"Bad" words

[CrossBro]

No, I am NOT saying that one would use a “bad” word out of instinct. An “instinct” is a behavior that is inherent in all members of a species; ergo, humans have no instincts. It may be a habit that one could possibly break with practice and prayer. As far as my character goes, I’ve got bigger problems than tossing the f-bomb around sometimes!

Well, that is sad that you have bigger problems, hope you work on that. Maybe all those “little problems” you are having are adding up ?

And yes we do have instincts as rational animals otherwise a new born would starve to death or would not cry or you would not move your hand if you accidentally place it on top of hot burner on the stove. That being said, you may be right, you may be cussing out of bad character and not instinct, however the vocal response itself might be instinct, while the fact you drop the “f-bomb” instead of “ouch” is simply out of habit instead of bad character.

 

[iamcatholic100]

I will also like to add that one doesn’t always have to use vulgar words to express strong emotions.

 

[Kamaduck]

I will also like to add that one doesn’t always have to use vulgar words to express strong emotions.

That’s absolutely true, but I’m still not sure how we would separate vulgar words from regular words, or why using vulgar words to communicate emotions would be sinful.

I recently described a game I was playing as “cr*p”. I also used the words “wholly morally repulsive”. I absolutely could have taken the time to choose some more strong yet non-vulgar words, but I was angry and I didn’t feel like it. What I wanted to communicate to mu friends was a) the fact that the game made me, personally, extremely angry, and b) why that was. I did both, and I used a word that many of the adults I know don’t like or allow, because I felt that it was an accurate descriptor. I wasn’t setting out to write poetry.

I don’t see anything wrong with my reaction. The word was appropriate for the situation, and I think the same can be true of much stronger vulgarity as well.

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

Well, that is sad that you have bigger problems, hope you work on that. Maybe all those “little problems” you are having are adding up ?

And yes we do have instincts as rational animals otherwise a new born would starve to death or would not cry or you would not move your hand if you accidentally place it on top of hot burner on the stove. That being said, you may be right, you may be cussing out of bad character and not instinct, however the vocal response itself might be instinct, while the fact you drop the “f-bomb” instead of “ouch” is simply out of habit instead of bad character.

In this scenario what is the moral difference between the “f-bomb” and “ouch”?

 

[Avila123]

For me, the filth of the mouth reflects the filth of the mind, heart and soul, which is why I try not to use those words and when I fail, for me it is a sin. When other people inflict those words on me, I pray to God for protection from their filth.

Reference Bible quotes on words how about:

James 3.6. And the tongue is a fire, a world of unrighteousness. The tongue is set among our members, staining the whole body, setting on fire the entire course of life, and set on fire by hell.

Matthew 15.11. It is not what goes into the mouth that defiles a person, but what comes out of the mouth; this defiles a person.”

Matthew 19.14. Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my rock and my redeemer.

Ephesians 5:4. Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.

Ephesians 5.4 Let there be no filthiness nor foolish talk nor crude joking, which are out of place, but instead let there be thanksgiving.

Proverbs 10.11. The mouth of the righteous is a fountain of life, but the mouth of the wicked conceals violence.

Proverbs 10.32. The lips of the righteous know what is acceptable, but the mouth of the wicked, what is perverse.

Proverbs 17.27. Whoever restrains his words has knowledge, and he who has a cool spirit is a man of understanding.

And finally:

Matthew 12.36, I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak,

The last one, is one I am not looking forward to.

As to substituting words, that is a no go for me because God reads my heart and mind.

Just some of my thoughts on the topic.

 

[CrossBro]

In this scenario what is the moral difference between the “f-bomb” and “ouch”?

It is not so much the “what” as the “why”.

Let’s say you accidentally bump into person A, and person A turns around and says, “That is okay I do that sometimes too.”

Now let’s say you accidentally bump into person B, and person B turns around and punches you in the nose ?

Now Mr. crooked nose, do you see the moral difference ?

 

[Kamaduck]

It is not so much the “what” as the “why”.

Let’s say you accidentally bump into person A, and person A turns around and says, “That is okay I do that sometimes too.”

Now let’s say you accidentally bump into person B, and person B turns around and punches you in the nose ?

