Baptist Blasts Catholics pt 1 of 5

[Lisa4Catholics]

eleusis:

So can you point out what the differences are? He says the protestant churches only differ on ‘minor’ issues vice the Catholic biggies. However, I know that is a crock because there wouldn’t be the explosion of various churches if there really was no major differences. I am doing my own reading in Handbook of Denominations but it doesn’t go into enough details.

I took the advice I got on this thread and am dogging him on the concept of Sola Scriptaura and its fallacy in practice among Baptists and he has suddenly fallen silent and scooted out yesterday early from work.

Thank you to all of you for your assistance it appears we are making some dents in this guy’s “holier than catholics” attitude.

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

Great! I have been praying about that. Listen I can’t remember what I sent you, if you send me a list of what you have I will see if I have anymore things that would be helpful.God Bless,Lisa

 

[Wil_Peregrin]

There seem to be an awful lot of subjects here.

The first thing I would say is “blasting bad”.

I would suggest trying to understand what each other believes, before debating doctrine. The history of the past 5 centuries from the Marburg Colloquy to ECT has been one of serious failure to communicate.

 

[Katholikos]

eleusis wrote:

So can you point out what the differences are? He says the protestant churches only differ on ‘minor’ issues vice the Catholic biggies. However, I know that is a crock because there wouldn’t be the explosion of various churches if there really was no major differences. I am doing my own reading in Handbook of Denominations but it doesn’t go into enough details.

I have acquired a long list of differences over time, but still it’s incomplete. I’ll start a new thread, since this topic comes up frequently. You can copy the list from there. Yep, these differences are ‘minor’ – they only involve such issues as man’s salvation, so that’s nothing serious.

God be with you. Jay

 

[Panis_Angelicas]

eleusis:

I took the advice I got on this thread and am dogging him on the concept of Sola Scriptaura and its fallacy in practice among Baptists and he has suddenly fallen silent and scooted out yesterday early from work.

Thank you to all of you for your assistance it appears we are making some dents in this guy’s “holier than catholics” attitude.

Hot diggity!
Good for you…remember, like a bulldog!
And please be sure to remind him how the Bible came into being:
That the early Catholic Church wrote all the New Testament, that in the 4th Century, the Catholic Church decided which writings were inspired and which were not, that the Catholic Church then combined the New Testatment inspired writings with the Old Testament writings and called it The Bible…that the Catholic Church then hand copied the Bible for another 1,200 years by candlelight in monasteries until the invention of the printing press in the 1500’s, and the first book off the press: The Catholic Bible!

Sad that our protestant brothers and sisters have a book that’s been altered and deleted by men, that they follow doctrines invented by men (not found in the Bible, and even contrary to Scripture, as is Sola Scriptura, for the Bible tells us that the Church is the pillar and foundation of Truth, not the Scriptures.)

And, as Katholikos often reminds, The Bible came from the Catholic Church, the Church didn’t come from the Bible (as all other denominations have!)

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Christian4life:

Very offended and scared that he said Methodists and Baptists were brothers. Umm…my father-in-law is a Baptist preacher, he preaches right across the street from a Methodist church, and if you’d ever been there and seen the Methodists come out of church and glare at us, while we’re waving and saying hi to them, you’d know for darn sure we aren’t brothers.

OTOH - only brothers can hate each other really bitterly: which is why we hate Protestants and they hate us and we both hate the Orthodox and they hate both of us. Because we all are brothers in Christ ​

He has dedicated men put up signs that say Christ is Born!, while the Methodists are putting up their Happy Holidays signs. HUGE difference.

 

[Malachi4U]

Christian4life:

…He has dedicated men put up signs that say Christ is Born!, while the Methodists are putting up their Happy Holidays signs. HUGE difference.

eleusis,

There is a chasim of difference here.

‘Happy Holidays’ is a statement that has taken Christ out of Christmass. We now just have Santa Claus and presents.(Oh yea, not to mention the parties and booze!:dancing: ) I work in the Government and can be reprimanded for saying “Merry Christmass!” Happy Holidays is a politically correct statement that takes out God.

‘Christ is Born’ is a phrase that reminds of the birth of Christ our saviour, the Master. It keeps Christ in the mass and preserves Christmass as a celebration of our Lord. Christ is Born keeps God at the forefront of our holidays.

This season, instead of saying “thank you”, say “God Bless you”. I say this now and the reaction from people is wonderfull. Try it out. I don’t say it at work as I need to put food on the table and pay for my next trip to Vegas. But I do use it now outside of work. Being a “Born Again Catholic” has brought me to Christ in the clossest possible relationship a living being can have with Him. Praise God! I found His Church before it was too late.

