “Sara” was in similar situations that only escalated. It turned out years later that she had a brain disorder that gave her the decision making skills and control of a 8 year-old (which shocked me because she had always been normal in school.)

Unfortunately I didn’t warn her parents enough when I was friends with her. Since they didn’t find out until she was over 18 she ran away with an abusive boyfriend and no one knows where she is. She ran away before she could receive the psychological and medical care that she needed.

(Also tell your friend that parents can be informed anonymously, whether by phone or note.)
 
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