Now Mr. crooked nose, do you see the moral difference ?

That’s not a very good analogy if you’re in the presence of people who aren’t at all offended by the word you use.

EDIT: In fact, I’m not sure how it makes sense at all if the words are not directed at a fellow human being. Can you explain it again?

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

It is not so much the “what” as the “why”.

Let’s say you accidentally bump into person A, and person A turns around and says, “That is okay I do that sometimes too.”

Now let’s say you accidentally bump into person B, and person B turns around and punches you in the nose ?

Now Mr. crooked nose, do you see the moral difference ?

Uh… what? I thought this scenario had you, alone, hitting yourself with a hammer and uttering one of those words. How does that analogy follow? Even if someone was around, I still don’t really follow… how does a word, uttered to oneself compare to an assault?

 

[edwest2]

This sounds like the old ‘let’s find a loophole, any loophole’ discussion. The last time I hurt myself accidentally, I was in pain but that did not require a bunch of dirty language to fix nor would it have helped.

Peace,
Ed

 

[Kamaduck]

This sounds like the old ‘let’s find a loophole, any loophole’ discussion. The last time I hurt myself accidentally, I was in pain but that did not require a bunch of dirty language to fix nor would it have helped.

I really don’t understand it, though. I’m open to the idea that I may be wrong, and all vulgarity may be sinful. But I don’t know why, and I don’t know how we are to distinguish between acceptable words and unacceptable words.

How are we to do this, ed? Why are some words inherently sinful, while others aren’t?

 

[Avila123]

I really don’t understand it, though. I’m open to the idea that I may be wrong, and all vulgarity may be sinful. But I don’t know why, and I don’t know how we are to distinguish between acceptable words and unacceptable words.

How are we to do this, ed? Why are some words inherently sinful, while others aren’t?

Excuse me for butting in. If I am in doubt, I check my old dictionary and a couple of online dictionaries. If the word is a Euphemism, it doesn’t detract from the original meaning. I do that because I am over particular with words and the modern dictionaries change the meaning, so words that were curses or taking the Lord’s name in vain for centuries have a changed meaning.

As I am from the UK, some of the language used in CAF is (to me) inappropriate as it is cursing or taking the Lord’s name in vain. I have however, learned that even highly educated Catholics are completely unaware of it, until they actually look up the words.

 

[edwest2]

I really don’t understand it, though. I’m open to the idea that I may be wrong, and all vulgarity may be sinful. But I don’t know why, and I don’t know how we are to distinguish between acceptable words and unacceptable words.

How are we to do this, ed? Why are some words inherently sinful, while others aren’t?

Good questions. I would talk to a priest. I realize that some had parents that said almost anything around their kids. While growing up in the 1960s, I heard bad words, and I was instructed not to use them, so I understood and accepted the teaching I got. The nuns at our Catholic school told us to avoid using “gutter language.” So, even as a boy, I got it.

Peace,
Ed

 

[Kamaduck]

Excuse me for butting in. If I am in doubt, I check my old dictionary and a couple of online dictionaries. If the word is a Euphemism, it doesn’t detract from the original meaning. I do that because I am over particular with words and the modern dictionaries change the meaning, so words that were curses or taking the Lord’s name in vain for centuries have a changed meaning.

As I am from the UK, some of the language used in CAF is (to me) inappropriate as it is cursing or taking the Lord’s name in vain. I have however, learned that even highly educated Catholics are completely unaware of it, until they actually look up the words.

Sensible enough. I do like using words properly. That said, I’m not really seeing the harm of comparing things to excrement if we feel that it’s a valid comparison.

EDIT: I mean, I suppose I could just say “this game far less useful than human feces”, but that’s not idiomatic, and I’m not sure how it would be any different in terms of morality. :ehh: Although it might be an understatement in some cases.

Good questions. I would talk to a priest. I realize that some had parents that said almost anything around their kids. While growing up in the 1960s, I heard bad words, and I was instructed not to use them, so I understood and accepted the teaching I got. The nuns at our Catholic school told us to avoid using “gutter language.” So, even as a boy, I got it.

