Baptism of an older child

[leelee]

Does a 10 year old child have to be baptized at Easter Vigil? Or can it be done at any other time?

 

[PatienceAndLove]

I am assuming that at this point, the 10 year old has gone through RCIC, and should probably be initiated into the Church with his “class”.

 

[Claire_from_DE]

The pastor could allow it to be done at another time but the Easter Vigil would be most appropriate. Also, for a child this age, Baptism, Confirmation, and Holy Eucharist are done at the same time.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Does a 10 year old child have to be baptized at Easter Vigil? Or can it be done at any other time?

According to the Norms, Yes. There may be some particular pastoral reason to consider another way but the integrety of the three Sacraments of Initiation must be kept together for a ten year old. It is because they are no longer considered infants. It may be possible for them to be celebrated on Easter day at a morning Mass if necessary. But normally those who are not infants are only Baptized and receive all three Sacraments at the Easter Vigil.

 

[ac_claire]

Does a 10 year old child have to be baptized at Easter Vigil? Or can it be done at any other time?

Easter Vigil may be the norm, but really- talk to your pastor about it. Depends on the circumstances of your case.

I was a little older- 15- when I was baptized, and I believe I did receive first Holy Communion the same day. I don’t know why the details are fuzzy, but I’m pretty sure it was in June or July. Confirmation was a year or so later w/ my regular class. I didn’t go through RCIA because I’d been raised as a Catholic up until then, all exept for the Eucharist, of course. I was taught to do a “spiritual communion” while my cousins went up to the altar to receive. It’s a long story.

But with older kids getting baptized, there is frequently a “long story” involved and the details change from case to case. Has the child been otherwise raised as Catholic?

 

[graceandglory]

According to the Norms, Yes. There may be some particular pastoral reason to consider another way but the integrety of the three Sacraments of Initiation must be kept together for a ten year old. It is because they are no longer considered infants. It may be possible for them to be celebrated on Easter day at a morning Mass if necessary. But normally those who are not infants are only Baptized and receive all three Sacraments at the Easter Vigil.

That seems to be the norm. I am a single mom and a Catholic revert. I wanted my children to be baptized as soon as possible. That ended up taking a year and a half from when I asked until they could receive instruction and then the Sacraments at Easter Vigil.
I was concerned, as I wanted them baptized and receiving the Eucharist. Our priest told me that they had had the “baptism of desire,” which was good until they could receive the Sacrament completely.

Hmmm. I’ll have to check into that. The “baptism of desire.” Is that really such a valid idea?

 

[graceandglory]

Hmmm. I’ll have to check into that. The “baptism of desire.” Is that really such a valid idea?

Somehow “baptism of desire” doesn’t really seem to capture the essence of my children. As much as I love them, they don’t seem to be that spiritually mature.

I’m not sure if children whose parents want them to be baptized really qualifies here. So that makes me wonder about the wisdom of making children wait so long for the Sacrament.

They’re covered now, but what would have happened to their souls if something had happened in their unbaptized state?

(1) The Baptism of Desire

**The baptism of desire (baptismus flaminis) is a perfect contrition of heart, and every act of perfect charity or pure love of God which contains, at least implicitly, a desire (votum) of baptism. The Latin word flamen is used because Flamen is a name for the Holy Ghost, **Whose special office it is to move the heart to love God and to conceive penitence for sin. The “baptism of the Holy Ghost” is a term employed in the third century by the anonymous author of the book “De Rebaptismate”. The efficacy of this baptism of desire to supply the place of the baptism of water, as to its principal effect, is proved from the words of Christ. After He had declared the necessity of baptism (John 3), He promised justifying grace for acts of charity or perfect contrition (John 14): “He that loveth Me, shall be loved of my Father: and I will love him and will manifest myself to him.” And again: “If any one love me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him, and will make our abode with him.” Since these texts declare that justifying grace is bestowed on account of acts of perfect charity or contrition, it is evident that these acts supply the place of baptism as to its principal effect, the remission of sins. This doctrine is set forth clearly by the Council of Trent. In the fourteenth session (cap. iv) the council teaches that contrition is sometimes perfected by charity, and reconciles man to God, before the Sacrament of Penance is received. In the fourth chapter of the sixth session, in speaking of the necessity of baptism, it says that men can not obtain original justice “except by the washing of regeneration or its desire” (voto). The same doctrine is taught by Pope Innocent III (cap. Debitum, iv, De Bapt.), and the contrary propositions are condemned by Popes Pius V and Gregory XII, in proscribing the 31st and 33rd propositions of Baius.

We have already alluded to the funeral oration pronounced by St. Ambrose over the Emperor Valentinian II, a catechumen. The doctrine of the baptism of desire is here clearly set forth. St. Ambrose asks: “Did he not obtain the grace which he desired? Did he not obtain what he asked for? Certainly he obtained it because he asked for it.” St. Augustine (IV, De Bapt., xxii) and St. Bernard (Ep. lxxvii, ad H. de S. Victore) likewise discourse in the same sense concerning the baptism of desire. If it be said that this doctrine contradicts the universal law of baptism made by Christ (John 3), the answer is that the lawgiver has made an exception (John 14) in favor of those who have the baptism of desire. Neither would it be a consequence of this doctrine that a person justified by the baptism of desire would thereby be dispensed from seeking after the baptism of water when the latter became a possibility. For, as has already been explained the baptismus flaminis contains the votum of receiving the baptismus aquæ. It is true that some of the Fathers of the Church arraign severely those who content themselves with the desire of receiving the sacrament of regeneration, but they are speaking of catechumens who of their own accord delay the reception of baptism from unpraiseworthy motives.** Finally, it is to be noted that only adults are capable of receiving the baptism of desire. **

newadvent.org/cathen/02258b.htm

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

That seems to be the norm. I am a single mom and a Catholic revert. I wanted my children to be baptized as soon as possible. That ended up taking a year and a half from when I asked until they could receive instruction and then the Sacraments at Easter Vigil.
I was concerned, as I wanted them baptized and receiving the Eucharist. Our priest told me that they had had the “baptism of desire,” which was good until they could receive the Sacrament completely.