 

[Malachi4U]

eleusis:

…**2) You often refer to Luther’s desire to weed out James. That is true but the fact that it was not taken out only illustrates that God not Luther or any other man is in control of His word **

Seems to me that Luthers Bible is still missing James and other books today. True other editors put some books back into OTHER VERSIONS but not all. I still recall the NKJV only has 66 books, down from the 73 Luther started with and plagerized. Your friend needs to learn the truth. If he knows it he is just writting a missleading statement here. Baptists do that you know?**
**Do you really believe that because that because a Methodist and a Baptist have differences on secondary items like the mode of baptism or how the government of the church should be practiced that we are not one. That is where you talk out of ignorance. My Methodist brethren and I are one because we accept Jesus gift of salvation on his terms and not ours. You mentioned Sunday that about what is the big picture and the big picture is how one gathers a right relationship with God. Protestant believes clearly it is by Grace through faith. The Universal Catholic (and all that means is universal) Church is one. When the rapture happens every believer that has placed his trust only in the death of the Lord Jesus to cleanse him from his sin will be part of this event****Boy, wish I had more room here. I may need your email to send a full reply. So, make him tell you what exactly Methodists and Baptists do agree on. I doubt he knows but it will cause him to do some research. I know Baptist preachers that say only Baptists go to heaven! They condemn the Methodists along with the Catholics. There is another thread here talking of this very issue. So, are the Jehovah Witnesses saved? Mormons? SDA’s? Those at Jonestown that drank the koolaid? What about the followers of Koresch (sp) at Waco? As we drift into protestant sects we drift away from the Church that CHrist established with His authority on earth (Mt 16:18-19). Will the NAZI guards who were Christians and helped toss Jews and Catholics into the ovens be saved? Or are they allready saved since once saved allways saved? (OK, Hitler was a baptized Catholic but he got Reformed too and left the Catholic Church and then persecuted it!)

 

[Malachi4U]

Peter not the leader

3)There is nothing in scripture that indicates the Paul was considered head of the Apostle. In fact when the Jerusalem counsel met it was James not Peter who served as the spokesman when the decision at to whether Gentile needed to follow Jesus custom.

Mt 16:18-19, Does that ring a bell? I would recommend you stay on one issue. The fact that he just retorts sound bites means is not studying or researching. Get Him to study history and the Church Fathers. To study history is to become Catholic. About 500 protestant ministers a year become Catholic mainly from the study of History and Sacred Scripture.

**Of course you do not address the issue you just use rhetoric. James not Peter was the chief spokesman during the Council which determined what responsibilities Gentiles had when they entered the body of Christ. It is unfathomable that Peter would have not rendered this cornerstone opinion if he was in fact the Chief Apostle. Peter is not even the principal character of the Books of Acts. Paul has supremacy and dominates the recounting of the early church. Your point about Jesus not writing is ridiculous. He did not baptize anyone either but we do not denigrate what baptism symbolizes. **Where is it clear in scripture that Peter was the head? Only Peter had the authority to bind and loosen. You are not practicing sound exegesis when you state belief. When Jesus gives the Apostle the charge for the Great Commission in Matthews 28:18-20 no sane and perceptive person believes that this commission was only meant for the Apostle. No, they properly understand this charge for every believer. It is not only the Apostle responsibility to make disciples it is every believer responsibility. So, when you lay Jesus’s charge to Peter being given the keys and make it only applies to Peter you are not rightly dividing the word. Why is that we understand when Jesus was speaking in Chapter 28 although He was talking to the Apostle it was meant for every believer but when He spoke to Peter it meant him only. That is not consistent and how do you pick and choose. You choose when it benefits you own propaganda. Logic tells me that every believer is charged to make disciples even though He said specifically said it to the Apostle. The same system applies when Jesus spoke to Peter in Chapter 16

So, being the spokesman at ONE council makes you the boss? I was an Executive Officer in the Army. I ran the meetings and the Commander just interjected when he needed to. He was the boss but I was the ramrod that got things done - with his authority of course. As I recall even the KJV says to remain loyal to the leaders, your friend reads the Bible but he does not ‘see’ what he reads. I imagine someday they’ll delete those verses too for being too Catholic? Why did the Master have apostles if it was not to establish leadership? If we are each a teacher then we do not need preachers! Your friends logic is lacking to say the least. Be polite to him though and correct him with love in your heart for him.

 

[eleusis]

Malachi4U:
Boy, wish I had more room here. I may need your email to send a full reply. So, make him tell you what exactly Methodists and Baptists do agree on.
Sir,
I can be reached via the links to my email address. I don’t want to post it openly because I get spammed horribly whenever I do that on other forums. There are programs that comb through forums grabbing emails.

I look forward to anything you may have. I have done the research and found the baptist methodist differences are quite stark but I am having difficulty articulating the differences properly for full impact to refute his assertion. I’ll send you my draft letter.

I think though that I am going to continue to hammer “sola scriptaura” as the weak link since that advice really makes sense.
Have a merry Christmas.