I’m the complete opposite of the kids without guidelines, hah. As noted earlier, my language was very strictly controlled as a kid (to the point of getting in trouble for “oh my goodness”, “rats”, or any use of the words “hate” and “weird”). Now that I’ve decided there’s nothing really objectionable about those words, I’m not sure if there’s anything objectively wrong with the other words that I dislike. I usually just prioritize clear communication and not offending people with my choice of words.

 

[Skye_Ariel]

I grew up thinking it was sinful partly because my Catholic school teachers always seemed to lump it under the Second Commandment and partly because my mom would wash my mouth out with soap if she ever heard me say one.

Thus I never developed the habit and so, even if I hit my hand with a hammer – which happens pretty much everytime I use a hammer – those just aren’t the words that are on the tip of my tongue. You’re looking at the guy who, in his high school English class, switched in the word “donkey” for that other word when reading Shakespeare in front of the class.

That said, when you think about it from a linguistic perspective, words pretty much only have meaning in so far as we ascribe meaning to them. And different languages have different “bad words.” I could say a cuss word in another language and it wouldn’t feel the same as saying one of the “bad” words in English.

In light of that, it’s hard for me to call such speech intrinsically sinful, though – of course – those words can be used in vulgar and/or angry ways which would be sinful by virtue of the vulgarity and/or anger.

If CAF has to replace the words with asterisks, I find it best to avoid using them.

I’ve noticed that too! Cuss words in other languages don’t feel like real cuss words.

Back when I went to school with mostly non-denominational protestants, I used to get in trouble for saying “rats”. We were taught that tossing any interjection into a sentence was sinful, apart from maybe “oh”, “wow”, and placeholders like “um”. The same held true of adjectives with negative (or no) meaning. Kids would regularly get in trouble for using the words “stupid”, “dumb”, “hate”, or “goodness”, among other things. Other parents would ridicule mine for using the occasional “shoot”. I rebelled a bit in third grade and began saying “what the mad cow disease are you talking about” at every opportunity, as mad cow disease was the most random thing I could think of. It never caught on, though.

So yeah, when I stepped outside that realm (and particularly when I started using the internet), I was appalled at the sorts of words that were bandied about. Nowadays, I don’t really mind it, provided it doesn’t interfere with basic sentence structure and isn’t used to insult individuals or groups of people. Quite honestly, I rather like being able to use the word cr*ppy to describe situations. I don’t do it terribly frequently, so I think it’s a fairly good way of making the extremeness of my opinion clear. I’ve occasionally used the word b—s—, although the instances could be counted on my fingers. I only use it for cases of extremely strong feeling that something or other is a harmful falsehood. Or once when I was playing a card game involving bluffing. Once.

I’ve even come to appreciate the much harder vulgarities that I would never personally use. They allow us to make it clear that the anger, frustration, and pain we are feeling are extreme. I believe that part of the reason that my school banned all replacement expletives is that it was banning negative feelings, attempting to require us to be happy. When you can’t say that you “hate” something, and are required to say that you “strongly dislike” it, it comes off as an attempt to invalidate your feelings and experiences. When circumstances are making us extremely unhappy, I think it’s acceptable to use words to express that emotion. I also think that it can be acceptable to use vulgarities as verbal shorthand for those feelings.

I would be interested in seeing any document that says otherwise- particularly one that explains how we would distinguish between truly “bad” words, such as the two censored ones above, and the harmless ones that the CAF censor does not block.

I do think that we should only use our words for constructive purposes. While using a vulgar word to convey extreme emotional pain could be constructive, cussing someone out wouldn’t be. I’ve always been pretty sure that using such words to attack or insult people is a sin (Shakespeare notwithstanding). I also do get annoyed when people use such words to convey something other than extreme emotion, and I do make an effort not to use any sort of vulgarity (including things that even I consider tame) around people who may be offended, since I want people to be comfortable around me. But even so, I’ve come to think that colorful metaphors have their uses.

**Very well said. Whenever a person uses an expletive because of frustration, anger, pain, shock etc, they are not promoting the use of the expletive, or the so called coarsening of our culture. They are merrily expressing the seriousness of their pain. **Even Michael Voris, the famous Catholic Apologist, used vulgarities (mainly Hll and Dmn), to express his anger for the things that are going wrong in the church or to prove a point. Though, I have to admit, I still have trouble of letting the profanity go though one ear and out the other in this instance. In other words, it still makes me feel uncomfortable and still makes it harder for me to overlook it. Its even worse when people use it gratuitously.