Hmmm. I’ll have to check into that. The “baptism of desire.” Is that really such a valid idea?

That is correct. Because your child went through the Rite of Acceptance in their child’s version of RCIA they were officially considered Catechumens during their preparation. Any Catechumen who suddenly dies before being able to be Baptized is considered to have received “Baptism of Desire” because they professed their desire for Baptism in the Rite of Acceptance.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Somehow “baptism of desire” doesn’t really seem to capture the essence of my children. As much as I love them, they don’t seem to be that spiritually mature.

I’m not sure if children whose parents want them to be baptized really qualifies here. So that makes me wonder about the wisdom of making children wait so long for the Sacrament.

They’re covered now, but what would have happened to their souls if something had happened in their unbaptized state?

newadvent.org/cathen/02258b.htm

Remember that any child of Catechetical Age is considered an “adult” by Church law.

 

[graceandglory]

That is correct. Because your child went through the Rite of Acceptance in their child’s version of RCIA they were officially considered Catechumens during their preparation. Any Catechumen who suddenly dies before being able to be Baptized is considered to have received “Baptism of Desire” because they professed their desire for Baptism in the Rite of Acceptance.

My kids didn’t go through anything like that. I had to homeschool them their Sacrament Prep. They went to a Catholic school at the time (zealous convert that I was), but received no catechesis there.:nope:

So my kids were never given the opportunity to “profess the desire for Baptism.” They were 4 and 11 at the time. This is the first time I’ve ever heard of it.

But like I said earlier, they are baptized now, and are covered, only thing is, I think I have found a gap in the teaching and practice of our Church when it comes to children converts.

 

[graceandglory]

Remember that any child of Catechetical Age is considered an “adult” by Church law.

Do you know what “Catechetical age is?”

 

[cameron_lansing]

Do you know what “Catechetical age is?”

Before the completion of the seventh year a minor is called an infant and is held to be incompetent. With the completion of the seventh year one is presumed to have the use of reason. (c.97 §2).

The prescripts of the canons on adult baptism are to be applied to all those who, no longer infants, have attained the use of reason (c. 852§1).

Therefore, the rites of Christian initiation make special catechetical provision for these older children, and their initiation involves Baptism, Confirmation and Eucharist.

By contrast, infants are only baptized in the Latin Church, and their parents and sponsors receive the catechesis or instruction.

In the Eastern Churches, infants are baptized, chrismated with Holy Myhrr (confirmation), and receive Eucharist.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

My kids didn’t go through anything like that. I had to homeschool them their Sacrament Prep. They went to a Catholic school at the time (zealous convert that I was), but received no catechesis there.:nope:

So my kids were never given the opportunity to “profess the desire for Baptism.” They were 4 and 11 at the time. This is the first time I’ve ever heard of it.

But like I said earlier, they are baptized now, and are covered, only thing is, I think I have found a gap in the teaching and practice of our Church when it comes to children converts.

The 4 yo would be Baptized as an infant and Catechized as they grew up, Received the First Recinciliation, First Holy Communion and Confirmation at the appointed times. The 11 YO should have gone through the RCIA for children and received all three Sacraments together normally. I’m happy that they are now all Baptized.

 

[John_Lilburne]

Does a 10 year old child have to be baptized at Easter Vigil? Or can it be done at any other time?

It can be done at another time. In danger of death it can be done at any other time.
From the Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults, in the section “Christian Initiation of Children Who Have Reached Catechetical Age” it has:
“280 In order to bring out the paschal character of baptism, celebration of the sacraments of initiation should preferably take place at the Easter Vigil or on a Sunday, the day that the Church devotes to the remembrance of Christ’s resurrection (see Rite of Baptism for Children, Introduction, no. 9). But the provisions of no. 246 should also guide the choice of time for the celebration of the sacraments of initiation.”

In 246 it has the preference for the Easter Vigil, but then:
“… Celebration at this time must also be consistent with the programme of catechetical instruction they are receiving, since the candidates should, if possible, come to the sacraments of initiation at the time that their baptised companions are to receive confirmation or eucharist.”

The RCIA introductions for England and Wales are at catholic-ew.org.uk/liturgy/Resources/Rites/RiteRitual.html#RCIA . The USA edition has different paragraph numbers to those above. In the USA edition n. 280 above is n. 304, and 246 above is n. 256. (The Rites Volume One, Liturgical Press, 1990, ISBN: 0-8146-6015-0, page 171).

 

[puzzleannie]

Does a 10 year old child have to be baptized at Easter Vigil? Or can it be done at any other time?

the norm is to receive unbaptized adults (anyone over age 7) in to the Church at the Easter Vigil, with Baptism, Confirmation and First Communion at the same time. That is what the RCIA provides for. If there is a good pastoral reason they can be done at another time, but there is no exception in the RCIA that allows baptism w/o confirmation

 

[graceandglory]

.** If there is a good pastoral reason they can be done at another time**, but there is no exception in the RCIA that allows baptism w/o confirmation

I’m fine with how things happened with my children. Thankfully, nothing catastrophic happened while they were waiting for baptism.

What would a “good pastoral reason” be?
To me, I think raising 10 and 11 year old twin boys without Sacramental graces was a good enough reason!