I agree with this and in those kinds of situations I don’t think it’s a sin especially for someone who never cusses. I remember my brother telling me about my sister-in-law, his wife, who never ever cusses, and he said how the first time he ever heard her use cuss words was when she was in labor with their daughter. That was the only time he heard her use cuss words, and he said she was surprised at her own self. LOL! In cases like that, I can understand if cuss words come out.

 

[NeedsMercy]

In this scenario what is the moral difference between the “f-bomb” and “ouch”?

Exactly! If you say “ouch” instead of the f-bomb, the “ouch” then becomes the “bad word”. Ditto “fudge” “shoot” etc.

 

[NeedsMercy]

And yes we do have instincts as rational animals otherwise a new born would starve to death or would not cry or you would not move your hand if you accidentally place it on top of hot burner on the stove. That being said, you may be right, you may be cussing out of bad character and not instinct, however the vocal response itself might be instinct, while the fact you drop the “f-bomb” instead of “ouch” is simply out of habit instead of bad character.

According to the Barron’s Dictionary of Modern Biology, “instinct” is defined as follows:

An involuntary response to an external stimulus. No prior experience is necessary for an animal to exhibit such a response. Instinctual behaviors tend to be the same in all individuals of a species and seem to be inherited. An example would be the annual upstream migration of salmon to spawn.

Thus, there is no “maternal instinct” in humans. If there were, police offices and hospitals would never find newborns on their doorsteps. Pulling one’s hand away from something hot is not an “instinct” but a physiological response to an external stimuli but I’m not getting into a biological argument with you.

Well, that is sad that you have bigger problems, hope you work on that. Maybe all those “little problems” you are having are adding up ?

I simply adore your condescension! Hope you work on that.

 

[Kay_Cee]

From St. Faustina’s Diary:

“At those times when I suffer much, I try to remain silent, as I do not trust my tongue which, at such moments, is inclined to talk for itself, while its duty is to help me praise God for all the blessings and gifts which He has given me.” (#92)

It seems to me our tongues should be used to praise God, not to spout expletives.

 

[iamcatholic100]

I would like to bring up a recent situation involving “Bad Words.” My brother was on the phone with a friend during dinner. Mom got impatient with both my brother and his friend and said to him “Tell him to shut the ***k up!!” Then my brother through his phone on the couch across the room. He then told mom that his friend heard that his friend told him to “shut the ***k up”. As they were having this colorful conversation, I began to feel uncomfortable, as well as having the body language of showing it to my mom and brother. Then, my brother looked at me in anger and said” And don’t give me that look! This is the way our lives are!! Deal with it!!” Later, my mom came up to my room and apologized to me for her language, and I forgave her.

 

[Viki63]

As a mother who has occasionally slipped up and sworn, I can sympathize with your mother. It’s great that she apologized and you and she are on good terms again.

Your brother is wrong when he says “This is the way our lives are!! Deal with it!”
Maybe that’s the way he chooses to live, but you don’t have to make the same choice.
I ran into the same thing at a playground where I was pushing my toddler in the swing, and a teenager was using foul language clearly audible to us. I said something about it to him, and his reply was, “We live in Delridge, what do you expect?” (Delridge is an area that’s considered low class, full of gangsta wannabes). Yeah, so that makes it okay for him to curse around my little girl?

The point is, you don’t have to let your environment determine your behavior. Sure, you can have a home full of swearing, anger and nasty comments, if that’s what you prefer.
Or your mother could have a home where the Lord is honored, people speak to one another in kindness and gentleness, and the F-word is avoided.
Take your choice. And ask your brother what he really prefers.

 

[IfYouLeadMe]

There are sooooo many wonderful adjectives out there in the English language, when people dumb themselves down and only ever use the f-word to describe anything and everything it gets really tiring.

I am definitely guilty of swearing, but I don’t do it too often (hope not anyway!)… One of my friends however, is starting to really go overboard, and she has been using blasphemy in the same sentence, which is starting to upset me… she’s so much better than that, but it’s become a real habit for her lately…